Suspicious coin vanish/change videos on YouTube

Discussion in 'Magic Forum' started by atomo, Dec 17, 2007.

  1. #1 atomo, Dec 17, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2007
    Before i say what im about to say i would like to apologise to those who may be unfairly offended. I know there is alot of genuine creativity out there, and im already bracing myself for a flood of comments along the lines of 'you just cant figure it out', but i feel that this is still a valid point and is worth making. so here goes:

    After watching countless videos of coin vanishes and coin changes on youtube i have begone to feel suspicious about the methodology involved. It is quite possible to simply drop a coin out of frame as the hands come together, creating what often looks like an amazing new vanish. Or to hold two coins as one and drop the front one to create a perfect coin change, which the slow frame rate of a web cam does not show.

    Try this for yourselves and you'll see what i mean, hold a coin at right finger tips, wave the left fingers infront as you drop the coin, and watch the video back, you will see what looks like a perfect coin vanish, but is infact just a simple camera trick.

    I was seriously tempted to post examples of what i thought where among the most supicious videos i have seen, but im sure that would only lead to their creators coming here to say that they didn't cheat, and it was infact an amazing new sleight.

    I know this may make me unpopular, but i thought it was worth the risk to see if anyone agrees with me.


  2. I'd have to agree. I've actually messaged someone on YouTube asking how they did it and they said it was the French Drop, minus the French.
  3. I dont get what you mean....

    Are you saying that people just 'drop' coins, and because their cameras arent as good as the ones t11 use, then it looks like a new sleight?

    If thats what you mean...then i totally agree. Ive seen people abuse the fact that their 'magic' is shown only to what the camera can capture (if that makes sense), so they drop their fairly-obvious-to-the-spectator-props on the floor, when their hands are out of frame. IT SUCKS!
  4. Yes im afraid thats exactly what im talking about, and i decided to start this thread after following a few links to youtube which had been posted on T11, the threads following these posts are always full of people saying 'wow you should sell that, i would soo buy it', and i just dont think it does anything to help advance our art, which is supposed to be the point of this website.

    grumble grumble
  5. While a lot of videos posted by people trying to get attention and fame use this method, I also believe that a lot of stuff is genuine. A posted a coin vanish here not too long ago, and I had a few people asking me if I had dropped it. Sometimes, you just have to give up and admit that the vanish is original and visual.

    But on another note, I think that it's okay for kids who want to show off to their friends or amaze them to film a "drop" vanish, as long as they either say what's going on or they are just doing it for fun, no seriously.

  6. If there Harada Hold was never published and the creator made a webcam video of it you'd say the coin was dropped…lol
  7. i'm going to agree with this....actually, there are some out there where they didn't put them together so well, and it's a sloppy clip change. I also have to say that yes, this is abusing the skill of coin manipulation. :(
  8. You know, I actually think that coin vanishes is a overused plot. Kids these days seem to think that coin magic is all about vanishes, and they don't think about routining or anything. Just because you can vanish a coin doesn't mean you have to sell it.(no offense to anybody)

  9. there is actually something called the M5 System wich has a magnet that picks up a special coin.

  10. I truly agree with alot of what's been said on this thread. However we have to realize that there are some people who are satisfied with fooling the lens of the camera/webcam rather than fooling an actual audience. I say leave them to their devices. There is plenty of room for all walks of magical life. Eugene Burger is known to say," There are many rooms in the house of magic...."

    However, there are some astounding vanishes out there that will do both. They will destroy a lay audience while still having a killer aesthetic for the visual medium the effect is produced on. A couple of examples would include, Nathan Kranzo's Squish, John Cornelius' Fickel Nickel, and Kirk Kokinos' Vapor Coins.

    As an aside, I too have a kind of cool vanish that you guys may be interested in....
  11. Well Eric as usual.... DAMN.
  12. Although I agree that it is silly to just fake vanishes/changes, I don't agree with just accusing people of doing it just because that's what you think they did. I have been accused countless times of using camera editing or just dropping the coin for two of my videos on youtube, the first of which is a vanish, the second a coin change. (My Vanish Video, My Coin Change Video)

    It does actually get incredibly annoying when I am accused of cheating. I am fine with people simply asking if it was camera trickery of some sort, providing I haven't already made that clear that it is fair. It is when I have actually explicitly said that it is fair, and people still accuse me of cheating, that's when it really gets on my nerves.

    My thoughts.

  13. I know it's not - but your ring vanish looks remarkabely like the Harada Hold - the way your left thumb's positioned. Anyways, it's a beautiful vanish - well done with it.
  14. Nice vanish Eric.

    Think about it. Any "Drop" vanish is perfectly usable in real life. If you are lapping, or have a servante, dropping a coin to vanish it is perfectly okay. same with changes.
  15. What Part Of M5 System Are You Guys Not Getting??!!!!
  16. For me, it's the part where magnets somehow aren't acceptable.
  17. its magnetic, its on the back of the watch
  18. mm wont let me edit

    nvm i watched the video again, im an idiot

    i have no clue how its done :)

    but the magnetic watch thing sounds cool! lol
  19. Your right it isn't magnetic... and it is a awesome effect to learn. Also if you want to learn more of Eric's material I can also suggest Imagination by Eric Jones.
  20. Jones,
    Very nice vanish. Reminds me of a vanish that I came up with independently about 3 years ago. LoL, I think we both use the same method; or at least, VERY similar. Great minds think alike!

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