The Downward mobility or evolution of magic

Jun 13, 2013
72
19
I have been developing recently new effects for my show and I have been gaining insight from past magicians from Tommy Wonder to Blackstone and even more recent magicians like Dan White. Something I have noticed or think I have noticed is a trend in magic today that I'm not sure is a good thing but perhaps it is and I just have a different opinion. So naturally, I would like to start a topic on the evolution of magic over the years.

I was watching the other day a street magician perform an effect for a spectator, the quarter bite. What I found that i didn't like was how they came up to the spectator asked to show them something, borrow a quarter, bite it, restore it and leave. it made me realize how much I can dislike the presentation aspect of street magic in that context. Then there are the youtube magicians, who spend countless hours on the g.o.a.t. change, the pass, and snap changes that they will never use other than to make that one video showing their perceived prowess. What ever happened to justification?

This is where my thoughts have come in. How can you perform a bit of magic that for all intensive purposes is just pointless and lacking any reason. A quarter bite can be a very powerful bit of magic that should not be performed randomly for someone and leaving them without so much as another thought. Maskelyne and Devant in their book Our Magic talk about the necessity of justification. If you cannot justify the effect then it is not worth the effort. I have found personally this has improved my performances and my creation of effects. I feel as though magic is following a trend of the shock magic or the for the sake of the effect. To throw the reason out and make nothing more than a puzzle. If you have ever played the game of snaps it easily can become "magical" if presented with purpose and it becomes a pointless piece of 'show off skills' with out purpose. I want to see more magicians striving for the "hero" persona not the "god" that I believe Banachek talks about. A Magician should not come across as the instigator of some otherworldly power that they alone have but as a person who understand just enough, that gives plausibility to an effect and increases the justification as well.

I could go on for a while but I hope my point has come across. What are your thoughts? Do you see a trend in the pointless cool effects or the downward mobility of magic or am I just missing something and pining for a bygone era?
 

Josh Burch

Elite Member
Aug 11, 2011
2,966
1,101
Utah
You know, I had a similar feeling with Shin Lim's Penn and Teller performance. I wasn't entertained. I know it goes against most opinion on his performance but I really lost interest. On the other hand I found this video of David Williamson and was in tears.


One magician was really good and the other was a complete master in my opinion.
 
Jun 3, 2015
128
47
36
Lake District, UK
One of the things that I think is a real issue is the culture of instant gratification. You mentioned Youtube and street performers and I think they are symptoms of this issue. I'm not saying all street magicians are bad but in the example you gave the guy could have bought the trick that morning, tried it out once and then gone out to perform it, instant gratification. Youtube guys have to worry about only one angle, usually put no effort into their "performance" but share it on twitter/facebook/wherever and again there is instant gratification.

[sarcasm]Given the need for instant gratification, why would anyone put the effort in to create a performance? I've got a gimmick that when seen once by a person will get a "wow"/"holy .."/etc, after that I can walk away and find someone else to show it, lather, rinse, repeat. For what crazy reason would I put the time and effort into creating a character, giving the trick a purpose and presenting a work of art when for zero effort I can still get a reaction and the praise that I so desperately crave?[/sarcasm]
 

RealityOne

Elite Member
Nov 1, 2009
3,744
4,076
New Jersey
At the amateur level, it has always been about the trick. Unfortunately, I've seen way to many professionals where it has become the same. I've left too many magic shows where I felt I was bombarded by tricks without any presentation or personality.

Masklyne and Devant knew it was all about the presentation. The greats like Kellar, Hermann and Blackstone knew it was about the spectacle. Henning knew it was about amazement. Copperfield knew the power of the narrative.

Don't dispair. There are folks like Jeff McBride, Eugune Burger and Robert Neale. Read Larry Haas's Transformations and Ken Weber's Maximum Entertainment.

Ultimately, those who understand what it means to develop a presentation piece can easily distinguish themselves from those magicians doing tricks.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Josh Burch
Jun 13, 2013
72
19
I full agree that as our culture makes things more accessible we create in turn people who want it now. Thanks for the video Josh, great example of trans-formative magic.

Since it seems like the you tube generation is all about the here and now I have another postulate to throw out there. At one point is selling magic to the masses useful and at what point does it become your way of income for the sake of an extra buck? I get that some people are very creative and not great performers so they make magic for others. But when I look around at the literal thousands of magic effects that have been released in the last few years I cant help but wonder how much better the magic community would be if those effects were not out there.

By the way RealityOne, I love Transformations. I got it in New York and still read it over and over.
 

RealityOne

Elite Member
Nov 1, 2009
3,744
4,076
New Jersey
But when I look around at the literal thousands of magic effects that have been released in the last few years I cant help but wonder how much better the magic community would be if those effects were not out there.

Let's see, in the last year I purchased a set of Proline linking rings, a Lynette Welch egg bag, a custom made Devil's Handkerchief, an Omni Deck, a copy of Encyclopedia of Sponge Ball Magic and Eugene Burger's Experience of Magic. What thousands of new effects?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Josh Burch

Justin.Morris

Elite Member
Aug 31, 2007
2,793
888
Canada
www.morrismagic.ca
Lots of good thoughts here. With regards to justification, I think it's hard. I love doing and watching magic that accomplishes something, solves a problem, makes a statement, or helps someone. I just think it's interesting to me - so I love shows like T.H.E.M. or the recent Carbonaro Effect for example.
However I also love stuff like the David Williamson clip above (what's the justification for getting coins from kids or making a raccoon fly through the air to catch a card?) Some things are impossible and make great magic.

David Copperfield made great strides by giving his magic context (like a movie plot). So the theme had purpose, and might justify certain effects, but not every effect specifically has purpose, but it can still be extremely entertaining and enjoyable.

Context, Justification, and purpose can enhance magic for sure, but magic as entertainment hasn't always had a lot of this historically until fairly recently. (Outside of entertainment it existed in cults/religions, fortune tellers, pick pockets, card cheats, and mediums etc) So I don't know if it's a downward spiral more than just the continuing flux. Magic evolved because of strong performers, but that style may die with them unless others decide to pick up where they left off.

I know magic can be very entertaining and amazing WITHOUT a big story or reason. It is also amazing with these elements. I personally enjoy these elements and will continue to add them to my shows and close up. But sometimes it's fun to just do spongeballs for the sake of the pure enjoyment people get from them.

Thoughts?
 

RealityOne

Elite Member
Nov 1, 2009
3,744
4,076
New Jersey
I know magic can be very entertaining and amazing WITHOUT a big story or reason. It is also amazing with these elements. I personally enjoy these elements and will continue to add them to my shows and close up. But sometimes it's fun to just do spongeballs for the sake of the pure enjoyment people get from them.

Of course. There is a multi-phase Bannon routine from Six.Impossible.Things. that gets great reactions for me using a very untypical say-do-see patter. Contrast that with Bannon's new book Destination Zero which is self-working effects that (having only worked through the first half) just leave me feeling flat -- merely because it is a bunch of pick a card / find a card variations which Bannon admits he just "narrates the adventures of the props." Don't get me wrong, Bannon is a genius and master card guy, but repetition of that sort of presentation really doesn't entertain anyone but other magicians.

It seems that there is a disconnect between material that is made for people performing for friends and strangers (i.e. accosting people in the park) and material that is made for professional performers. The stuff for friends and strangers needs to keep their attention for 10 minutes, the stuff for professionals needs to keep their attention for 45 minutes to an hour. Now there is some crossover in the props and effects BUT the presentation seems to be completely different. The key difference being is that the stuff for friends and strangers is quick, visual and requires no presentation or personality. The stuff for professionals requires that you entertain with your presentation and personality. Those routines have some more substance, more phases and an ability to build a presentation around it. Even table hoping, the effects might be the same as the friends and strangers effects, but a successful table performance engages wiht personality and presentation.

Unfortunately, I've seen too many professionals who just perform tricks. Oh look a bowling ball from a pad of paper -- why? -- because they can. Look, I'm dancing with a floating table (violating Losander's first rule that you and the table don't move at the same time), not once, not twice but three times -- why? -- because they can (seriously, you could get a better reaction with the table floating 6 inches off the ground as part of a Dead or Alive test).

In his book Maximum Entertainment, Ken Weber talks about how magicians get excited about a method but sepectators don't really get to see the method so they can't be excited. In my view, magicians get excited about the conditions - can the card be signed? can the spectator shuffle the deck? can you borrow the coin? is the bottle examinable? do you end clean? Spectators don't care! If you entertain them, they don't care about the method because they enjoy the illusion. Most magic releases have been applying old methods to new objects or refining existing plots. I would bet that you could pick 10 new effects and I could duplicate them to the audience's satisfaction using naterials published prior to 1960.
 
Jun 13, 2013
72
19
Let's see, in the last year I purchased a set of Proline linking rings, a Lynette Welch egg bag, a custom made Devil's Handkerchief, an Omni Deck, a copy of Encyclopedia of Sponge Ball Magic and Eugene Burger's Experience of Magic. What thousands of new effects?




LETTERS By Nubz Magic

PYO by Dee Christopher


Awesome Self Working Card Tricks by Big Blind Media
BLADES "Gold Edition" Deck by Handlordz

ELF (Electronic Light Flash) by CIGMA Magic
Impale (DVD and Gimmicks) by Jason Yu and Nicholas Lawrence

Paradigm Shift by Joe Rindfleisch

Hypno-no By Scott Xavier
Deceived by Michael Connolly
GUMMY
Cease by AT Duy
Change Box by AT Duy
ELF (Electronic Light Flash) by CIGMA Magic
The Bullet by Todd Lamanske

Antigravity by James Paul
Genuine Half-Dollar Ring (8.5/18.53 mm)By Diamond Jim Tyl
Genuine Half-Dollar Ring (8/18.19 mm)By Diamond Jim Tyler
Cube 3 By Steven Brundage
Impossible Deck (V1) by Yif
Single Needle -Houchin

Joe Rindfleisch's Rainbow Rubber Bands

Elastraflex - .50 Oz Bottle by Joe Rindfleisch
Phantom by Peter Eggink
Cube 3 By Steven Brundage
Hypnosis the Gist
Tom Mullica LIVE
Instant Print (Jumbo) by Uday
Six Card Repeat (Jumbo) by Uday
POCKET MINDS
Card in Wallet By VanBien)
Return to Oz by Justin Miller)
M.O.R.F. by Tatko
Brain Play - The Basic Version By Bazz
Osterlind's 13 Steps: Step 11: Q&A Routines
(along with all the other osterlind 13 steps releases)
Shuttle Spread Control By Alexander Anthony
The Blind Faith Collection by Abhinav & AJ
Stories from the Life of a Magician By Stephen Ablett
Kiss- Houchin

Everything I know about being a Children's Entertainer By Stephen Ablett
Pyro Adam Wilbur
Iris Llyod Barns
Fly Geriant Clark
The Seer
Pegasus
Change Llyod Barns
Verve
Moves Daniel Madison
Surge
City prediction by soma
Method Steve Palmer
Mishbehavin' Kaino Harbottle
Surface Madison
Return to Oz, Justin Miller
Revolution Greg Wilson
Coffe shop magic Greg wilson
Stay Cool
The Informant


I can keep going on, and these have been released since the beginning of this year. I am not saying these effects are bad for being released, but the sheer volume of effects that are released to me is ridiculous. Perhaps not thousands but I would not be surprised
Unfortunately, I've seen too many professionals who just perform tricks. Oh look a bowling ball from a pad of paper -- why? -- because they can. Look, I'm dancing with a floating table (violating Losander's first rule that you and the table don't move at the same time), not once, not twice but three times -- why? -- because they can (seriously, you could get a better reaction with the table floating 6 inches off the ground as part of a Dead or Alive test).

In his book Maximum Entertainment, Ken Weber talks about how magicians get excited about a method but sepectators don't really get to see the method so they can't be excited. In my view, magicians get excited about the conditions - can the card be signed? can the spectator shuffle the deck? can you borrow the coin? is the bottle examinable? do you end clean? Spectators don't care! If you entertain them, they don't care about the method because they enjoy the illusion. Most magic releases have been applying old methods to new objects or refining existing plots. I would bet that you could pick 10 new effects and I could duplicate them to the audience's satisfaction using naterials published prior to 1960.

I think there is definitely a difference between an effect designed to work for a showman and professional and an effect designed for a party trick you do for your friends once. The later usually requires very little skill or presentation. If you look at other art forms you do not get very far by just tinkering with basics unless you have some kind of showmanship. Even if you only learn three chords on a guitar you could become a great performer off of so little. The problem in magic is the effect can still be impressive even though the skill is not. Is that bad?

I know magic can be very entertaining and amazing WITHOUT a big story or reason. It is also amazing with these elements. I personally enjoy these elements and will continue to add them to my shows and close up. But sometimes it's fun to just do spongeballs for the sake of the pure enjoyment people get from them.

Thoughts?

I think it is perfectly fine to just do something like sponge balls for the sake of fun, BUT I think that is valid justification as well. I think the question comes back to showman ship. You can perform magic for fun, no reason but yet if you are not a performer with some pizzazz or showmanship, you fall flat. My question now becomes is there a lack of showmanship in the magic community today and is it being encouraged by the way many effects are released and the lack of accountability by other magicians?
 

RealityOne

Elite Member
Nov 1, 2009
3,744
4,076
New Jersey
I think what David meant was that he doesn't care what comes out each year. He pays attention to the tried and true

Exactly.

My question now becomes is there a lack of showmanship in the magic community today and is it being encouraged by the way many effects are released and the lack of accountability by other magicians?

Yes. That is confirmed every day when I get an e-mail saying you can perform a miracle instantly with no practice required... right out of the box. Just think of all the time I've wasted practicing my routines :)

Ultimately, the more important question is does it matter? Those who understand showmanship will suceed far beyond those who do not. Simply put, it just makes my magic stand out even more. As for those that become interested in showmanship, there will always be those who are willing to help them turn their tricks into performance peices.
 
Jun 13, 2013
72
19
I think what David meant was that he doesn't care what comes out each year. He pays attention to the tried and true
Thats good, as he should, I was getting more at the lack of a filter in the magic world for the usefulness of the release of effects. Isn't it our job as a magic community to tailor and groom up coming magicians? That's great that it will help those who seek showmanship stand out but at the cost of allowing others to be sub par? Of course there are those that choose to be in that later category and that is there call but what about the ones who just don't know the difference because there is no mentor relationship?

I bring this up because for myself I grew up learning magic on my own in the middle of no where in Minnesota. For eight years of my magic career I spent alone and isolated not by choice. My first interaction with other magicians was a bunch of arrogant men who could care less that I was in this art form and only wanted to sell their crap to me to make a profit. There are great performers out there and in this forum there are very wise ones. But the number of those versus the other end of the spectrum is too large of a gap for my liking.

Ultimately, the more important question is does it matter? Those who understand showmanship will succeed far beyond those who do not. Simply put, it just makes my magic stand out even more. As for those that become interested in showmanship, there will always be those who are willing to help them turn their tricks into performance pieces.

I think it does matter to some extent, how do those who understand showmanship learn it? Sure, its a talent and skill that you can have or not have. I come from a performance family so for me, I learned good showmanship from them. But what about those who need good direction? Its not that they don't know good showmanship its that they don't have a guide and are too young to just "know" they can be so easily (and I think have been) be led astray. I think this does have a negative effect on the magic community and it can encourage the barrage of effects released today.
 
I have to agree with you. As R1 pointed out at an amateur level it has always been about the trick. Sadly there's enough professionals out there that push that same ideology, and they should know better.

It doesn't matter what the trick is, the power is in the presentation. Period. As an entertainer we must first answer two big questions for our audiences. "What am I looking at?" and "Why should I care?" Without emotional investment in what we are doing our magic degrades itself automatically from wonder to puzzles.

Funny enough I was speaking with a new student of magic only yesterday and they were asking me what kind of sleights they should learn because they had been looking at a bunch of youtube stuff. I told them you really only need six or so. One or two forces, a pass, a palm, a false shuffle, a false cut, top and bottom control, and a double or tripple lift. You don't -need- to know all that knuckle busting, angle sensitive stuff to be a working pro. You just need to know what works for you and how to be entertaining in the process.
 
Jun 13, 2013
72
19
It doesn't matter what the trick is, the power is in the presentation. Period. As an entertainer we must first answer two big questions for our audiences. "What am I looking at?" and "Why should I care?" Without emotional investment in what we are doing our magic degrades itself automatically from wonder to puzzles.

This has been my new area of work on my current tricks. Which does come back to justification, but the why is a very important question. I think it is avoided because we know the answer many times, there is no why with a particular effect it just looks good. There are some effects that I have tabled for now because, I can't justify a good enough reason to do it (they are also not my greatest effects either). Its the same reason why I don't perform a floating table, I have no reason other than it looks cool and its a levitation.
 
Searching...
{[{ searchResultsCount }]} Results