Pyris

r29

Jan 23, 2008
29
0
So guys i just bought Pyris today practiced a little the guy at my shop give me few tips on coin switching. Heres my question for those of you that have it or don't i'm complete new to coin magic been doing mostly card magic so i'm wondering if any of you can give me tips on coin switch or even tips on how i should do the trick like angles or anything i need to know. Thanks ahead of time for any tips
 
Dec 2, 2007
62
0
So guys i just bought Pyris today practiced a little the guy at my shop give me few tips on coin switching. Heres my question for those of you that have it or don't i'm complete new to coin magic been doing mostly card magic so i'm wondering if any of you can give me tips on coin switch or even tips on how i should do the trick like angles or anything i need to know. Thanks ahead of time for any tips

First let me start by saying I don't own Pyris, nor do I know the method. So speaking from a view point of just switching one half dollar sized coin for another, here are a few rambling options ordered from easy to difficult:

  • Bobo Switch - Classic. Fairly easy to master. (Page 10 of J.B. Bobo's "New Modern Coin Magic" book.) This is a two handed switch. Angles are pretty good all around. It appears that the coin is thrown from one hand to the other.
  • The Shuttle pass - Found on page 10 of David Roth's "Expert Coin Magic". Has many variations, such as the "Reverse Shuttle Pass", "Half Shuttle Pass" and the "Shuttle Pass From The Lap". Other magician's have their own variations, which are too numerous to mention. It appears that the coin is taken from the palm of one hand, into the fingertips of the other.
  • Roth's Palm Change - "Expert Coin Magic" page 12. This is a one-handed change, with good angles. Can be done on the "off beat". Requires a classic palm.
  • Chris Kenner's "Bus Pass" - Page 163 of "Out of Control". The angles here are pretty good all around. The change happens as a coin is taken from the fingertips of one hand to the fingertip of the other hand. It is a variation of a...
  • Spellbound Change - By Dai Vernon. Taught on David Roth's "Expert Coin Magic Made Easy" video series (Volume 2) and David Stone's Coin Magic videos (Volume 1), Michael Rubinstein's "Encyclopedia of Coin Sleights" videos (Volume 2), etc, etc. Since you don't want a visible change, use Kenner's "Bus Pass" instead.
  • Catapult - Page 102 of Bobo's "New Modern Coin Magic". Brian Platt uses this for a switch (or change) and it is taught on his 2 DVD set. His move is called "The Catapult Coin Color Change". Probably overkill for what you need. Change happens with coin held on open palm up hand. The other hand is waved over it. Can be a bit angle sensitive. I wouldn't recommend doing with with something that was recently on fire! :D
  • Nabil Change - By Nabil Murday. Taught on Shoot and Apollo's Cultural Exchange DVD (Volume 1). Change happens at chest or eye level as coin is held between the index finger and thumb of one hand (by the edge) and it squeezed between the palm and fingers of the other hand. Probably overkill as there is too much action without justification for just switching one coin for another that looks like it (unless you say you need to cool down the coin by squeezing it?) It is a more advanced move, which looks beautiful when done properly; however it is angle sensitive if you continue the move to display both hands empty using Jimmy Wilson grip. Best done for one person.
  • Flash Change - Page 103 of Roth's "Expert Coin Magic". Fairly Difficult for a beginner, as it requires "deep back clip". Angles are best for one or two people who are close to you, looking down on your hands. Coin is switched in the act of turning your hand over to drop the coin. This is a one hand change. Very beautiful if done correctly.
  • Geoff Latta's Deep Backclip Recovery - Taught on New York Coin Seminar DVD (Volume 4 - Copper Silver). Difficult move. Requires a good knowledge of deep backclip. Angles are best for one or two people who are close to you, looking down on your hands. This is a one handed recovery / change sequence.

There are tons of other options. Anyone else have some good ones to suggest?

Hope this helps,

-ThisOneGoesTo11
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Sep 24, 2007
417
1
The majority of the changes mentioned above would be visual "spellbound" changes. For invisible switches, Roth's shuttle pass and Bobo's switch would work. Both have already been mentioned, but i throw my regards out for them too. Also, have you considered having the "gimmicked" coin in your pocket, then asking for a coin- when they give you the coin, you say "thanks," and put it in your pocket. then laugh and say "just kidding" bringing out the "switch" coin instead. works, well, and is a simple switch if you don't want to bother learning more advanced switches.
 
Dec 2, 2007
62
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The majority of the changes mentioned above would be visual "spellbound" changes.

Au Contraire, Mon Frère.

They would be visible spellbound-ish "color changes" only if the two coins were visibly different.

Roth's Palm Change and Lotta's deep backclip recovery are often used in copper/silver routines to invisibly switch a gimmick in and out of play.

Kenner's "bus pass" is invisible (it uses two matching coins) and is french-drop-ish / spellbound-ish in nature (see Kenner's "Only-One-Shuttle-Pass Coins Across" in "Out of Control"). I included it as an example of how moves normally used as color changes can be used to switch two coins which look the same.

Roth's Flash Change is also invisible when you use two matching coins. The great thing about this one is that you can have them hold out their hand and just turn your hand over to drop the coin in their hand. As long as the gimmick and the real coin match it is an invisible change. When their focus goes to the coin in their hand you have the proper "shade" to ditch the gimmick.

This being said, I completely agree with you regarding the Catapult and Nabil change. You can use them to switch coins, but they are better left as color changes as it is pretty hard to justify them as "natural" movement without something visual happening to the coins. If you wave your hand over a coin, or squeeze a coin and something happens it seems to justify the action. I believe it would just "create suspicion" if you performed the same actions with nothing happening (i.e. it wouldn't be justified).

I also agree that my post was perhaps overkill for a beginner. I just wanted to include options for different skill levels and different viewing angles (which is why I included the Nabil Change and deep backclip stuff...)

I am also of the belief that if "beginners" are never exposed to "advanced" stuff that they will never become "advanced". So after you master a more basic handling, go for the gusto and learn deep back clip and either the flash change or look into Lotta's recovery sequence. Who knows, with enough practice one day you may wander back into the magic shop and have the guy behind the counter say, "How the heck do you do that?!?!" ;)

Best of luck,

-ThisOneGoesTo11
 
Sep 24, 2007
417
1
I'm sure that those changes CAN be used as switches, but they would be less effective than a simple shuttle pass. Take Roth's flash change for example- it is an obviously "magical" movement- flipping a coin over onto a hand while waving the hand over it? Who is going to do that to toss a coin from one hand to the other?

Agree about being exposed to advanced material though.
 

r29

Jan 23, 2008
29
0
awesome great tips but yes i do agree with the advanced stuff that you mentioned. I normally do Card Tricks without being exposed to advanced tricks you'll nvr be advanced for example i'm practicing stuff from Dan And Dave Trilogy set amazing stuff =D

As for Pyris its a gimmicked coin that i need to switch American half dollar and i'm in Canada lol sorta funny. only if this trick came in a canadian verison that would be amazing but o well
 
Dec 2, 2007
62
0
I'm sure that those changes CAN be used as switches, but they would be less effective than a simple shuttle pass.

I would say that depends on how much time a person has dedicated to mastering any of the mentioned sleights, how natural they look and then creating proper motivation for the movement.

Take Roth's flash change for example- it is an obviously "magical" movement- flipping a coin over onto a hand while waving the hand over it? Who is going to do that to toss a coin from one hand to the other?

There isn't a wave in the Flash Change (at least not in the text; Roth might wave his hand in the videos). It *should* look like you just turn your hand over and the coin falls out. The fingers slightly curl (but look natural) and the now empty hand drops to your side. I wouldn't do this from one of my hands to the other hand, as again "What is the motivation to do that?" Instead I would ask them to hold out their hand and just drop the coin into their hand, then let my hand drop to my side.

I will agree that using a flash change in more advanced and more complex in the terms of logistics.

I assume that Pyris uses a coin which helps a bit with the fire part, but can't be handed out for examination (which provides the need for a switch) and has a good side and a bad side. Again, I don't own Pyris, so I don't know the method. Another option would be a one handed "crimp" change. I did a quick search and found an example video on you tube here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wz-jfRWE4BU&feature=related

...it is being presented as a color change, but there is no reason why it would have to be presented that way. After you "blow out" the coin say, "Here take a look..." (and start to hand it to them, half way through the motion cringe and say) "Yow! It's still hot!" Perform the fanning motion (crimp change) while blowing on it some more to 'cool it down' then hand out the coin, or put it on the table to allow them to 'go for it' whenever they wish.

I guess my main point is to have a motivation for whatever you do, while at the same time try not to be boxed in to only doing it "the easy way", or only having one way to do it.

I agree with Chicken that a shuttle pass, or a Bobo switch is probably the quickest to learn and gets the job done, but be sure to provide proper motivation for the movement. Don't just "shuttle pass" from one hand to the other then hand the coin out. If your lighter is on the table to your left and the coin is in your left hand, transfer it to the right hand (shuttle pass) so that your left is free to pickup the lighter and put it in your left pocket (ditch), then as an afterthought hand the coin to them for examination, or just sit it on the table and wait.

Probably the best advise is to play, have fun and train hard! ;)

-ThisOneGoesTo11
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Sep 24, 2007
417
1
Oh yeah... heh heh. I've been doing the flash change with a wave for so long that i almost forgot that it wasn't required...

That darned Marion Boykin. His change is just too good.
 
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