Why is Cardistry still a niche Hobby?

[Mouseff]

Hello,

so today I sent Jeremy T's "My Museum" video to a friend. He answered:" You're a nerd. Get yourself a Hobby!"
This made me wonder what are people really thinking about our Art? Often when I'm performing a little move in school or so everybody likes it, but on the other hand nobody wants to learn it. And nobody who is not in the Scene watches Cardistry Videos on Youtube. I found none with over 1 million views. But there are guys like Money Boy with 5+ views for beeing retarded or for running through the city?

What is so more cool on these guys that they are better than D+D, The Virts, ...?

What are your thoughts on this?

Mouseff

 

[timsilva]

It probably has little to do with Cardistry in and off itself. Sports, artforms, and hobbies take years to become established. What we do is a lot like juggling, which probably faced similar problems when it was becoming established.

This is relatively new, and it is relatively difficult to become good at. Between those two factors, I think the art form is right about where it should be.

 

[ferante]

This is the excellent question by the way. I always wonder, why people who are very good at cardistry,xcm, are not earn money or something like that. My answer is that card manipulation is not so big, simple flourishes are not so exiting to watch on stage. May be only fans and backpalms is interesting. I fell sadness about it. In addition, i want to know how think theory11 artist,DM,Dan and Dave. I want to know their opinions about this art form and it perspective.

 

[Sk8r_St3v3]

If you take a good look, you'll find that Cardistry and flourishing are starting to pick up. People like Chris Hestnes and co, who began by having a desire to be as good as their idols (D&D) are now releasing their own flourishing DVDs. Many competent flourishers are being creative and utilising their skills to release low cost 'homegrown' flourishes through youtube etc (i.e. Michael Herp - although he is a VERY competent flourisher and at the top of that list.)

I think that also many people who are introduced/decide to take up magic and find it not to their liking or too challenging defer their taste to flourishing because it is essentially based on dedication and, once you have the basics down, creativity. I love magic but i have just lost interest in learning it - its not really my thing, whereas i can not put a deck of cards down, even when i want to!

Im glad you have posed this question, it has got me back into these forums after a hiatus i thought wouldnt end.

EDIT:

Another thing i have just thought i might throw in here - flourishing can be a performance art, but primarily it is a show of man hours and skill, and is incredibly rewarding on a personal/individual basis. So i think that this may be part of the reason it isnt growing as fast as things like Parkour did - people are not interested on confident enough to demonstrate their talent in front of the public as they would with magic.

 

[Steerpike]

Because most of it never gets performed for anything that isn't a webcam.

 

[Harry Potter]

It's probably because people don't see it that much. For example, I'll practice a flourish in public or with my friends and either I get a weird look from people or my friends will tell me to go get a life.

 

[screamokidd97]

Sad

I don't think it's fair how things like playing an instrument and skateboarding can be accepted as a 'regular' hobbie but cardistry can't. I find it more entertaining to flourish for an hour than say play soccer or play an instrument.

 

[Steerpike]

I don't think it's fair how things like playing an instrument and skateboarding can be accepted as a 'regular' hobbie but cardistry can't. I find it more entertaining to flourish for an hour than say play soccer or play an instrument.

You should pick up an instrument anyway. It's good for the soul.

That said, it's not considered legit because nothing's been done with it as of yet. There are more YouTube videos of cardistry done in someone's bedroom posted every day than there are actual live performances. You want it to be legit? Get out of your room, and perform for real people. Most of you guys are saying that it will be taken seriously eventually, but how many of you are actually doing anything to make that happen?

 

[Harry Potter]

You should pick up an instrument anyway. It's good for the soul.

That said, it's not considered legit because nothing's been done with it as of yet. There are more YouTube videos of cardistry done in someone's bedroom posted every day than there are actual live performances. You want it to be legit? Get out of your room, and perform for real people. Most of you guys are saying that it will be taken seriously eventually, but how many of you are actually doing anything to make that happen?

SteerPike I agree with you. Most of us complain about how cardistry isn't taken seriously, but a lot of us don't do anything to make it happen. We learn different flourishes and we video tape ourselves doing them, while we should show them around to people instead of keeping it to us. This way we could eventually get cardistry taken seriously, and maybe get more people to get involved with it.

 

[Steerpike]

Finally! It's not as if you guys don't have any good venues. Right off the top of my head, a lot of coffee shops and bars have an open-mic night. Anyone can sign up for those and you can very quickly learn what audiences want to see and what they don't give a damn about.

 

[Sinful07]

To add with what's been said earlier: You stated that Flourishing is an artform.

The bigger question is, Why is it an artform? Is it art in your hands? is it poetry in motion? or is it just you fumbling about and waving little pieces of paper around?

Food for thought.

 

[solakmagic]

I couldn't agree more...whenever I'm asked what I'm doing, I can't say magic, cause it's not true. I'm practicing flourishes. So I'll say...cardistry, or flourishing, or card manipulation, and I can always expect the same answer...what's that? And then, when I explain, the same response...Oh. I thought cards were just for magic. You try to explain to people how flourishes are an integral part of messing around with cards, it's almost impossible to be a 'magician' without being a 'flourisher'. So whenever I do a simple card spring or the Werm, and someone tells me that's not magic, I want to beat my head against a wall. Cause there's more to cards then magic.

 

[jugglemonkey]

I couldn't agree more...whenever I'm asked what I'm doing, I can't say magic, cause it's not true. I'm practicing flourishes. So I'll say...cardistry, or flourishing, or card manipulation, and I can always expect the same answer...what's that? And then, when I explain, the same response...Oh. I thought cards were just for magic. You try to explain to people how flourishes are an integral part of messing around with cards, it's almost impossible to be a 'magician' without being a 'flourisher'. So whenever I do a simple card spring or the Werm, and someone tells me that's not magic, I want to beat my head against a wall. Cause there's more to cards then magic.

I couldnt agree more.
True story: most people are amazed by cardistry. They don't understand but find it to be mesmerizing. I was doing a simple flourish (sybil) before going into the Biddle trick, and the girl was like "oh thats really cool." I think that its one of those things that only certain spectators will appreciate. The girl I performed for was the artsy type so, since Cardistry is definitely an art form, it was appreciated. Unlike the Solamagic, I have not had anyone give me negative feedback about Cardistry. I think the key is to keep it simple and if you get a good reaction, to do progressively flashier flourishes, before going into a magic trick. Its a great way to draw the audience in to what you are doing. Even a simple top shot will capture your audiences attention. I also see Cardistry as great misdirection in some cases. Instead of burning your hands for a control or a pass, doing a simple false cut, disguised in the form of a flourish, is a great way to keep their card where you want it, without having to worry about being caught.

hope that made sense. Keep flourishing!

 

[GuSSeee]

You said that none of your friends would like to learn anything from you. I use to take a deck of cards with me to school and do some fluorishes and everybody loves it and wants to learn. The things that most people love is things like the spring and fans (especially giant fan).
I use to say that the charlier is the easiest thing to do and try to learn it to them. And then they will understand how hard it is. And don't be afraid to go out and show it to people, it doesnt get more famous if you post a video on youtube. And it's a lot more fun to do it for a live audiens.

 

[BlueSpade1000]

You said that none of your friends would like to learn anything from you. I use to take a deck of cards with me to school and do some fluorishes and everybody loves it and wants to learn. The things that most people love is things like the spring and fans (especially giant fan).
I use to say that the charlier is the easiest thing to do and try to learn it to them. And then they will understand how hard it is. And don't be afraid to go out and show it to people, it doesnt get more famous if you post a video on youtube. And it's a lot more fun to do it for a live audiens.

I agree

Everybody wants to learn cardistry.... untill you try to teach them a simple flourish like the charlier cut and they get tired of it. Cardistry is one of those artforms that is damn near impossible to do for absolute begginers. it takes a lot of time and a lot of inspiration to start learning.

Preforming cardistry is the best thing. The best thing about cardistry is that it is unknown. Nobody has ever seen cards being fliped and twirled with such speed and smoothness. Trust me if you walk around in a mall or any populated area flourishing random people would stop you to show you off to their friends.

 

[Mouseff]

I experienced that too. I sometimes sit in school in the breaks and do a few flourishes. There are some people just whispering to their friends like 'watch what this guy is doing' and looking over like a girl fallen in love
But as mentioned before, almost nobody has the ambition and patience to dig a bit deeper after I showed them one or two basic moves.

 

[BlueSpade1000]

Just think to yourself how boring cardistry would be if it was not a niche hobby. If everybody knows what cardistry is they would not really enjoy watching it as much. For example, skateboard kids are really talented and they work really hard to learn cool skateboard tricks ,but they do not get as much attention and praise as we do because everybody knows about skateboarding from TV. However, things like pen spinning, magic ,and cardistry are rarely ever on the media. Sometimes the most amusing hobbies are the most unknown.

 

[Steerpike]

I'm seeing a lot of words, but none of them are about where you guys are going to perform. Why is that, do you think?

Just think to yourself how boring cardistry would be if it was not a niche hobby. If everybody knows what cardistry is they would not really enjoy watching it as much. For example, skateboard kids are really talented and they work really hard to learn cool skateboard tricks ,but they do not get as much attention and praise as we do because everybody knows about skateboarding from TV. However, things like pen spinning, magic ,and cardistry are rarely ever on the media. Sometimes the most amusing hobbies are the most unknown.

That sounds like an argument for kvlt kiddie syndrome. It's not actual logic, but an incredible simulation.

Oh and since you brought it up, skateboarding doesn't get that much praise anymore because it's just not that interesting to watch more often than not.

 

[BlueSpade1000]

I'm seeing a lot of words, but none of them are about where you guys are going to perform. Why is that, do you think?



That sounds like an argument for kvlt kiddie syndrome. It's not actual logic, but an incredible simulation.

Oh and since you brought it up, skateboarding doesn't get that much praise anymore because it's just not that interesting to watch more often than not.

Cardistry is basically juggling ,therefore cardist should preform wherever jugglers preform. Places like college campuses, and the park are perfect places. I usually use cardistry as bait to show people magic.

PS: Out of curiosity What is kvlt kiddie syndrome???

 

[Steerpike]

Cardistry is basically juggling ,therefore cardist should preform wherever jugglers preform. Places like college campuses, and the park are perfect places. I usually use cardistry as bait to show people magic.

So do you want them to see cardistry or not? Cardistry or magic, which one is your end goal in the performance? And do you actually perform regularly with the intent of introducing more people to cardistry or are you just saying this to try and prove me wrong?

PS: Out of curiosity What is kvlt kiddie syndrome???

It's based on an inside joke in the metal community. Kvlt kiddie syndrome is what I call the curious anti-mainstream ethos among some artistic types who believe that being obscure, starved for input and new blood, trivialized and reviled by the mainstream makes them inherently superior because this somehow is supposed to protect the purity and credibility of their artform. In reality, their decision to limit their audience and refuse any sort of mainstream recognition has the opposite effect, further marginalizing the artform and guaranteeing it a slow, painful descent into stagnation, stultification, and eventually death.

Kvlt kiddies don't like to share their table with anybody. They want to feel that they're part of an exclusive club. Rather than putting in the work to get their work out there and seen by more people, they imagine their obscurity actually makes them purer artists because they're not "selling out" or whatever. It's a hollow, unfulfilling existence, but most kvlt kiddies are too self-important and pretentious to ever figure that out.

So by saying that you don't want cardistry to become more recognized and gain a wider audience, you are a kvlt kiddie who is doing more damage than good. You argued that gaining cardistry a wider audience would make it more boring (though you never actually explained how), but look at what you guys are doing now. You have nowhere to go but up.