Flourishes Ruining Magic?

BrianationX

BrianationX

Banned
Jul 13, 2008
263
0
"It is difficult for layman to understand a visually complex flourish
The more times they see it
the better they are going to understand it
and appreciate it."

"When I was younger the Old School Magicians
Would often talk Shi** About Flourishes
because they were too Flashy.
The argument from the OldSchool Magicians is
Dont Show Skill
It takes away from the Magic......"

Which Is True But So Is Comedy!

And Besides
These hypocrites wold do ribbon spreads,and springs and fans
What the Hell are those!
are those not Flourishes
I don't know....
Maybe I got that one wrong or something.........

I Rather Take Credit Than The Deck!
 
S

senchi

May 16, 2008
119
0
Stockholm, Sweden
www.youtube.com
There are two schools of magic and there is nothing wrong with that. I will give you a example why old school may be correct.

Lets take a sandwich effect. A card is selected, returned, magician riffles the deck and the selection is trapped between two face up queens that have been on top of the deck all the time..

Compare to:

Card is selected, magician performs what seems to be thousand cuts and reveals the selection to be trapped between two face up queens.

Which one is more magical in the eyes of a spectator you think??

Dai Vernon and his fans were against the flourishing as a main star of the show. They were not hypocrites. Dai Vernon argued that magician should be proficient with the deck of cards, handling it neatly. This involved pressure fans and ribbon spreads. However, flourishes were not used to bring about magic. They were simply visual spices.

Finally, perform magic the way that fits you, accept and celebrate the diversity.
 
D

Deleted member 2755

Guest
Steerpike said:
Here we go again.
Click to expand...

C'mon Steerpike, you know it's true. Comedy does nothing but fill people's hearts with joy and make your magic that more interesting. No one wants presentation when performing! They want pure sleights none of that "RABBLE RABBLE" in between. Gosh Steerpike, with your logic, I would think you just joined the magic community yesterday! Jeez....

-Doug

PS: For those that can't detect it... that was pure sarcasm. ;) Well it looks like I have another essay to write on whether or not flourishing is killing magic. I'll give you my straight down answer though without any reasoning..... No. It is not killing magic. Alright, look forward to either a video or essay coming soon. ;)
 
M

MentalAlex

Apr 20, 2008
25
0
Flourishes aren't killing magic, they just simply aren't magic. They are something different. They are more like juggling.
 
ThrallMind

ThrallMind

Dec 4, 2007
1,074
2
www.thrallmind.com
Steerpike said:
Here we go again.
Click to expand...

Heh, I was about to say the same thing, and saw you beat me to it.

Brian, do something for us. Make a video showing off what you can do. Go ahead and write T11 on the tops of both of your hands, so we can be sure it's not just a video of some random person you decided to upload. We'll be honest, and shut up if you are entertaining.

Until then, quit spewing your fanboyism, which is only rivaled by the tweenagers on TRL.

Prove us all wrong. Show us that you do in fact have the ability to entertain, and don't just proverbially pleasure yourself with cards.

-ThrallMind
 
Dylan P.

Dylan P.

Apr 20, 2008
1,180
0
34
The Stadium Arcadium
www.freewebs.com
I urge the thread starter to think everything through before he writes this stuff. Flourishing is it's own type of magic all by itself. It gives you great hand skill and will most likely make your hands more flexible and strong.

Flourishing can also be used quickly in a routine too. I mean, let's say you are shuffling the deck in Stigmata. Why just cut the deck or do an overhand shuffle when you could do a quick Akira.

Short flourishes add a bit of eye candy to the trick itself. Now of course, doingall nine phases of Jackson 5 could be a bit much. But when used properly they can give your audiance a bit of eye candy.

So i don't see anything wrong as long as your maagic has been well-rehearsed.
 
BrianationX

BrianationX

Banned
Jul 13, 2008
263
0
Flourishes are not Ruining Magic.
They Enhance the magic
THey may take away from it if you dont know what your doing
For the people that say its different I kinda Agree
But there are some out there that incorporate flourishes with Magic
I think its Better
I mean
who really believes in Magic
Its all about the sleight of hand
and the audience knows it
Why let the deck take the credit when you are the one doing all the workYou might As Well "ShowOff"(Vol 3)
 
Steerpike

Steerpike

Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
BrianationX said:
Why let the deck take the credit when you are the one doing all the workYou might As Well "ShowOff"(Vol 3)
Click to expand...

And flourishes are the only way to do that?

I perform haunted magic. If I'm doing a seance with tarot cards, apportations, and all sorts of other spookey phenomena, busting out a Sybil cut is just going to wreck the atmosphere and guarantee that I never get booked again.
 
dragon521

dragon521

Dec 22, 2007
567
1
Long Island, New York
Well first off, ribbon spreads and fans aren't flourishes. At least not teh xtREmeZ SibLE 2 OHr BaD HaBitZZZ HeLix DEVIL loRdZ kind of flourishes. I still fail to say how flourishes are incorporated into magic. Maybe you perform magic and then show them flourishes but it's not like you use Jackson 5 in place of a swing cut.
 
Volcan

Volcan

May 2, 2008
148
11
BrianationX said:
"It is difficult for layman to understand a visually complex flourish
The more times they see it
the better they are going to understand it
and appreciate it."

"When I was younger the Old School Magicians
Would often talk Shi** About Flourishes
because they were too Flashy.
The argument from the OldSchool Magicians is
Dont Show Skill
It takes away from the Magic......"

Which Is True But So Is Comedy!

And Besides
These hypocrites wold do ribbon spreads,and springs and fans
What the Hell are those!
are those not Flourishes
I don't know....
Maybe I got that one wrong or something.........

I Rather Take Credit Than The Deck!
Click to expand...

Why are you so obsessed with Brian Tudor...?
 
M

Morgan B

Mar 29, 2008
882
3
Brian said “I would rather take credit, than the deck” – but the concept is that there is NO credit, NO explanation. This is what elicits reaction and leaves an unforgettable impact on your audiences.

I am glad you brought this up Brian, as I was reading some of your other posts and was going to PM you a story – but I think it would serve the group better.

I was at an amusement park with 4 other magicians that happen to be good friends I have worked with at a magic camp for up and coming professional magicians. We all had cards in hand to “jam” while waiting in line for rides. Someone in front of us noticed that one of the guys that happens to be an award winning magician and a flourish KING, had his cards in hand. He asked if he was a magician, and then asked to see something – my friend obliged and had him pick a card. He had him place it back…did a flourish, showed it on top - did it again and again. The guy looked at him and said, “That is pretty neat the way you move the cards like that, but it is not really magic. After all, if you can do that with the cards’, then finding my card is NOTHING”. The random guy in line was right, he wasn’t heckling; he was stating an observation. If you can manipulate the cards like that – then how amazing is it to find a card? It isn’t – you have proven you can manipulate cards beyond that of an average person to the extreme…or in flourish talk…XTREME!

Showing skill doesn’t ruin magic, as a certain amount of skill is expected – but when I see a flourish that produces the 4 aces…this is not magic, it is manipulation, not even magical manipulation, but displaying manipulation.

I have seen jugglers pretend to struggle juggling 5 pins, when I have seen them in practice do 7…why do they hide their skill? Because the illusion created is that the people are seeing a feat, not a rehearsed and easy task – this is part of the entertainment.

BrianationX – the more I read your posts and see what type of “magician” you are, I become saddened –you don’t understand your audiences or how to please them, as you are too busy trying to please yourself. Good luck with your masturbatory craft you try to call magic.

I like what Senchi said.

Lastly, I think you underestimate the concept of leaving no solution – people know that there is a method, but if they can’t detect one – that is when the feeling of magic occurs. You need to read Strong Magic BrianationX…or at least watch something other than a Tudor video…is that guy still pawning off Sybil and Sybil variations? ZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Quoted from a BrianationX show audience member– “I watched Brian’s hands move fast…and all I can say was…it was sorta neat…I mean, I can’t do it, so I guess that is cool”.
 
M

Morgan B

Mar 29, 2008
882
3
It is odd the only thing you were intelligent enough to question was my PS - how about the merit of the post above it?
 
S

senchi

May 16, 2008
119
0
Stockholm, Sweden
www.youtube.com
BrianationX- It is strange to me that you started a thread to discuss a subject of flourishing when you in fact don´t seem to care or value another peoples opinions. If you already know "the truth" and how things really are, why do you bother discussing the subject.

You claim: flourishines don´t ruin magic, they enhance it. So you mean that hundreds of masters and thinkers of magic that have chosen less flashy approach to magic are too stupid to realize what is best for them??

There is no such thing as an absolute truth. Everything is not black or white. Be intelligent and realize this.
 
M

Morgan B

Mar 29, 2008
882
3
Isn't that the opposite of slow = smooth?

That is more like fast and confusing? Magic is not confusing B!
 
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