Richard Turners Gold Seal Bicycle Deck...

Feb 9, 2010
9
0
Traditionally cut?

I found that there are a BUNCH of decks out there currently sold that are traditionally cut without the advertising and price mark-up.

Here are the few I've listed that are traditionally cut (cut from the face):

Bicycle Vintage Series
David Blaine Split Spades
Lee Asher 605s
Bees (someone told me it's not but the ones I have table faro face down out of the box so I assume mine are traditionally cut, but there are reports that Bee may have discontinued that cut)

I'm sure there are a bunch of others that are traditionally cut. From what I understand, what makes the Richard Turner cards special is that they are "traditionally cut" but that implies it is unique. It is clearly not. And the price mark-up versus the decks above doesn't help its cause (from where I am, those decks cost 8.95 each whereas the ones I listed above are ~4.95).

I also find these "traditional cut" cards useful ONLY for table faro. What other use is there for this? My double-lifts/palms/springs/flourishes don't improve from the cut. What is the hype?
 
Feb 4, 2008
959
2
My understanding is that they used Bee stock and finish with a Bicycle paint job. So I understood that it was geared towards guys who love gambling demos and wanted Bee performance with a deck that looks like a Bike. It is also good for folks with Bike gaffs who just prefer the performance of a Bee. I could be talking out of my a$$ here. All I have really done is read the add and made some assumptions from that. I'm kind of curious myself.
 
Feb 9, 2010
9
0
Update: I just found out the Centurions are always "traditionally" cut. This Richard Turner Gold Seal deck is getting less unique by the minute.
 
May 2, 2010
207
1
35
New York, New York
Traditionally cut?

I found that there are a BUNCH of decks out there currently sold that are traditionally cut without the advertising and price mark-up.

Here are the few I've listed that are traditionally cut (cut from the face):

Bicycle Vintage Series
David Blaine Split Spades
Lee Asher 605s
Bees (someone told me it's not but the ones I have table faro face down out of the box so I assume mine are traditionally cut, but there are reports that Bee may have discontinued that cut)

I'm sure there are a bunch of others that are traditionally cut. From what I understand, what makes the Richard Turner cards special is that they are "traditionally cut" but that implies it is unique. It is clearly not. And the price mark-up versus the decks above doesn't help its cause (from where I am, those decks cost 8.95 each whereas the ones I listed above are ~4.95).

I also find these "traditional cut" cards useful ONLY for table faro. What other use is there for this? My double-lifts/palms/springs/flourishes don't improve from the cut. What is the hype?

I have richards bikes and bees and I like them. They are made to Richards standards. Even though the above is traditional cut some dont like them and prefer bikes and bees.

Now I must ask where your from because 8.95 is a damm rip off. I get Richards bikes and bees from penguin for 3.95 and the bikes are 5 dollars at tannens where I visit every wk.

who ever is charging 8.95 for them are crooks. I never paid anywhere near that.

Kind regards,

Mike
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,434
6
Sydney, Australia
I have richards bikes and bees and I like them. They are made to Richards standards. Even though the above is traditional cut some dont like them and prefer bikes and bees.

Now I must ask where your from because 8.95 is a damm rip off. I get Richards bikes and bees from penguin for 3.95 and the bikes are 5 dollars at tannens where I visit every wk.

who ever is charging 8.95 for them are crooks. I never paid anywhere near that.

Kind regards,

Mike

It's impossible to find a pack of regular Bikes for anything less than $10/deck at a magic or card shop here in Sydney. I plan to bring an additional small suitcase whenever I am next in the US. Don't complain :p
 
May 2, 2010
207
1
35
New York, New York
It's impossible to find a pack of regular Bikes for anything less than $10/deck at a magic or card shop here in Sydney. I plan to bring an additional small suitcase whenever I am next in the US. Don't complain :p

I wasnt complaining Praetoritevong, but somtimes I do lol. I was just making a point. There are the exceptions like Australia and others where its like that thats why I was asking where the poster was from so I can have and Idea why they were so much.

What cards are usually available to you in Sydney?? I have a few friends that I met on the cafe fourms telling me that they are crazy to get bikes there and many other USPCC deck out there.

I know you guys have the toughest customs in the world so I imagine overseas packages take awhile to get to you until they are approved.


Kind regards

Mike
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,434
6
Sydney, Australia
I wasnt complaining Praetoritevong, but somtimes I do lol. I was just making a point. There are the exceptions like Australia and others where its like that thats why I was asking where the poster was from so I can have and Idea why they were so much.

What cards are usually available to you in Sydney?? I have a few friends that I met on the cafe fourms telling me that they are crazy to get bikes there and many other USPCC deck out there.

I know you guys have the toughest customs in the world so I imagine overseas packages take awhile to get to you until they are approved.


Kind regards

Mike

In Sydney, I'm reasonably lucky in the sense that there are two big magic shops here. Theoretically, I can get any deck that's put out. However, some custom decks (Split Spades, Vipers and some others come to mind) go for about $20/deck.

In a normal card/games shop, well, there's one downstairs. At various times I have seen Bikes, Bees, Pro Peeks, Jumbo Index Bikes and maybe one or two others than aren't coming to mind, but that's about it, Bikes and Bees. Any other USPCC deck I've never seen sold at a normal for-laymen store.

But with magic shops - honestly, I understand the price mark up, at least some of the time, but it's far cheaper buying online from eBay and so forth.

In other cities, it really depends. Basically the further away from the large cities (i.e. Sydney and Melbourne, really), the hardest it gets to find even normal decks...

The customs is pretty tough, but I find the magic purchases usually come through pretty quick. It's only if the sender is slow normally that the package comes through late. Around 2 weeks for the most basic shipping is pretty normal.

To the OP: I just realised that one of my responses above was short and could have been construed as somewhat rude. I'm sorry - it was not intended that way, and I meant it in the context of a respectful, albeit short, suggestion, and no offense and/or curtness was intended.
 
May 23, 2010
157
0
Singapore
Just to add on to the list of traditionally cut decks , most casino decks (Wynns , Jerry's Nuggets , Aristocrat Casino decks) are traditionally cut.And I wonder why the decks are expensive in Australia as Prae stated.....
 
Feb 4, 2008
959
2
I think high prices for cards are pretty standard for everyplace save Europe and North America. In Korea(where I currently reside) a deck of bikes goes for about $7.00. That makes it pretty easy for me to justify unique brands. Anglo Rug backs cost me $6.00 and Gycklaren shipping is pretty reasonable. Lee Asher's 605s may be a bit more expensive but when I add in their durability they are still a much better deal than buying 808s.
 
Jun 10, 2010
1,361
1
What exactly is a traditional cut? And what other forms of "deck-cutting" are there? Furthermore, besides the aforementioned decks, what other decks are traditionally cut?
 
Feb 4, 2008
959
2
Here is a quote from an ad from another of Richard Turner's cards....
Unlike most cards, the cutting punch used in "traditional cut" cards starts at the card face and punches through to the back. As a result, a sharp edge is created on the backside of each card and a rounded edge, which facilitates easier card shuffling, is formed on the card's face.

Traditionally cut cards ensure that card men and magicians can easily interlace the cards to produce crisp, clean shuffles, especially with some of the more intricate shuffling techniques like the one-hand shuffle and the faro shuffles.

Traditionally cut cards were the norm until about 15 years ago when they flipped the card sheets causing the blade to start the cut through the back, which makes for a non user friendly deck where they bind or jam when trying to faro or do a one-hand shuffle.
 
May 2, 2010
207
1
35
New York, New York
What exactly is a traditional cut? And what other forms of "deck-cutting" are there? Furthermore, besides the aforementioned decks, what other decks are traditionally cut?

"traditional cut" cards starts at the card face and punches through to the back. As a result, a sharp edge is created on the backside of each card and a rounded edge, which facilitates easier card shuffling, is formed on the card's face. ex: table faros and one handed shuffles.

non-traditionally cut cards process by which the blades go through the back of the card first.

As long as you learn and use proper technique it really wouldnt matter if they are traditional cut or not. I will admit though the weave is smooth as hell which is a plus and helps to ensure a perfect weave.

honestly it comes down to what feels good to the user. One might swear by it the other might bash it.
 
Jul 13, 2010
526
34
I also find these "traditional cut" cards useful ONLY for table faro. What other use is there for this? My double-lifts/palms/springs/flourishes don't improve from the cut. What is the hype?
In my mind they´re just that...hype. I ordered some Gold Seal decks and other than the card stock (bee card stock) I can´t feel much of a difference. It´s often said they faro right out of the box but you can do perfect faros right out of the box with normal bicycles without any problems. I never do table faros, so the cut is not that important to me.
For the price I can get two phoenix decks which are also traditionally cut, but with the standard bicycle stock. That hardly justifies the huge difference between prices and isn´t worth it.
Furthermore two of the decks were clearly off-center and that sucks for such 'quality cards'. Quality control? Not really!
I expect perfection from cards in that price range.
I don´t blame Richard Turner, because the feeling of the cards is good and he can´t control the print.
Well, maybe....he can feel the difference between a blue and a red bicycle deck by the consistence of the ink ;)
 
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Feb 9, 2010
9
0
In my mind they´re just that...hype. I ordered some Gold Seal decks and other than the card stock (bee card stock) I can´t feel much of a difference. It´s often said they faro right out of the box but you can do perfect faros right out of the box with normal bicycles without any problems. I never do table faros, so the cut is not that important to me.
For the price I can get two phoenix decks which are also traditionally cut, but with the standard bicycle stock. That hardly justifies the huge difference between prices and isn´t worth it.
Furthermore two of the decks were clearly off-center and that sucks for such 'quality cards'. Quality control? Not really!
I expect perfection from cards in that price range.
I don´t blame Richard Turner, because the feeling of the cards is good and he can´t control the print.
Well, maybe....he can feel the difference between a blue and a red bicycle deck by the consistence of the ink ;)

You can do table faro even with the newer cut decks. I don't know the name of it but you can just do the push together faro starting from the top of the card on each deck half. I don't get why most people have an obsession to do a table faro by riffling action. It is:
1. Slow
2. Harder to get perfect
3. Bends your cards

There is absolutely no point to do a table faro unless you are:
1. Stuck with a traditional cut deck and therefore can't do the push together faro
 
Jul 13, 2010
526
34
You can do table faro even with the newer cut decks. I don't know the name of it but you can just do the push together faro starting from the top of the card on each deck half. I don't get why most people have an obsession to do a table faro by riffling action. It is:
1. Slow
2. Harder to get perfect
3. Bends your cards

There is absolutely no point to do a table faro unless you are:
1. Stuck with a traditional cut deck and therefore can't do the push together faro
Do you mean the in the hands weave faro by push-together faro?
I do in the hand faro regardless of the cut. I just have to flip the deck (or weave in the other direction) ;)
I´m not sure, because I never do or have ever tried a table faro (I´m not a sleight fanatic who practices sleights he´ll never use;) ), but isn´t a traditionally cut deck prefered by people doing table faros because it´s easier for them to do it face down (with a non-traditionally-cut deck you have to use a face up deck or change the direction of the weaving action?! ) ?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Feb 9, 2010
9
0
Do you mean the in the hands weave faro by push-together faro?
I do in the hand faro regardless of the cut. I just have to flip the deck (or weave in the other direction) ;)
I´m not sure, because I never do or have ever tried a table faro (I´m not a sleight fanatic who practices sleights he´ll never use;) ), but isn´t a traditionally cut deck prefered by people doing table faros because it´s easier for them to do it face down (with a non-traditionally-cut deck you have to use a face up deck or change the direction of the weaving action?! ) ?

Sort of, I don't see people really doing it (I saw Lee Asher do it once). Basically its a push together faro but the table supports the deck moreso than the hands holding them in the air. It's a faro that takes about 0.5 seconds. It also puts you in the position to do a fancy table bridge.

I think outside of Lee Asher, I'm the only one so far I know of that does this and everyone always says it looks really cool.

The table faro to me is pretty much a useless move because of the above move which is infinitely easier to pull off, looks better, its faster. The table faro should only be used if you're stuck with a traditionally cut deck. There is NO other reason for doing it.
 
Jul 13, 2010
526
34
I´ve heard that the new Mandolin cards are also traditionally cut.
Hopefully they will not be in the same price range than the RT decks. But I doubt it.
 
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