How to reduce the knuckle flash from my bottom deal?

Oct 17, 2015
1
0
Hello Guys I'm doing a bottom deal from mechanics grip and Im pushing off the card (buckling) with my middle finger. So my question is can you guys give me any tips to reduce the motion of my fingers and also is it good to push off the card right before taking it and not ahead of time.Thank you in advance.
 

Davis West

Elite Member
Dec 26, 2013
134
123
Move your hand more when you deal the cards. Bring your hands together, then apart as you deal. Cover the smaller actions with a bigger action. I had a similar problem.
 
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Joey144

Elite Member
Oct 14, 2007
296
111
Bavaria, Germany
Move your hand more when you deal the cards.
That's the Daniel Madison way of doing it which results in an awful bottom deal.

So my question is can you guys give me any tips to reduce the motion of my fingers
You don't need a huge buckling action, a small movement of the middle finger is sufficient if you practice enough. You will never completly eliminate the movement of the fingers. With enough practice and the right technique you can get it to a minimum though. Far more important in my opinion is the rhythm. If you hesitate between tops and bottoms it will be a lot more obvious than your knuckle flash.
 
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Ryan Malone

Elite Member
Mar 19, 2015
8
3
27
Ireland
When your dealing the cards push the top card over for cover when your doing the losing action and aim the deck downwards a bit also if you have a copy of the expert at the card table Erdnase gives you some tips on how to cover the action hope that helps.
 
Jun 29, 2015
50
29
That's the Daniel Madison way of doing it which results in an awful bottom deal.


You don't need a huge buckling action, a small movement of the middle finger is sufficient if you practice enough. You will never completly eliminate the movement of the fingers. With enough practice and the right technique you can get it to a minimum though. Far more important in my opinion is the rhythm. If you hesitate between tops and bottoms it will be a lot more obvious than your knuckle flash.

What do you have against Madison? His deal is consistent: seconds, bottoms ...
 

Joey144

Elite Member
Oct 14, 2007
296
111
Bavaria, Germany
What do you have against Madison? His deal is consistent: seconds, bottoms ...
It doesn't matter if he is consistent with his deals if he performs all of them poorly. He shouldn't be the reference point for anyone in my opinion. All of the guys that I know and that spent more than a day on the bottom deal agree with me on this point. But ofc everyone is allowed to have their own opinion.

lfortressl asked for help/tips and I tried to help with what I learned over the years doing the bottom deal.
 
Jun 6, 2015
119
84
Charlotte NC
It doesn't matter if he is consistent with his deals if he performs all of them poorly. He shouldn't be the reference point for anyone in my opinion. All of the guys that I know and that spent more than a day on the bottom deal agree with me on this point. But ofc everyone is allowed to have their own opinion.

I've used the Erdnase bottom for most of my magic career, but I picked up a copy of How to Cheat at Cards by DM, and I've had a lot of success with that bottom. I've noticed that you can still use the mechanics of his bottom without moving your hands so much. At this point I don't really move the deck more than an inch or so in any direction.

To the OP, I think it's good to experiment with different methods and find which way works best for you. Erdnase, Daniel Madison, Jason England, see what you have the most success with.
 

Joey144

Elite Member
Oct 14, 2007
296
111
Bavaria, Germany
and I've had a lot of success with that bottom. I've noticed that you can still use the mechanics of his bottom without moving your hands so much. At this point I don't really move the deck more than an inch or so in any direction.
You could have saved some time by reading Gene Maze's book. But good that it still works out for you. Seems like you put more time and effort into the deal than Madison himself.
 
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