Illegal to perform?

[Maaz Hasan]

So I've been seeing a lot of close friends and family recently, and I was told it was illegal to perform on the streets.

So 3 questions:
Would it be illegal to actually perform on the street, in a mall, in a park, or in an open commercial center (like a large complex or area with a ton of buildings and businesses, but still an open street or public place)?

And is it still legal if I start making a bit of change by busking in the same places (someone told me I had to get a license, and I have no clue whom I would go to for such a thing)?

Even if it is illegal, is it enforced? Like, will a cop/guard or a complex/mall owner really kick me out if I am performing?

 

[notsoltd]

You have to research based on your town and where you want to perform at. Here's just a few bits to consider from my experience:

1. Malls generally won't care unless you generate a large crowd. I started performing for 4 or 5 people in a busy mall once, the crowd QUICKLY grew to like 30+ people and then security showed up. The crowd booed them as they grabbed my arm and escorted me away and off the property. Oops lol.

2. Busking in my city is allowed in one specific area and you're not allowed to use any kind of amplifier. You DO have to pay for a permit and even though it's legal, if an officer decides to jack with you and make you stop, you have to or they will revoke your permit.

3. A few cities over, they welcome street performers, amps and all. You don't need a permit BUT you are not permitted to ask for money in any way shape or form for any reason.

It is definitely possible that you will be performing and get messed with by security/cops EVEN IF it's legal for you to be doing what you're doing.

I highly recommend researching these laws in your cities local laws which should be able to be found online. I'd also recommend checking out Steven Bridges on YouTube as he is a full time busker and has all kinds of great info in his videos.

 

[obrienmagic]

The performing itself is not usually illegal, it is the baggage that comes with it (trespassing, soliciting for tips, filming, using speakers or amplifiers, drawing a large crowd, etc.) If you are referring to busking, it would be best to find out if it is allowed in your town. Usually you have to get some sort of permit to be there (so they can make money off you as well as hold you accountable.) Also, there would be certain rules you may need to follow as well, but again, your city will have this info.

If you are referring to walking around and showing magic to random people then moving on, unless it is private property, the police cannot arrest or ticket you for showing people magic.... (at least not in the states.)

 

[Maaz Hasan]

The performing itself is not usually illegal, it is the baggage that comes with it (trespassing, soliciting for tips, filming, using speakers or amplifiers, drawing a large crowd, etc.) If you are referring to busking, it would be best to find out if it is allowed in your town. Usually you have to get some sort of permit to be there (so they can make money off you as well as hold you accountable.) Also, there would be certain rules you may need to follow as well, but again, your city will have this info.

If you are referring to walking around and showing magic to random people then moving on, unless it is private property, the police cannot arrest or ticket you for showing people magic.... (at least not in the states.)

Ahh, So its fine if I go into like a public park or place and just show magic to people who are chilling?

 

[obrienmagic]

Ahh, So its fine if I go into like a public park or place and just show magic to people who are chilling?

Unless they complain you should be fine. For example if you did get a ticket for doing magic, it would not be for "doing magic." it would be for disturbing the peace, trespassing, soliciting for tips, etc.

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Unless they complain you should be fine. For example if you did get a ticket for doing magic, it would not be for "doing magic." it would be for disturbing the peace, trespassing, soliciting for tips, etc.

Yeah of course xD

Imagine is someone got fined 1/2 way through a Torn and Restored like Counterfiet and you never get to see if the trick wouldv'e worked.

 

[Justin.Morris]

Many cities require a permit to busk. Usually easy to get one from your city hall office. Many other cities don't require one, but probably have guidelines for where you can be (like not in front of the door of a business for example)
Private property like a mall or anything, you will need the permission of the business.

 

[Justinquill]

This is interesting, I've been going around my local mall and I did a fair like two nights in a row, no one messed with me, I can see how it could happen though. Def. keeping an eye on this thread

 

[obrienmagic]

This is interesting, I've been going around my local mall and I did a fair like two nights in a row, no one messed with me, I can see how it could happen though. Def. keeping an eye on this thread

If you are just showing random people tricks it should not be an issue. The problem in these places is usually when you draw a large crowd or try to profit off of it asking for tips and stuff.

 

[Maaz Hasan]

So where exactly should I go to locate the laws for this kinda stuff? Because the internet gives you 10 different answers...

I remember a dude was trying to buy a butterfly knife and he asked 10 or so places, and one dude said "Well, they're legal.... but you can't get caught with one.". What does that even mean?

 

[Medford Magic]

So where exactly should I go to locate the laws for this kinda stuff? Because the internet gives you 10 different answers...

I remember a dude was trying to buy a butterfly knife and he asked 10 or so places, and one dude said "Well, they're legal.... but you can't get caught with one.". What does that even mean?

Mr. Hasan, I had the same questions. It depends on what place you live in, for example I will use where I live, a small city in the United States. I had the same question as you, so I went to my city hall requesting a Performer's License. It turns out my city never needed such a thing, no one had ever needed it. I asked them about street performing and they said the following: "If you are going to perform infront of a vender please talk to the manger before doing so and letting them know what you are doing (if setting up shop specifically there), the vendor has the right to ask you to leave their property at any time as they please." Hot spots for street performing will allow you to do so, but may require you to put a select time for the position you will be in.

However Mr. Hasan as for as I am concerned there is no reason why street performing should be illegal unless you are harassing the spectator (which no respectable magician would do). Walking around, doing a couple of tricks, don't worry about it but consult your town hall / city hall before pursuing, just to be on the safe side

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Mr. Hasan, I had the same questions. It depends on what place you live in, for example I will use where I live, a small city in the United States. I had the same question as you, so I went to my city hall requesting a Performer's License. It turns out my city never needed such a thing, no one had ever needed it. I asked them about street performing and they said the following: "If you are going to perform infront of a vender please talk to the manger before doing so and letting them know what you are doing (if setting up shop specifically there), the vendor has the right to ask you to leave their property at any time as they please." Hot spots for street performing will allow you to do so, but may require you to put a select time for the position you will be in.

However Mr. Hasan as for as I am concerned there is no reason why street performing should be illegal unless you are harassing the spectator (which no respectable magician would do). Walking around, doing a couple of tricks, don't worry about it but consult your town hall / city hall before pursuing, just to be on the safe side

Thanks bro! I'll see when I can go visit city hall... after I find it '_'

Oh and Mr.Hasan is way to formal lol I'm 16 - I don't want to feel like I'm in the principal's office at school. I actually really like the fact that the forums here at Theory 11 aren't laid back to the point where nothing gets done, but are also not so formal that you feel uncomfortable talking with someone. No need to get to formal

Oh, and I see that you've joined recently. Welcome!

 

[Justinquill]

Thanks Medford Magic, that was super helpful!

 

[WitchDocIsIn]

Performing is not illegal, unless it's specifically barred in a particular location.

Asking for money is not illegal, unless it's specifically barred in a particular location.

Therefore, performing and then asking for money is not illegal unless specifically barred in a particular location. There's been some court cases regarding this ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Busking_(U.S._case_law) )

But yeah, contact the town hall and ask about a performer's license. There's a solid chance they don't have anything like it, as most of the US doesn't. If they don't have a license regarding that, then it comes down to being sure not to disrupt local businesses or disrupt the peace (ie: Don't block stores, don't have large enough crowds that they get rowdy)

It would come down to the individual officer who came across you. The general rule followed by most buskers worldwide is "Ask forgiveness, not permission" and if they hassle you, close up and move to another area.

 

[Medford Magic]

Thanks bro! I'll see when I can go visit city hall... after I find it '_'

Oh and Mr.Hasan is way to formal lol I'm 16 - I don't want to feel like I'm in the principal's office at school. I actually really like the fact that the forums here at Theory 11 aren't laid back to the point where nothing gets done, but are also not so formal that you feel uncomfortable talking with someone. No need to get to formal

Oh, and I see that you've joined recently. Welcome!

Im young too, I just figured it was more respectful Glad I could help

 

[CarySchlaffman]

if its in a mall, then its ok for 3-6 people but once it grows to like 15+ then security shows up

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Hey so quick update question:
I know it has been a while, but I was waiting until school starts to go ask for permission and stuff (just to get my school schedule lined up). I have done more research, and can't seem to find any specific laws against busking, but just to be safe, I am going to go ask anyways. What would be the best place to go? Town/City Hall, The Police Station (someone recommended this to me), the owners of all the areas I will be performing (though the city actually owns it, it's a public place).... The DMV p)? All of the above?

 

[WitchDocIsIn]

City Hall. But most likely they will look at you like you're crazy. There's a really solid chance there's no laws against it and no one has ever asked whoever you will ask. That's what happened to me in Fresno.