Question on "No more gaff cards" by USPCC

Discussion in 'Product Questions and Reviews' started by LLin, Dec 10, 2009.

  1. #1 LLin, Dec 10, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 10, 2009
    I've been reading several posts in several magic forums and I've just noticed that USPCC was stopping the production of gaffs that changes the back design/Ace or any other trademark feature of Bicycle cards. Does it only apply to Bicycle cards or all of USPCC's products? If it only apply to Bicycle cards then maybe gaffs can be made with other brands, say,Aviator, Bees, Aladdin (Make the bunny run away or something) etc. Any comments?
  2. Apparently they are going to discontinue cards which modify the following things.

    -The back of the bicycle playing card
    -The ace of spades
    -The jokers

    as they are a trademark of USPCC

    Utility cards such as blanks and double backs will still be available.
    Marked decks, gaff decks will be gone.

    That is what I heard a few months ago however it might have changed.
  3. Yelp that was what I said. However, my question is whether it only apply to Bicycle cards or all of USPCC's products. Any ideas?
  4. Just bikes I think.
  5. I think it is ridiculous. You would thing with the growing magic industry, that there would be a lot of business coming in because of gaffs. Perhaps there is more money in maintaining the consistency of the cards for the poker industry.

    I wonder how the phoenix deck will do. I personally don't like the design at all.
  6. Growing magic industry?

    To be honest, I believe the magic industry is just as seclusive as it's always been. Granted, it's much more available these days, but it's probably still a very minor, expendable avenue of income as far as the entire playing card industry is concerned.

    Personally, I don't think it will really affect the majority of card magicians anyway. I really think this hype is just a lot of overreacting. Now that certain gaffs won't be available, it's as if everyone forgot how to do sleight-of-hand.

    Just my opinion,


  7. Sorry to tell you but the magic industry for major card producers is mearly a niche market. In comparison to the Casinos, magicians hold no water to the amount of cards that are used. The Casino business is much more lucrative for a company such as USPCC.

    Also, If I recall, they have made this decision due to copy right infringements. By USPCC producing cards that went outside their usual copyrights (Back, joker and AoS) and modified these designs, they have much more trouble in the courts if/when they try to shut down a counterfeit operation.

    You will probably see some form of Gaff decks in the future but you will not have any of the jokers, Ace of Spade, or backs being modified.
  8. #8 tmac5454, Dec 10, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 10, 2009
    Good point and I didn't want to comment on my first post without quoting you.

    In some ways, we magicians, can look at this as a positive. We now have to rely on our presentation and the tricks we incorporate into our routines to add that extra "wow" factor that comes sometimes with gaffs. Your audience's amazement is going to come from how you manage them, how emotionally attached the become to your words, so that when you pull of your sleights they don't see it as a trick any more but as something impossible made possible.
  9. so no more ellusionist card gaffs?
  10. The amount of gaff cards/decks ever sold by the USPCC is the same amount of regular decks used by Las Vegas Casino's in a day.

    I just made that up, but the point is that USPCC won't care what magician's say because it's a niche market.
  11. Outside of Casino's, which don't use the manufactured brands that are over the counter, who is a bigger over the counter purchaser of playing cards?

    Darwin Ortiz goes through 400 decks a year or more - and I have gotten close in my career days during University. Most families buy one deck and keep it for as long as they can, I have known people to keep decks for a year or more. This means that nearly 400 families have to buy decks, just to make up what one magician buys from them.

    I don't think it is as much of a niche market as you would imagine. Ellusionist brought out Black Tiger decks, and their first run sold out in under 3 days. I think it was even under 2. Do you forget the history of novelty decks?

    Only USPCC decks really existed, they made red and blue in various styles, really only a few. When Ellusionist came to the market with new decks, USPCC said...OHHH, wow, there is a market out there, one that turned Ellusionist from your average web site that sold props, to one that commanded attention and started hosting named magicians. The site blew up.

    USPCC followed up by putting out crappy pink, green, and blue decks that looked JUST like the Tiger decks. The only problem...they didn't realize how horrible they were for gaming, because the suits all looked the same. Basically, bad stock (no card pun intended).

    Moreover, this "different" deck idea became so popular, it created a lucritive industry that Lee Asher, the Buck Twins, Richard Turner, and so on, have cashed in on.

    By the way, a nod to Asher for realizing the value of something different with Nuggets YEARS ago, I digress.

    The point is this - sure, Magicians don't make up the mass numbers that Casinos do, but we are not as Niche as you may think. We make up a large percentage of card consumers...every T n R plot, Card Warp, signed card, solid deception, and any trick that ruins a deck...means you are buying another one sooner or later...much sooner than Mom and Pop who bought one for the cottage and pull it out over the summer...and even though the 5 of spades is dog earred, and the box is lost, and their a rubber band around it...they won't buy a new one until a card is missing.

    The truth is this:

    Because it is worth much effort, and gimmicks don't sell as well as decks do - it isn't worth the time/cost to the consumer to continue to make certain gimmicks.

    One quesetion, I am unaware of, when you say the backs - does that mean no more double facers?

    IT is odd to think that making black backs, faces, or any variation of these cards actually costs them money? You would think the opposite was true with saving on ink - good ol factory machines are too efficient.
  12. Morgician, you are issing the main point.

    USPCC does not want to get into trouble about copyright issues, so they stopped produced gaffs which changed the Ace of spades and back design as they are under USPCC's copyrights

    'Normal' gaffs like double backers, double face, blank face ETC. will still be available at request, but they won't print it unless another company orders it. This is so they don't have to store the gaffs.

    Also, USPCC knows that magicians are not that little of a niche market, but they want to protect their copyright. An open letter from USPCC to magicians can be found somewhere in the web.

    Simply put, no more twilight angels, and normal gaffs available at request
  13. LLin, I am not Missing the point.

    I can't stand when people put out unfounded comments like, Magicians are a niche market, when we aren't. The IBM is a pretty well off organization, thanks to magician dues. So are "issing the point" my friend.

    I just wanted to clear up the "niche" market comments.

    As far as the other gaffs...I knew and understand that. Life goes on.

    I wasn't sure about the rest "normal" gaffs, which is an awesome oxymoron.

    As for the rest - hey, whatever...not every packet trick is around forever either. I won't lose much sleep over it.

  14. You really shouldn't have to worry about it. If you really want to Gaff the backs or whatever, just do what they did in the old days and do it yourself.
  15. Well said Morgician.
  16. Thanks JT, I am sure one day the doors will reopen - God forbid we gain gimmicks but lost cards totally...what would we all do? Coin work. That doesn't fool ANYONE! Ha j/k sort of.
  17. I was thinking Aladdin gaffs =D
  18. I don't use Disney cards. Anyhow, what do you need gaffs for when you can use the Genii for some magic!?
  19. Lol. I meant Aladdin 1001. Those cool ones which Dan and Dave use. Heheh. There's already a svengali deck made out of Aladdins.
  20. Glad you wrote lol, or I would have thought you read it seriously. Cool beans - this thread is toast...OR IS IT?

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