Gaff Decks

[Morgan B]

Frostbullet - don't get me wrong, I was not angry or upset and this is the place to come for help. I would take the advice that said, put it off for awhile until you master some sleight of hand...once you do, they will be of more use to you. I would compare it to using weapons in karate - learn how to throw a punch and kick first. Same sort of thing with magic.

I just wanted to remind the guys that sharing ideas can often come across as helping, but can lead to exposure.

This is sort of a middle of the road thing - as some might argue that this post exposes gaffs - others might say...so what? They are all on the major web sites - but I don't think that makes it any less expsosure. I think talking about in a popular forum and stating they exists is a small form of exposure.

Perfect example - We could have a thread on the Svengali deck, and someone could talk about it's construction....after all, you can get them at ANY flea market....and DING - it become public domain because of it's ease of access. Websites are larger than flea markets and ONE of the main reasons you get...is that a trick deck where every (method to svengali) is because of there ease of access- the point is this - if we don't hide and protect these secrets, they will become useless.

I did look through the thread again, and I didn't find any real "method" but we use titles and terms and link sights where people can find more....and ask NOTHING in return - no proof that they are even able to use this knowledge.

Where has the brotherhood (or sisterhood) gone in magic? The secret of EVERYTHING used be cherished...and now we openly talk about gaffs,effect names to search on Youtube, and link to sights to show EXACTLY what we are talking about. If this is not a small form of exposure....well, the fact I have to point it out is a bit brutal.

Instead of writing an essay about how to answer a thread - how about one where we start to respect the secrets of magic - everyone cracks down on it.

We no longer say titles of moves when it can be avioided - so double lift becomes DL and we PM each other more...sorry, an idealist.

Anyhow, sorry if I took away from allowing you to share your knowledge on gaffs - I just think this is an example of how loose things have got on this site from members. It may have been the wrong time...but not completely.

 

[frostbullet]

I get what you mean. Well, at least i have gain some basic knowledge on the gaff decks and will at least be sure of what i'm getting later on. Thanks. =)
As for the exposure, its up to oneself to decide whether if they want to expose, but i agree with you Morgician.

Yet, I wonder, if we are not to share the secrets, how would those wanting to learn magic, or prob knows of the basic and thinking of learning advanced magic go on if you guys don't show the path for them to go?

However, the info can just be not so in depth, probably just to help them kick start their journey along this new path.

To summarise, we can just say that there are consequences for everything.

 

[praetoritevong]

Morgician certainly brings up something to think about...

frost, I think just the one key thing here is that you do need to know sleight of hand for gaff decks - unless you're buying the DVDs that teach tricks and sleights along with the deck, if you just have the deck, you'll have to rely on yourself to either find routines elsewhere or create them yourself

 

[frostbullet]

Yea, thinking of getting dvds for it as well, mind if i ask, is there any other dvds beside the ultragaff Project dvd by WH and Daniel Gracia?

 

[praetoritevong]

The Ultragaff DVDs teach effects for the Ultragaff set of gaff cards. For the regular Ellusionist gaff deck, the DVD is called Army of 52 - http://www.ellusionist.com/product/a.../army+of+52.do

 

[frostbullet]

I see. Alright!
Thanks.

 

[jcherry]

I'm going to play the devil's advocate here and back up Morgician. An example of exposure is quoted below. Believe it or not, but there are some folks out there who don't know how DoA is accomplished. Sure this quote doesn't go into detail, but it leads people in the direction. I edited the the quote for my own morality's sake.

John

can Dream of Aces be done without gaff cards?? coz u dont really end clean with the (edit) cards

 

[BlazeCinder]

Oops im sorry.i'll edit my post now.. but i once saw the exposure for DoA on a video sharing web

 

[jcherry]

Thanx for editing.

Oops im sorry.i'll edit my post now.. but i once saw the exposure for DoA on a video sharing web

Just because someone else has shared, doesn't mean anyone else should continue. Our art is art when the secret is kept, otherwise it's just a trick. No one likes to be tricked.

 

[Sinful07]

You lot arent backing me up with the exposure posts *Goes and haves a temper tantrum*


I see your point though Morgician, but that solely defeats the point of accessing the forums, particularly 'card magic' section in T11. we might as well prohibit every other section besides the general discussion forum if we were to follow your idea.

Though i do see your point- i think its a bit strict, Nazi-esque sort of thing. Sides, it'll probably scare off new members. Just a thought.

Anyways, i watched the preview videos for the Ultragaff Dvd- must say im amused already by the previews. let alone the Dvd itself. wish i had the money to get it. lol.

 

[Dylan P.]

I'm glad that everyone is trying to help me out! Really appreciate it! However, about the gaff decks, I'm might be getting it soon and yup, just wanna know more about it. Depending on the information i get, I might decide not to buy it. Sorry if I made any of you guys angry or so.

Oh no! you didn't get us angry. this happens quite often around here. Within a thread some people will debate about certan issues. The best thing to do is just to ignore these statements and look at the posts that help you make the right decision. Don't worry... you didn't make us mad.

Dylan P.

 

[Morgan B]

Sinful07 - I am not saying we need to be more strict, just more careful with what we are sharing with who - this is a community and we are here to help, but I could see a magic trick from a pro...come here as a lay person...sign up and you guys would answer EXACTLY how anything is done - NO questions on my level in magic or if I am even a magician. In a way, this breaks the magicians code.

Also - this is not just for new members - but for all - as this is a open forum that can be seen without membership.

Lastly, Dylan, your above statement is really condescending, and I don't appreciate it. I think that I handled frostbullets concern, but you posted over me like you are a mod. Not cool.

 

[Dylan P.]

Morgician,
I am sorry. My above post was not supposed tocome off that way. And by just ignore these debates... I meant that if they really do not answer your question and you could improve yourself more without involving yourself... Then simply do not join in the argument. I am extremely sorry if I sounded condescending.

Dylan P.

 

[rousselle]

A few more thoughts on the subject...

Hey all! I'm new to all these magic. Just came upon something known as gaff decks. Just want to have some information on this subject. Mind anyone explain this to me?

Hi, there, Frostbullet.

In general, anyone referring to a "gaff" or a "gimmick" is referring to an object that appears to be an unadulterated version of that object, but in fact has some important alteration(s). As has been alluded to in some earlier posts on this thread, some magic depends upon using an altered item but never allowing the audience in on the fact that the item was altered.

Other kinds of performances use the alteration as a punchline to the performance. An example would be this effect: performer asks two people separately to pick a card at random. Performer then says he will pull out a card that is the value of those randomly selected cards added together. First spectator is asked to reveal his/her card, and it's a four of whatever. Second spectator is asked to reveal his/her card, and it is revealed to be an eight of whatever. Rest of crowd gasps or laughs because now they know magician is toast. Then the performer pulls out of the deck a... twelve of hearts. Everyone laughs. Performer moves to next trick.

In this case, everyone *knows* the card is a gimmick. But, everyone is entertained because expectations were violated in an entertaining way (which is, after all, the case for *most* successful magic tricks), and the performance is a success.

If one is going to perform more card tricks, however, one has now introduced the idea that the cards may not be a normal deck, and so future tricks might be somewhat diluted in impact.

There are many cases where a gaffed card or other prop is used in such a way so as to attain a desired effect without revealing that a gaff was used. Previous posts in this thread list some examples.

There are a number of "standard" gaffs that you'll encounter frequently if you start getting serious about gimmicked cards. There are also several decks that have interesting variations. Ellusionist makes several decks, as has been noted ad infinitum on this board, but they are not the only designers/distributors of gaffed cards (or other magic supplies, for that matter).

Another deck of gaffs that you might want to take a look at is "The Clowns & Jokers Deck of Magic Gaff Cards," also known as the CAJ deck, which comes with a booklet that describes a few effects. (This deck includes a few of my favorite gaffed cards, which I dare not describe here, but the book is, er, not quite as clearly written as the amspay e-mail I get from Russian brides-to-be.)

Yet another deck-and-DVD combo (like the previously discussed "Ultragaff") is the "Packet Killer" DVD with "The Blue Deck", featuring Simon Lovell. This deck is mostly your standard variety gaffs, with well-explained methods for using them. I realize that the production values on the two DVDs are not of the MTV/cinema verite style that so many seem to like, nor are the multiple cameras used as effectively as maybe they could be, but the instruction is very clear, the sound is clean, and I happen to enjoy Simon Lovell's style and sense of character and performance.

Whereas Ultragaff seems to be directed at an intermediate-level performer, I'd say Packet Killer is aimed at a more beginner-level. PK is a very good introduction to the basics, whereas UG invites and encourages more experimentation and creativity.

Hope these ramblings help you out,

--Allan

PS: I know Justin Miller frequents this board from time to time, and allow me to say that Army of 52 is tre excellent. Mr. Miller taught me on that DVD a few simple moves that I very much appreciate. At first, I thought... "Wait a minute! He has longer fingers than I do! I can't do what he's doing!" Then I tried, and tried, and tried, and discovered that, well, yes I can. If I had more free time in the evenings, I'd love to participate in his video chats that have been noted elsewhere on the forums.

Frostbullet, you should be aware that Army of 52 is also in the intermediate-level camp, in my opinion. Others here may have a different evaluation, of course.

 

[frostbullet]

Wow! This is really detailed! Thanks for your help! =)
And now i know more!


Frosty =)