Does anyone ever feel they spend too much $ on magic?

JD

Jul 5, 2009
638
1
Longview, Texas
I feel that way right now. In the past 2 months I've bought the following:

Spin
PowerWord Fall
Wizard Dark PK Ring
Vortex Pk Ring
Vortex Dvd
Astral Projection
Loops
Shudder
ParaLies
Ghost Ink
Tricks of the Mind
Pk Putty
2 Magnetic Cards
Bicycle Phoenix Deck(The copper deck)


I feel I have a problem with buying magic... And I still have a pretty big list of mentalism to get plus the TKO. :(
 
Apr 1, 2009
1,067
1
33
California
It depends on how smart you are with using it. It's your money spend as much as you want. I think it's dumb to say that just because you buy a lot that one should automatically assume you're going to study it all right away at once. It's good to have reference material. There are many times an idea from a completely different effect will be just what you need for the effect you are working on. Or a passage in a book giving you extra knowledge or advice on a dvd. There's much worse that you could be spending your money on... Drugs, alcohol, even fast food or gambling. Like the person above said, don't feel you NEED to buy something new cause you don't. but wanting something new is fine in my opinion. Freshen up your repertoire, takes away from getting boring. Change it up now and then. So as long as you aren't taking away from money you need and can still afford to pay your bills, child support (if that applies), feed your family (if that applies, have spare change. Have fun, enjoy the magic.
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,410
6
Sydney, Australia
YES - read Ortiz's the Next Book Syndrome (thanks for sharing that link!). Although these days it often should be The Next Trick Syndrome or the Next DVD Syndrome, but that's beside the point. It gives you an excellent perspective.

J.Slade - I know you've been asking around for some help recently, which is brilliant. To add a few words...

I've always disliked threads that go along the lines of, "What is the best ....... trick?" Basically, such threads are generally an attempt to try and find the bestest magic trick ever invented, so that the thread starter can Google (or worse) them, thus finding the strongest magic without having to actually do any research. This isn't what you've been doing, by the way but keep reading.

There are many reasons for disliking a practice like this. For one, magic is always subjective. I have found fantastic effects that I simply can't perform. It's not me, and I just can't imagine bringing some things to life - yet others make a living off these things. So out of respect for this fact, people need to realise that asking for the best magic will not actually give you the best magic for anything. If anything, it gives you an easier base to knock off (think about it - if you approach a book of tricks with no idea what's good or bad, you are forced to evaluate, by yourself, what you like - keywords being what YOU like, and therefore what will be strongest for you. If however you approach the same book with 5 recommendations, they are the ones you will of course automatically lean towards and try and perform, even if they don't suit you - it takes away the subjective judgment of the performer which is so important). So one needs to realise and respect this.

Another reason is this: my best effects are the combination of years of work, literally. My two favourite pieces currently have been constantly refined over the past 3 years or so. Many serious performers refine their works over a decade or more. Why should I give away this work to someone who, in all likelihood, will not perform it as well as possible and given it the attention that I have? There are two concerns here, one in terms of respecting my personal research and acknowledging the work that has gone in there (another reason why professional magicians rarely release works in their current repertoire). The second is simply butchering an effect. Again, the issue is to do with respecting magic.

So, finally, I come back to your point here. You haven't done any of these things, although a fair few people here have. But the point is, that the idea about spending money on magic is the same - respect the magic that you have. By all means, buy whatever you want, however much you want, and however much you can afford. But if it's gonna sit in your drawer, or get performed poorly, well, then it's too much. If you give what you buy the respect it deserves, then you won't be spending too much (within reason of course).

Oh, and remember that you have a life outside of magic (hopefully). Buy some nice clothes. Hell, buy a suit. Buy your girlfriend some roses. And if you don't have a girlfriend, quit magic, get a girlfriend, then come back to magic, life is waiting :p
 
Buying material, like what everyone else stated, is not always necessary.

Unless you're buyin' accessories. i.e IT, thumb tips, double backers, etc.

I'm going to quote the Virts on this:

"It's not what you do. It's how you do it."

Just know that even if you have a crapload of DVDs and/or books, you won't necessarily become a better magician. One reason is that you won't have time to practice all the effects/routines to the point where they can be performed at their highest potential.

If you have lesser effects/routines to learn, you can spend more time on them.

I personally haven't bought anything magic related for quite some time. (Besides playing cards. I'm a collector, so that doesn't count.) The last thing I've "learned" was the Spellbound routine on Ponta The Smith's "Sick" DVD. I'm still practicing it to this day. Sure, I may work on some card routines and maybe some mentalism now and then, but I never "move on" until I've had some mastery of my current/past material.

Spend time honing the skills of the material you already posess. You can evaluate what you like and what you don't like by doing so and that will help you decide what future material to move on to.
 
Jul 8, 2009
102
2
You asked about spending money so I will address that. Obvioulsy, how much money you spend is relative to what you have. Only you know what you can afford. I have been involved in some rather expensive hobbies over the years and can tell you for me I think many books, dvds, etc are a bargain. Take golf for example---Good driver $300, putter $150, irons $700. That is just the clubs---Pro V1 golf balls $45 a dozen, greens fees, practice range (or monthly dues at a club)---you get the point. Paying $15 for an ebook with 10 effects doesn't sound so expensive anymore. I have 4 or 5 effects that I rely on and that kill. I know I would not have all these if I had not also bought a bunch of crap as well. The bottom line--if you enjoy purchasing the effects and can afford it--no, you are not spending too much.
 

Mike.Hankins

creator / <a href="http://www.theory11.com/tricks/
Nov 21, 2009
435
0
Sacramento, Cali
Hey guys! Good topic...let me chime in on here.

When I first started out in magic, I was buying any and everything that I looked in the magic shop. I had as closet FULL of magic and didn't even know where to begin! But see, that is ok. That is what drives us. I would watch one VHS tape and then learn 2 or 3 tricks on there...practice for ohhhhhhhh 4 minutes and then would buy the next VHS tape. I would watch THAT VHS tape and then do the same thing. Same applied to tricks. I would buy the hottest trick, play with it for a month and then buy something else brand new. But what did I care? I was showing my friends and family. I wasn't a working pro...

Things for me have changed. Now that magic is a full time thing for me, I am very careful with what I buy. I am more focused on perfecting the routines I currently use, because that is what pays my bills for the most part. I NEED a strong set in order to bring in good $. The DVDs I buy are far and few now, as well as the tricks I purchase. I focus my attention more on lectures, conventions and the sort.

Once you start making magic a career, it will be a natural thing to WANT to slow down. Becuase when you book that first big paying gig, you are going to be l ike, "Where do I start?"

So is it bad that you want to spend money on magic? Not at all...because it will slow down with time. I promise. :)

Mike
 

RickEverhart

forum moderator / t11
Elite Member
Sep 14, 2008
3,637
471
46
Louisville, OH
Great thread gentleman. I know it has been discussed before here but many beginners need to hear this information from those of us who have been down the "spending spree" path.

This is the way I choose to spend. I know it sounds ridiculous but it works for me.
Any money that I make from a gig I spend going right back into magic. For example:
My last gig I made $150 for a 45 minute close up show and so I decided that I am going to purchase all the volumes of Card College. I know that this is a wise purchase because I will utilize this material and it will help expand my working knowledge.

In the beginning I would have gone out and spent the $150 on every little gimmick and trick that I could get out of it not caring whether it was a smart purchase. I just knew I had the money and would blow through it.

I do not use any money from our family account on magic. To me that is greedy and takes away from my family because I know I don't actually "need" any more magic. But because I "want" more magic...I rationalize it by getting myself gigs to cover my "wants". Ha Ha.

There are tons of threads about making smart purchases.
 
May 10, 2010
138
0
Oh, and remember that you have a life outside of magic (hopefully). Buy some nice clothes. Hell, buy a suit. Buy your girlfriend some roses. And if you don't have a girlfriend, quit magic, get a girlfriend, then come back to magic, life is waiting :p

Prae this has gotta one of the best lines I've heard in a while. Not in the I agree with you kind of way, but in the life needs some laughs kind of way. If what I said even makes sense... Oh well!

Anyways, when I started out I began with a deck of regular Bikes. Abused them, screwed them up. I still keep them though, they're good memories. But when I realized my old bikes weren't exactly taking me very far, cause they can no longer fan properly and they feel bad, I decided to get new cards. That was when I got crazy over custom decks.

I always thought custom decks are like, well, better than everything else. And to top it off they looked cooler. As a result I sorta spent a bomb stocking up several custom decks.

To date, many of these decks still stay open but barely used, sitting on my shelf.

Now I've come to realize how much I save when I buy regular Tallys or regular Bikes. These are cards I will frequently use, unlike the custom decks I leave sitting on my shelf for show. I may be regretting that I got them in the first place but hey, time can't be turned back. I'm not saying custom decks are a waste of money. If I say that, I'd probably be flooded with hate mail. I'm not gonna say that. It's true that custom decks are good. But it's just me, I don't use them much. I guess I'll stick to my regular Tallys and Bikes.

Perhaps now I start to spend less on cards, and more on other things. Say, clothes or whatever. Thing is, you can spend on magic. Just like me, I still spend on buying cards. Just this, don't overspend, and don't spend unnecessarily. Buy stuff that you will use, stuff you won't regret buying and stuff that don't just sit on your shelf.

Right now I'm still using regular Tallys, and regular Bikes. Abused them, screwed them up. But hey, they're worth my money. Probably every single cent.

Peace.
 

RickEverhart

forum moderator / t11
Elite Member
Sep 14, 2008
3,637
471
46
Louisville, OH
A lot of the money I make does go back into other items as well.

1.) Business Cards....this is a must.
2.) My website and to keep it up and running....not a must but definitely nice to have.
3.) Nice shirts and ties and sports coats for performing in.
4.) Nice shoes

The list goes on and on.

Prae does have a very valid point. There is life outside of magic. Family and friends and going out and doing other things is very healthy. Using magic money on others besides yourself makes you feel good and shows some generousity. I wish that i would get better at this. Even at my age of 32, I am a little self centered. Ha Ha.
 

JD

Jul 5, 2009
638
1
Longview, Texas
Prae's ridiculously long wall of text made a good bit of sense. I wish I could explain my thought process about buying all that stuff because I do have a reason but it's really hard to put into words. Oh well. Thanks everyone
 

CaseyRudd

Director of Operations
Team member
Jun 5, 2009
3,399
3,822
Charleston, SC
www.instagram.com
A lot of the money I make does go back into other items as well.

1.) Business Cards....this is a must.
2.) My website and to keep it up and running....not a must but definitely nice to have.
3.) Nice shirts and ties and sports coats for performing in.
4.) Nice shoes

The list goes on and on.

Prae does have a very valid point. There is life outside of magic. Family and friends and going out and doing other things is very healthy. Using magic money on others besides yourself makes you feel good and shows some generousity. I wish that i would get better at this. Even at my age of 32, I am a little self centered. Ha Ha.

Basing what Rick said about using magic money on others, I had an experience with this, that made me feel VERY good.

It was Father's Day, and my brother and I decided to take our whole family out to a nice and decent dinner at one of those Japanese Hibachi Grill places. I had racked up a little over 80 dollars doing street performing (magic of course). I agreed to my brother to pay half of the bill. The bill ended up being $140. I had to pay $70 from it. So now almost my entire savings is drained. But it was for my dad who had bought me many things in the first place with magic, and I wanted to show him that I could start paying for myself, and for others, just like he had done for me. I felt really good and proud of what my brother and I had done.

So spending on others, and besides yourself is very rewarding. I got back out there to perform, and racked in about 80 more dollars. Yes, I bought more magic; but when you buy more magic, think to yourself this question:

"Will I ever USE this in actual performance?"

If the answer is no, don't buy it. If the answer is yes and you are 100% certain you will, go ahead and do it. YOU earned the money it took to purchase it, and you earned the magic item.

Hope this helps guys.

-Casey
 

JD

Jul 5, 2009
638
1
Longview, Texas
True, and I did spend four long days powerwashing an INCREDIBLE amount for the last $300 I made. I see what you guys are saying about everything though
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,410
6
Sydney, Australia
Mike - Thanks for chipping in! I think there's a lot of truth to what you say. In particular, there's definitely a palpable difference between hobbyists and professionals... There's nothing wrong with being either, and of course whoever you are will affect your spending as well...

I do want to add though on this note that even hobbyists can have specific needs. A hobbyist for example typically performs informally, and therefore elaborate setups and gimmicks which may be feasible for parlour shows definitely are not for them. Bottom line is I guess just think about your purchases, as CRProductions has said. I would also add this test: Do you think about the possibilities? And, do you think about the possibilities a week or two weeks or a month later? If so, then it's on the right track. If I forget about it though and get caught up in some other product, then that's also a sign...

J.Slade - Yeah, I know there was a fair bit of text, sorry... I do that in real life as well >.>

n0va_jason - No worries! :)

reverhart - Mmm. I had my anniversary just a few days ago, and I think my wallet's gonna hurt for a while yet :p
 
Dec 5, 2007
376
0
Its easy to get caught up in this kind of habbit.

You see a product and think, "Oh this looks so good! Just imagine how good this will make my show" then when you get it you find out that it was pretty awsome, but not as awsome that you first thought so you start to look for the next product that you think will make your show awsome.

Darwin Ortiz talks about in in Designing Miracles, most magicians are always on the quest for the perfect trick, a trick thats as close to real magic as possible. The magic dealers know that so they try to make it look like it. We have all seen the "Looks and feels like real magic" adds.

The problem is that the perfect trick does not exist and as soon as you realise that you can take what you have to the next level and make it as close to real magic as you can.


If you try to tackle too much you will almost always end up with nothing.
 
Apr 5, 2009
874
1
29
Illinois
Its easy to get caught up in this kind of habbit.

You see a product and think, "Oh this looks so good! Just imagine how good this will make my show" then when you get it you find out that it was pretty awsome, but not as awsome that you first thought so you start to look for the next product that you think will make your show awsome.

Darwin Ortiz talks about in in Designing Miracles, most magicians are always on the quest for the perfect trick, a trick thats as close to real magic as possible. The magic dealers know that so they try to make it look like it. We have all seen the "Looks and feels like real magic" adds.

The problem is that the perfect trick does not exist and as soon as you realise that you can take what you have to the next level and make it as close to real magic as you can.


If you try to tackle too much you will almost always end up with nothing.

gotta love Mr. Ortiz great post fridoliina
 
May 3, 2008
1,146
4
Hong Kong
Heres my method of keeping it smart when buying magic products.
-I stick with brick and mortar shops. Never do I buy online.
-I only visit the shop when I know what I am buying and I know it is in stock. This way when you go there, you already have what you want and you have already spent a portion of your money. Anything extra will require more thinking.
-Unless I have an expensive product in mind, I provide myself with an... "allowance" which I bring to the shop. Its usually only a bit more than what I plan to buy.
-I limit myself to going once every 3 months or even longer... I havent been in 1 year already. If you are thinking about a product for that long and it still holds value... then I would say go for it.
-I go with nothing on me. I don't ask for a plastic bag. I buy what I can carry without looking like a jackass on the public transport and street.

and as said before... theres more to life than magic. Getting laid is definitely more fun than buying a new deck of cards

This usually works...
 
Dec 5, 2007
376
0
gotta love Mr. Ortiz great post fridoliina

Yeah Mr.Ortiz is amazing.:)

I used to spend way to much money on magic before i read Designing Miracles by Darwin Ortiz. I dont remember exactly what he is saying there but he says something about how most magicians are always looking for the perfect effect and what a waste of time and money it is because you will never find it.

I remember that one example that Darwin gives is magic add saying stuff like "No rough and smooth, no magnets, no threads! and the magician goes "OMG OMG" REAL MAGIC!!!! I NEED TO HAVE IT! only to find out that it does not use rough and smooth, magnets or threads but it uses scotch tape and he gets dissapointed again. Then Darwin asks, what was wrong with rough and smooth in the first place?

After i read that book i realised that all the secrets i had been looking for were right infront of me and the only thing that will make you "great" is hard work,
.
 
Sep 3, 2007
1,231
0
YES - read Ortiz's the Next Book Syndrome (thanks for sharing that link!). Although these days it often should be The Next Trick Syndrome or the Next DVD Syndrome, but that's beside the point. It gives you an excellent perspective.

J.Slade - I know you've been asking around for some help recently, which is brilliant. To add a few words...

I've always disliked threads that go along the lines of, "What is the best ....... trick?" Basically, such threads are generally an attempt to try and find the bestest magic trick ever invented, so that the thread starter can Google (or worse) them, thus finding the strongest magic without having to actually do any research. This isn't what you've been doing, by the way but keep reading.

There are many reasons for disliking a practice like this. For one, magic is always subjective. I have found fantastic effects that I simply can't perform. It's not me, and I just can't imagine bringing some things to life - yet others make a living off these things. So out of respect for this fact, people need to realise that asking for the best magic will not actually give you the best magic for anything. If anything, it gives you an easier base to knock off (think about it - if you approach a book of tricks with no idea what's good or bad, you are forced to evaluate, by yourself, what you like - keywords being what YOU like, and therefore what will be strongest for you. If however you approach the same book with 5 recommendations, they are the ones you will of course automatically lean towards and try and perform, even if they don't suit you - it takes away the subjective judgment of the performer which is so important). So one needs to realise and respect this.

Another reason is this: my best effects are the combination of years of work, literally. My two favourite pieces currently have been constantly refined over the past 3 years or so. Many serious performers refine their works over a decade or more. Why should I give away this work to someone who, in all likelihood, will not perform it as well as possible and given it the attention that I have? There are two concerns here, one in terms of respecting my personal research and acknowledging the work that has gone in there (another reason why professional magicians rarely release works in their current repertoire). The second is simply butchering an effect. Again, the issue is to do with respecting magic.

So, finally, I come back to your point here. You haven't done any of these things, although a fair few people here have. But the point is, that the idea about spending money on magic is the same - respect the magic that you have. By all means, buy whatever you want, however much you want, and however much you can afford. But if it's gonna sit in your drawer, or get performed poorly, well, then it's too much. If you give what you buy the respect it deserves, then you won't be spending too much (within reason of course).

Oh, and remember that you have a life outside of magic (hopefully). Buy some nice clothes. Hell, buy a suit. Buy your girlfriend some roses. And if you don't have a girlfriend, quit magic, get a girlfriend, then come back to magic, life is waiting :p

Dude, you know me and I'm not about to say how awesome your post is. But, I will say that is is good. If I ever have a problem I'll ask you to help. And if you ever have one I will help till I'm dead. Take care bro.
 
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