The question still pops up from time totime, "Is Cardistry Magic?" The response by flourishers is usually, well no but it never was meant to be. There are still old guys out there that are anti- flourish. I don't understand why this still persists!
Is Cardistry Magic?
- Thread starter Josh Burch
- Start date
I love Cardistry, it's not my expertise and I have a very limited repertoire of it, but I do enjoy it quite a lot. It definitely has it's place in magic. I think doing a little flourishing when introducing yourself to a group of people for the first time when wanting to show them some magic is a good thing. It shows people immediately that you're not their "Uncle Joe" who likes showing the same pick-a-card trick during Thanksgiving for the last 15 consecutive years.
I'm not talking about walking up to someone and doing a 6 packet Sybil and saying "Hey, wanna see some magic!?"No... more like a Charlie cut on the off beat. I have a magic effect that incorporates the Revolution cut because I feel that Cardistry can enhance a magic effect in small doses.
Magic and Cardistry are by no means mutually exclusive.
|| Steven
I'm not talking about walking up to someone and doing a 6 packet Sybil and saying "Hey, wanna see some magic!?"No... more like a Charlie cut on the off beat. I have a magic effect that incorporates the Revolution cut because I feel that Cardistry can enhance a magic effect in small doses.
Magic and Cardistry are by no means mutually exclusive.
|| Steven
Cardistry CAN LOOK like magic. But it lacks several elements that would make it magic.
The big thing missing in cardistry is that it lacks a plot. You're taking a deck, spreading it out in an elaborate formation, and folding it back like an accordion. It's a bit like MadTV's 'Stewart' character. 'Look what I can do!'
As been said, it can be more of an 'enhancer' to magic. To which I fully agree. But I don't see cardistry being the standalone job that will pay the bills and will enchant an audience for an hour like magic can.
The big thing missing in cardistry is that it lacks a plot. You're taking a deck, spreading it out in an elaborate formation, and folding it back like an accordion. It's a bit like MadTV's 'Stewart' character. 'Look what I can do!'
As been said, it can be more of an 'enhancer' to magic. To which I fully agree. But I don't see cardistry being the standalone job that will pay the bills and will enchant an audience for an hour like magic can.
In my opinion, Cardistry adds an element to magic that magic itself doesn't have.... If that makes sense?
I wouldn't call Cardistry magic in the same way I wouldn't call Contact Juggling magic. It can look magical, but it is not being presented as a magic trick/effect. However, the use of Cardistry in magic has been around for a long time, as flourishes. Take the fan for example. That is a flourish through and through. There's nothing magical about it. But the idea of fanning a deck and having a spectator pick a card is synonymous with magic; as is a ribbon spread, or the bridge after a riffle shuffle. Flourishing is everywhere in magic, and I guarantee those "anti-flourish" guys you're referring to use a fan or a dribble in their routines. So to answer you original question, Cardistry(as we know it today) may be a little too flashy in magic for some performers, but flourishes have always and will always have a place in magic.
I think that Cardistry is trying to change people's minds. People have a wrong idea, and it is that all Cardists are magicians. Thats absolutely wrong. Last time I was at the airport and I began to practice Cardistry and a man came to me and told me to show him a trick. That's just an example. I personally just add a charlier cut or a bullet in my magic routines because it seems flashy and cool, but I disagree with people who tries to show skill when performing magic. You don't want the spectator to think: oh he's quick, he is just trying to fool me.
Both artforms are great, but Cardistry and magic are different in many ways. Just my opinion.
Both artforms are great, but Cardistry and magic are different in many ways. Just my opinion.
Cardistry and Magic are like Wine and Cheese, they complement eachother well but at the end of the day wine is not cheese and cheese is not wine.
cardistry is the best way to grab someone's attention to show a trick , it is like a silent opening trick . the post above gives proof
Wait what? So you agree that cardistry is not magic, it is a separate artform (what Daniel said). Yet you say that cardistry (different than magic) is the best way to grab someone's attention to show a trick (magic) because it (refering to cardistry) is like a opening trick (magic). Or to simplify what you did, you agree that the two are different and contradict yourself in the same post.
I think he's saying that cardistry is just a good way to get your foot in the door without having to approach someone. Cold calling.
He's lumping the term 'trick' together with cardistry trick and magic 'trick' (more correct term would be 'effect') together.
From my understanding, the trick is the magical procedure, or what the magician actually performs. The effect is the spectator's impression and reaction.
Splitting hairs, I know!
Nah, not splitting hairs. I'LL split the hairs now.
Themagi01's comment does leave a bit of an open ended 'what is going on here?'. If the desired end-effect is the spectators positive reaction--and (to me, it seems) that all cardistry IS is the acknowledgement from others to recognize your skill. Is he talking about going from one effect and rolling right into another? Or could he be doing
Now, onto 'trick VS effect'
I've interpreted 'trick' as two things:
1) A corporeal gimmick that is known to the magician. I cringe whenever I hear the term 'Let me show you a trick.' because that translates to me as 'let me show you something RIGGED!' Even if you ARE holding something rigged, say something like: 'May I SHARE something with you?'
2) I work with a lot of prop magic. I use the term 'trick' in referring to the corporeal magic item(s) with NOTHING being done to it or with them. Like if I showed you the contents of my travel magic case, I would tell you that I have seven 'tricks' inside.
The way I interpreted Themagi01's post was that if he's doing cardistry and rolls right into an effect; I'm going to make a safe bet that they aren't doing cardistry with any rigged cards inside THAT deck (even if they are false shuffling-flourishing a specific deck setup with a regular deck. I don't consider this a corporeal gimmick because the deck can be shown/handed out for inspection depending on what you do).
An 'effect', to me, is the whole routine. Your script, the patter, the character, the selection of what magic you decide to utilize; all rolled into one. You get their attention from the start and everything within your routine is meant to keep them there and interested until the end. Because they could just say 'no' and/or walk away at any time. Keep their interest there with your patter, character, and magic done all at the same time.
I don't think the reaction matters nearly as much as keeping a spectator involved in the little world and scenario you create and keeping them there. Be a good 'tour guide', not the magician that wants people to watch what they do.
I agree with you, but it depends on your style and situation. I think they are different artforms but they are related. If I want to call the attention what I do 70% of the time is a giant spring, and the other 30% of the time I make a Sybil or card twirling. What I meant above was that some magicians incorporate Cardistry in the middle of a magic routine, which in my opinion makes the spectator lose his or her ilusion in some moment. I perform Cardistry before magic only for people to notice me and notice what I am doing. Sorry if you understood something else.
If I want to call the attention I take out my deck and begin to make Cardistry for people to notice me. When I have all the attention from the people I proceed to show some magic. Like Themagi01 said, Cardistry can be used as an opening trick, if you see it like that. Cardistry brings you a lot of possibilities, not only that one. Honestly, I think Cardistry is the best way to call someone's attention, just because it is something people is not used to see.
I think the hard part about smooth incorporation of cardistry moves in the middle of a routine is making the flourish a relevant addition and not just a superfluous, flashy detractor (unless you're going for the most complicated double lift ever).
For example. I do a one-handed 'cutting the aces' routine and I use Erdnase Go Round to reveal an ace. normally, the ace production would require a packet flip. EGR just does the same thing, but adds more of a show while doing the job.
You said it, it is used to reveal a card or to produce cards. That's totally fine. I mean to incorporate for example Cylinder, which has nothing to do with magic. I think it's ok if you make some cardistry before or after your magic performance, but in the middle of the routine, definitely not my style.
R. Paul Wilson just posted a relevant and interesting article about this topic. Thought I would share.
http://machinebreak.blogspot.co.uk/2015/04/flourishing-is-bullshit-and-heres-why.html?m=1
http://machinebreak.blogspot.co.uk/2015/04/flourishing-is-bullshit-and-heres-why.html?m=1
I love this, he says what I wanted to say better than I ever could have. What a great article.