Sharing Magic With Other Magicians

[wavehead15]

I have had a disagreement with another magician and i wanted to know ur alls opinion.

If you buy a magic dvd say....uh Dangerous by dM. Since you pay for that dvd does that mean that you shouldnt tell other magicians the methods just because you bought the dvd?

Also, should you share any tricks with other magicians at all?

The other magician thinks that "magicians never reveal their secrets" applies even when speaking with other magicians and not just laymen. Also, he thinks that the no exposure rules on the forums prove that secrets should not be shared with other magicians.

The only reason the no exposure rule is on the forums is because it is the internet and non magicians can access them as well. Not because magicians shouldnt share secrets amongst themselves.

Personally i would tell any magician a method to a trick if they wanted to know because i believe that all magicians are supposed to share and help out other magicians.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks!

 

[cm763]

Personally, I think it's okay to share any secret with a fellow magician. However, if I do that, I also cite my source. Why? It's not so I feel more ethical after sharing a secret. Rather, so they can go directly to the source to learn the trick the way it was meant to be taught. Being human, I tend to overlook some subtleties that may be important (although not essential to the trick), somewhat like you would see on a YouTube exposure video (note: I don't make exposure videos, nor do I share secrets over the internet, so please don't ask)--just the essentials are really taught. If they want all the subtleties, or alternate handlings, they can feel free to support the artist and buy the DVD (or lecture notes, or book, etc).

Edit: As a side note, the only magician I've ever actually shared any secrets with is my brother. I'm a greedy one, so I prefer keeping things to myself. The above is more hypothetical than anything. With that said, he's purchased every effect that he actually performs. I act more as an advertisement to him than anything, heh.

 

[Volcan]

I only share secrets with other magicians if the trick is my own creation, and I rarely ever do that.

 

[FOO:L]

In accordance to how the poll question was phrased - I dont think magicians SHOULD share with other magicians. People are free to discuss whatever they want. Its a matter of personal preference on which effects should be "revealed" and which shouldnt.
Personally, I rarely share effects with other magicians. Especially if they're stumped by it. It just shows them that they should go buy the trick themselves and support the brilliant artist.
If you decided it was an obligation to freely give secrets away, then every other person that can do a double lift and decideds that they are a "magicians" would know some of our best kept and hardest hitting illusions.

 

[Zeedub81]

I am the "other magician" that he is talking about.

Let me tell you the story:

He became angry because I didn't let him borrow my Dangerous dvd. (he wanted make a copy of it.) I paid $50 for it and he didn't. After he got the message that I wouldn't let him have it, he illegally downloaded it from some torrent. (just like he did with Believe). Then the email arguments started up. Eventually he couldn't argue with my point and didn't relpy. Later that day I checked my website and it says this:

http://zeedub.weebly.com/

Back in July after my video "The Train" came out, my youtube page got hacked. I now know who it was.

Back to the present:

After my new video "Underground" came out I found this comment:

"wildman360 says:
this was just like the train. i was looking for something different. like everyone else says, its just another flourishing video. The theory11 opening wasnt necessary cuz its not a theory11 video from theory11. also, the intro is cool but it isn't "sick" what the hell are u talkin about. anyways. im not impressed. the music doesnt fit with the theory11 opening.

you need variety. like i said this looks just like your last vid. this one was just a waste of time. and what was up with you filming in what looked like a weight room? was that supposed to be like your basement? cuz if thats so then i guess thats "underground." the train setting was better.

My rating is 1/5. cuz i felt like it wasted my time because it wasnt anything special."



I know that it was him because he had just joined the day before and had no posts. Also no one in there right mind would give it a 1/5. Apparently he got really mad and jealous and stuff so he tried to ruin my online life. He also gave all my videos on youtube one star then tried to add me as his friend probably so he could hack it again. He then commented on Underground again this time under his "wavehead15" profile and giving a good comment but he still gave it one star because the overall rating went down.

This is all just because I didn't give him secrets and let him make copies of my magic dvds.
This guy is off his rocker or something, because he has gone ballistic. I can't wait to see what he tries to do to me next.

Back on topic:
I agree with some of you saying that magicians should not share secrets unless they have both purchased the material or have created it themselves.
Z

 

[cm763]

After Zeedub's response, this appears to be about copyright infringement and not about "sharing secrets." These are two completely different topics, in my opinion. As such, I am totally against the copying of copyright material. That is something I wouldn't do, and I wouldn't encourage anyone else (including the OP) to do. It's one thing to talk about something, but a totally different thing to illegally copy the work. Ugh, I'm done with this thread.

 

[Zeedub81]

And another thing: How many laymen do think actually know about this site?

If we were supposed to be sharing other magician's secrets all the tricks on this site would be free. Daniel Madison is a magician, why can't he just give me the secret's? Magicians are supposed to share secrets, right? Wrong.
Z

 

[Pavan R]

Zeedub makes sense. There is a huge difference between copyright infringement and sharing secrets. It is not okay if you want to illegally copy the DVD. (obviously)


Haven't you ever read the warning Theory 11 puts in the beginning of their DVDs?

Do you really want a hard smack from baby Jesus?

 

[MaGiK Man]

i agree, two completly different things copyright infringment and sharing secrets. I say its definatly wrong to copy dvds, or downloads without paying. But id say its ok to share secrets w/ other magicians.

 

[copperfield 14]

It's funny that a layperson thinks that magicians share there secrets( for free) and that only they now these secrets. Well they were wrong. Magicians are just another salesman. " Hey wanna know how to levitate just like me, buy my dvd for 25.95". Since magicians don't make much money they started to sell there material instead of sharing it and " help the community". The whole help the community is full of bull. People share there secrets to there friends or people with way above average skill level. Shouldn't we be helping noobs who want to start magic. Instead we make dvds and say" want to learn magic". Buy my dvd and learn everything you need to learn to become a magician only for the little price of 10 dollars". I don't like the way the magic industry is going. Sometimes I don't know why I would pay 80 dollars for a few magic tricks.

 

[wavehead15]

this is getting way off topic. i understand the whole thing about illegal downloading is bad and so on and so forth. i didnt ask that question. even if i didnt copy the dvd zeedub would not have shared any of the secrets with me anyways. i would appreciate if everyone would stay on the original topic.

thanks

 

[wavehead15]

........................

 

[Zeedub81]

this is getting way off topic. i understand the whole thing about illegal downloading is bad and so on and so forth. i didnt ask that question. even if i didnt copy the dvd zeedub would not have shared any of the secrets with me anyways. i would appreciate if everyone would stay on the original topic.

thanks

This is not getting off topic, and you obviously do not understand that illegal downloading is wrong because you do it...and you try to hack my stuff. Sharing the secrets is just like letting you borrow the dvd. Look at my post before this.

 

[Justin.Morris]

Obviously no one can stop an individual from revealing secrets. Revealing secrets of another magicians work is unethical, dishonest and wrong.
If there is a debate about it, then it is just from those who want free stuff. The disagreement is driven by greed, not a sense of right and wrong. There are dozens of illustrations you could make, but if I created a trick, and confided in an individual about the method, and that person went and told others without my permission, that's a huge breach of trust.

So it really comes down to a character issue. What kind of person do you want to be?

 

[Zeedub81]

Obviously no one can stop an individual from revealing secrets. Revealing secrets of another magicians work is unethical, dishonest and wrong.
If there is a debate about it, then it is just from those who want free stuff. The disagreement is driven by greed, not a sense of right and wrong. There are dozens of illustrations you could make, but if I created a trick, and confided in an individual about the method, and that person went and told others without my permission, that's a huge breach of trust.

So it really comes down to a character issue. What kind of person do you want to be?

Exactly. Thank you for posting this. Invisi Rep'd.

 

[d34thg0d]

Before this thread goes into further discussion, we should actually define sharing secrets. In my opinion, if you created a trick, it is alright to share the secret with your friend. However, if you share secrets of another magician's work, its unethical and wrong. I'm sure there are professional magicians who share secrets among one another, buy they have to sell these secrets in order to earn money for a living.

 

[Zeedub81]

However, if you share secrets of another magician's work, its unethical and wrong.

Yes. The thread creator was trying to get me lend him my Dangerous DVDs.

 

[praetoritevong]

Yes. I would agree with the general consensus of the thread. Firstly, that downloading is completely wrong and that it was an unethical and shameful act. Secondly, that sharing the secret to your own magic is fine, but not another magician's work.

 

[d34thg0d]

this is getting way off topic. i understand the whole thing about illegal downloading is bad and so on and so forth. i didnt ask that question. even if i didnt copy the dvd zeedub would not have shared any of the secrets with me anyways. i would appreciate if everyone would stay on the original topic.

thanks

If zeedub did learn you the dvd, you would have made a copy of it. You should actually make your point clearer, like "It is alright to share a dvd among magicians and make copies of it?"

 

[copperfield 14]

Well if you make a copy of the dvd and give it to your friend magicians who you trust then the only downside is that the company would lose a little bit of money which is probably less than 1 percent. Oh and since were talking about illegal downloading. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wji1pT9jsmQ&feature=related