Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by WillHardman, May 30, 2015.


Will you buy SUB ROSA by Jason England?

Poll closed Jun 20, 2015.
  1. YES

    14 vote(s)
  2. NO

    4 vote(s)
  3. I will have to see

    9 vote(s)
  1. Hi,

    I was wondering about Jason England's new release SUB ROSA. I have seen that a special deck is required and I was worried about that. Without revealing too much, I would like to know whether the SUB ROSA deck can be used for normal card table work. I love doing card table work and being able to control great amount of cards is fantastic. Could I do proper card work with this deck while throwing in some of the SUB ROSA controls?


  2. I keep jumping from one fence to another. On one hand, it sounds very powerful. On the other hand, I'm not sure if it would fit with what I want to do with card work later down the road.
    Regardless, I'm more than likely waiting until next year to get it if I'm going to get it. Mainly because I'm already working on too much and I won't be able to work on Sub Rosa. But I think waiting until next year is perfect to wait and check in again.

    i need more details like: how long does a 'reset' take if I were to use it in restaurant strolling? Can I use signed cards (I'm guessing 'no')?
  3. Thanks Brett,

    I agree with you. I will probably wait till October to purchase. I like you am worried whether it will be useful as a real life deck of cards or just for the SUB ROSA principle
  4. I think that T11 went way overboard on the cinematics for sub rosa. It's undoubtedly the worst magic trailer i've seen. Sure it's pretty but i don't even know what the effect is supposed to be. Or if it even is an effect.

    I'm very picky with my magic purchases and at this point subrosa is just hype so no i will not be buying it.

    P.S as far as i can tell from the (again, terrible) trailer, you could do the same with a stripper deck
  5. To be honest, I wouldn't even think of buying this if Jason England wouldn't be involved.
    Everything Jason came up with in the past is substantial stuff and no pipe dreams. However I agree I didn't get any idea what can be accomplished with this from the trailer alone, if hadn't listen to the podcast. The trailer is....not my cup of tea, to say the least.
    wZEnigma likes this.
  6. Trailers are worthless to any Magic Effect... you have to see a full performance before you judge.
  7. As a person whose bought Sub Rosa, I think it is extremely powerful. You can always do normal tabled card work. Then when when you feel like it, you can ask your spectator(s) to shuffle deck however they want for as long as they want. You have control over the aces the whole time. You can in fact do this with any four-of-a-kind. You can even control two four of a kinds in the same routine, say both aces AND kings. There's no Sub Rosa Deck per se. They're just including for convenience. Additionally, a "reset" is not necessary. You'll know what I mean if you get it.
  8. It was a very specific decision not to overtly show the technique in the trailer. Our original intention with this was not to have a trailer at all - literally, nothing. No pictures, no videos, nothing. Just text.

    And if people chose to read that text, and trust in the reputation of Jason England and theory11 - they'll then be armed with one of the most powerful, practical, dangerously deceptive techniques in all of card magic. If not, then not. But this is a dark secret, a real secret - and the reviews speak for themselves.

    To your point on a normal stripper deck - can you hand out that deck to a magician to examine? With Sub Rosa, you can - and they'll find nothing. Even after they shuffle. Even after you deal four aces.
  9. Absolutely! Yes! Enjoy and use it wisely!
  10. Of course! You can use the deck however you'd like within your existing card magic routines. Think of this as a secret weapon, ready whenever you desire to use it, when the time is right. It's a bit like having a superpower.
  11. It almost seemed too good to be true, so I waited for some reviews. I woke up this morning and saw five reviews posted, and all of them were five stars. So I made the leap, bought it, and watched. MAN, am I glad I did. This is THE REAL DEAL!

    I'm still wrapping my head around ways to apply this to my own card routines. The instruction is clear and detailed as always with Jason England. If you're truly serious about card magic, stop what you're doing and get this.
    Casey Rudd likes this.
  12. In my personal opinion, that would have been much better. Christopher Nolan trailers don't work for magic or cardistry.
  13. The trailer almost turned me away, I think the text only idea would have been better.
    wZEnigma likes this.
  14. Like JB said, originally it took us 6 years to convince Jason to release this at all, and even then, we weren't planning on including any trailers.

    The thing I like most about this is you can integrate this concept into virtually any deck you currently own. Whether that's a stacked deck, Andy Nyman's THE CODE, or even your favorite custom deck like Monarchs. The work is very subtle and unobtrusive for purists like myself, you can totally forget that you essentially have access to the aces at your fingertips. That's very powerful. Proud to see how well this project came together after so many years in pursuit of something we never thought would materialize. The reviews speak for themselves so we're very happy, we hope you enjoy it!
  15. I'll trust your marketing experience but i've been promised a lot of good magic. I don't like to buy a trick unless i see a full uncut performance by both the seller and a third party (there are some tricks only the creators seem to really make work)

    to your point on the stripper deck - so it's a magician fooler?
    I don't mean to sound negative but i can use sleight of hand or an already existing gimmick to control four of a kind in almost the same way, this ones not for me.
    but break on the other hand....
  16. Hey Anthony! First and foremost, that may be true for other sites - but we stand behind our work and our word. Jason England in particular is among the most knowledgeable, respected magicians and historians alive in the industry today - and notice that it's not often (read that: ever) that he promotes anything without merit. This is the real deal.

    To the point of an uncut performance, this is a technique and a method, not a trick in and of itself. Especially as it's a secret over a century in the dark, it's actually mentioned in the video for people not to immediately post videos on YouTube and the like. We intend, as best possible, to help keep this secret a secret. That said, many reviews have already been posted.

    Re: a magician fooler - this isn't just a magician fooler; it's an ANYONE fooler, unless they have extensive, expert knowledge of card cheat techniques. Even some of the most revered performers in the industry like Teller (of P&T) were unaware this existed. Imagine that power: deck examined by the spectator, shuffled and cut by the spectator, yet you can immediately find the selected card or deal four aces. That's dangerously deceptive - and worth it's weight in gold.
  17. Originally was going to buy this, but then when I found out it comes with two decks I instantly changed my mind. If the download teaches you how to put the work into any deck you like then what is the point of mailing two decks to us? I'd really rather not pay that much for shipping.
  18. Well the idea is that you would have the decks to learn with and then create your own once you have it down. I don't know how much shipping costs for you but I think that low a price for this kind of trick makes it worth it so long as shipping doesn't cost over $7.
  19. Unfortunately shipping costs are half the price of the video itself for me. I'd love to have a download only version as an alternative buying option.

    ChrisWiens likes this.
  20. I too would love it if Theory 11 would create a download only option. I'm familiar with what the content is and I would love to hear what Jason has to say about it.


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