Cardini Change? Ego Change?

Discussion in 'Magic Forum' started by praetoritevong, Dec 11, 2009.

  1. Hey guys,

    For once, a really short post from me. Over the time I've been here, every now and again a post has come up asking what the difference is between a Cardini Change and an Ego Change. And more often than every now and again, a video is posted claiming to be one, when it is in fact the other.

    So I just wanted to basically note the key differences between the two. My observations are based off the Cardini Change as published in Hugard's Card Manipulations Series 3 and the Ego Change as taught on the Daniel Garcia Project Vol. 1. However, if I have made a mistake, please let me know.

    1. Finger positioning: In a Cardini Change, the third (ring) finger is inserted below the top card, in what is essentially a large finger break. In an Ego Change, all fingers sit on the side of the deck/on top of the deck.

    2. Change motion: In a Cardini Change, the top card is carried up and away before the cleanup takes place. In an Ego Change, the top card is carried down and pivoted before the cleanup takes place.

    3. Finger motions: In a Cardini Change, the fingers are extended outwards. In an Ego Change, the fingers drag downwards.

    4. The finger in question: In a Cardini Change, the ring finger does the work. In an Ego Change, the pinky does the work, pivoting off the middle finger.

    I hope this clears up what the differences are between the two changes! They are of course very similar, and both very good; it's a matter of preference picking between them. However, know which one you're picking to avoid looking like a novice.
     
    Gunner likes this.
  2. the way i learnt the cardini change was the same positioning of the fingers as the ego but it w done with only the pinkie to make the change faster. thank you for your post
     
  3. Not sure where you learned this, but you're off quite a bit.

    1. Got it backwards
    2. Got it backwards
    3. In both changes the fingers drag down.
    4. Got it backwards

    I think you learned one or both mistakenly or just reversed them.

    Ian
     
  4. I took my descriptions directly from Hugard's Card Manipulations and Garcia's DGP Vol 1. I rechecked them again, and I don't think I'm mistaken.

    To take one example, for number one, Hugard writes: "Insert the top joint of the third finger under the face card." with an accompanying picture that illustrates the point, so I'm afraid I believe you're in fact mistaken.

    Clearly, it is the Cardini which has the ring finger held beneath the card as a break-like position. And from videos of DG's Ego Change, it is clear that there is no break. I'm pretty sure you have it wrong, may I ask which sources you're looking at? Might be able to clear this up.
     
  5. The confusion arises because Dan and Dave teach a modified Cardini change on The Trilogy, and a lot of people have taken that to be the original handling of the Cardini change, which it isn't.
     
  6. Well done.
    One of the first posts i saw, which are absolutely correct on the differences between cardini and ego ;)
     
  7. The Cardini change you're describing is the modified one Dan and Dave teach in Tivo 2.0. The Ego change works with the middle and ring finger, as per DGP Vol. 1. There is no break in either change.

    If you watch performances you'll notice the Ego is slower because the pinky gives the Cardini faster speed.

    Ian
     
  8. That's incorrect on three counts...

    1) As stated above, my source for the Cardini Change is Hugard's Card Manipulations, from which I quoted. It is not modified in any way. It amazes me that you still continue your unfounded claims when I have even quoted verbatim from the aforementioned text.

    With all due respect, the text comes directly from Jean Hugard's Card Manipulations, Series 3, page 46, (I believe its original appearance in print) starting halfway down the page, if you'd care to check, along with an accompanying illustration. To claim that it is modified is incorrect. And with all due respect to Dan and Dave, I dislike their magic, never have, and never will, purchase or own The Trilogy, let alone cite it as a source for card magic.

    2) Daniel Garcia clearly teaches using the pinky to pull down the top card, pivoting off the middle finger. I'd be happy to quote verbatim from the DVD too, but as you haven't heeded my previous quote, I'm not sure I should bother. You are however half correct in that he does use the middle finger as a pivot point for the card.

    3) The original Cardini Change does indeed use a break, as made obvious by the illustration in Card Manipulations, as cited above.
     
  9. Well, I've learned both changes. If you think otherwise, that's fine, as they are in essence very similar. I learned from DGP and other books as well so I'll stand by what I know. I do not own Card Manipulations, however.

    My claims are not "unfounded", and do not be as ignorant as to state as such. We both have our sources, and can agree to disagree.

    Ian
     
  10. Sorry Ian, I have to back up Praetoritevong. The first printed source for the Cardini change is Hugard's Card Manipulations. In fact, I haven't seen it described anywhere else, so I'd be interested to know where you've learned it from. The Cardini change uses a third-finger break, the Ego change uses no break, and Dan and Dave's modified Cardini change uses a little-finger break.
     
  11. Now I understand. The Cardini snap change, which is taught in Card Manipulations, is different from the Cardini change. I believe the change we know as Cardini is found in Card Control by Arthur Buckley. I did a little bit of research and found out that his Color Change (Instantaneous) is referred to as a Cardini.

    So you are right in talking about the Cardini snap change, but not the change we call a Cardini.

    Hope this cleared things up. If I'm still wrong, however, don't hesitate to let me know...

    Ian
     
  12. Where did you find out that the change in the Buckley book is called a Cardini? I'm not disputing that, I'm just interested.
     
  13. That's interesting Ian, I've just picked up my copy of Card Control upon reading your post. I'm not sure if what you've said is correct or not to be honest. I personally think that the most likely explanation is that you've learned the Cardini variation taught by D&D somehow or other... This is why, I'm looking at the description now in the Buckley book.

    Firstly, it says, "...the third finger of the left hand is slipped behind the [top] card" - Buckley is a little difficult to read at times, but I interpret this to mean that there is a third finger break. Since you were saying that your Cardini doesn't need a break at all, I don't think that this is the one you're thinking of.

    Furthermore, he goes on to say "...if the left fingers are straightened out the face card will be carried to a horizontal position" which again is something that does not appear to happen in your change (the card is carried up and away).

    Also, from this description, it is clear that the ring finger (third) is the one doing the work, which again is something that you did not seem to agree with based on your Cardini.

    On these reasons (the description as I interpret them does not appear to match your own description of what you believe the Cardini Change to be), I think you might be mistaken - the Buckley change appears to rather resemble the Cardini, actually.

    Also, in regards to the name and the history... As I hinted above... I believe that the confusion mostly arises from D&D's teaching of a variation of the change. I also vaguely recall reading that the "snap" in the name published in Card Manipulations was subsequently dropped to simply be more commonly known as the Cardini Colour Change, and hence the reason for the name change.

    And one final thing about the Buckley change: from my interpretation of the instructions, it appears that the deck is held "in the left hand between the four fingers and the thumb, facing the audience. The fingers are at the low side, thumb at the top side." For me, this means that the face literally is pointing outwards, which means it has one really big difference with either the Ego or the Cardini Change - namely, that in both of the latter, the deck sits face up, rather than face out.
     
  14. also, i would like to point out that puhge pass also look similar to cardini/ego(at least thats what me and my friends think)...
    so please refer them to this thread also...:D
     
  15. I had thought of that, but unfortunately I don't own Avenue, otherwise I would've. Anyone who does is welcome to add it, though.
     
  16. #17 Axel, Dec 29, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 29, 2009
    Ego vs. Cardini

    Guys, listen to me. The Ego and Cardini change are basically the same. Daniel Garcia made the Ego routine and just used the Cardini. But he just called it the Ego Change because it was in his routine. The Cardini Change was made by the master magician named Cardini. That's why it's called that. Now, for those who really own the Trilogy should watch the explanation for The Queens. Because Dave Buck says "Now do an ego or cardini change." The way they do it is a visual flick. DG does the top cover. Dave is just saying it doesn't matter what you call it, it's the same change. It just depends on how you execute it. I hope that clears everything up.
     
  17. Yes, and...?

    This thread simply tells you exactly what the differences are when you execute it. If you don't care, then simply ignore this thread, I don't understand. This thread is for people who are interested or curious in the details of the move.
     
  18. OK. I just wanted to clear up any confusion between the two.
     

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