What to do when...

Dec 1, 2008
354
0
Ottawa, Ontario
So my question is how do you respond when a spectator starts to describe something another magician has done for them?
It happened to me today (luckily the spectator described "ashes on the arm" and told me how amazing it was. I took that opportunity to do "ashes on the spectator's arm", wild reactions.) and it has happened to me on other occasions to.

I'll usually respond "Oh that's really neat, have you seen this one?" and go into another effect. This will work fine most times but if the trick I do does not rival the trick that was described it can leave the spectator unfulfilled.

So do you have any particular way to handle that situation?
 

Jv

Jan 11, 2008
1,223
26
This has happen to me before.

My uncle told me a story about how his company was having like a big gathering and that there was a magician performing strolling magic.

The magician ther performed the trick where the spectator's watch dissappears from the wrist and then it appears where the magician wants it to (On his/her wrist or pocket,ect.)

I then performed a few card tricks and he was still impressed even though he told me the story of the cool effect that impressed him.

What I'm trying to say is that no matter when a spectator describes an effect they witnessed, I never leave them unfulfilled or a moment where they forget the magic.
 
Mar 29, 2008
882
3
Hand them the deck and tell them to do it for you.

If this is a joke - it comes across as advice, and is cliche magic mal-practice. Even as a joke, it really lacks.

Anyhow - this is a good question that hasn't really been addressed yet.

It is a hard situation - a magician before you has left a good impression about magic, enough that this person wanted to share their experience with you. The audience member doesn't realize that this is the WORST timing, and that it really steps on your moment. It would be like me talking about how much the last table tipped me, or how fun they were...awkward pressure - but that is not their intent. Magic is so powerful, that the thought magic makes them instantly snap back into that feeling of magic that they had...which creates emotion that they want to share - hopefully excitement connected with being fooled.

I have handled it many ways - I was once frustrated when a women be-littled me without realizing it, by saying..."Oh my uncle does this thing with a "Poof" (simulating a fire ball - flash paper) - are you going to make a "poof" - it totally killed the moment, but what killed it more was that at the time...I wasn't sure how to handle it. I said, "Your uncle sounded like he did cool stuff, I don't do anything with a "poof", but I hope to show you something that is even more amazing". Wrong answer - lost the crowd trying to be a nice guy.

I have even tried being a jerk - and we know how that turns out - you lose the crowd again.

So, here is what I found works. Really, I slap myself for not thinking of it earlier. Ask questions. That is it really - ask them how it made them feel, what they liked about it - At this point - you could segway into your effect with a question - let's say you are doing G-Force - you could say, would you consider what he did - EASY magic or HARD magic? Then go into what you mean with your cards, after responding to the answer.

OR

You could just state - Do you consider him a great magician? Yes. GREAT - because I have done magic for X number of years, and have studied magic so well, that often I have to buy the same book twice because the pages fall out. The hardest part of what I do, is approaching a table - most people think it is going to be a horrible experience, because Uncle Milton did a card trick where someone picked a card...he dealt through the deck for 30 minutes, to find the wrong card. Conclusion - magic sucks. However, you saw someone that loved the art of magic, and it left a great impression on you. I intend to do the same, is it okay if I share with you some of my best pieces of magic?

It doesn't hurt to ask the person's name - once I had someone say Ross Bertram, often...it is someone I know from out of province or country. If they are local, you could hook up with them to talk ideas...this puts the spectator into a odd spot - you aren't intimidated by her memory, you want to hear more about it - and perhaps meet the guy that she had a good experience with.

In short - validate her feelings on magic. Don't brush over it. She is sharing. Once she is done living that moment, your kindness will warm you to the crowd, and you can share your crappy magic.

Cheers.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
If this is a joke - it comes across as advice, and is cliche magic mal-practice. Even as a joke, it really lacks.

Anyhow - this is a good question that hasn't really been addressed yet.

It is a hard situation - a magician before you has left a good impression about magic, enough that this person wanted to share their experience with you. The audience member doesn't realize that this is the WORST timing, and that it really steps on your moment. It would be like me talking about how much the last table tipped me, or how fun they were...awkward pressure - but that is not their intent. Magic is so powerful, that the thought magic makes them instantly snap back into that feeling of magic that they had...which creates emotion that they want to share - hopefully excitement connected with being fooled.

I have handled it many ways - I was once frustrated when a women be-littled me without realizing it, by saying..."Oh my uncle does this thing with a "Poof" (simulating a fire ball - flash paper) - are you going to make a "poof" - it totally killed the moment, but what killed it more was that at the time...I wasn't sure how to handle it. I said, "Your uncle sounded like he did cool stuff, I don't do anything with a "poof", but I hope to show you something that is even more amazing". Wrong answer - lost the crowd trying to be a nice guy.

I have even tried being a jerk - and we know how that turns out - you lose the crowd again.

So, here is what I found works. Really, I slap myself for not thinking of it earlier. Ask questions. That is it really - ask them how it made them feel, what they liked about it - At this point - you could segway into your effect with a question - let's say you are doing G-Force - you could say, would you consider what he did - EASY magic or HARD magic? Then go into what you mean with your cards, after responding to the answer.

OR

You could just state - Do you consider him a great magician? Yes. GREAT - because I have done magic for X number of years, and have studied magic so well, that often I have to buy the same book twice because the pages fall out. The hardest part of what I do, is approaching a table - most people think it is going to be a horrible experience, because Uncle Milton did a card trick where someone picked a card...he dealt through the deck for 30 minutes, to find the wrong card. Conclusion - magic sucks. However, you saw someone that loved the art of magic, and it left a great impression on you. I intend to do the same, is it okay if I share with you some of my best pieces of magic?

It doesn't hurt to ask the person's name - once I had someone say Ross Bertram, often...it is someone I know from out of province or country. If they are local, you could hook up with them to talk ideas...this puts the spectator into a odd spot - you aren't intimidated by her memory, you want to hear more about it - and perhaps meet the guy that she had a good experience with.

In short - validate her feelings on magic. Don't brush over it. She is sharing. Once she is done living that moment, your kindness will warm you to the crowd, and you can share your crappy magic.

Cheers.

What if they told you about a magician who sucked and from that point on they think ALL magic sucks.
 
Sep 2, 2007
1,186
16
42
London
A good technique if they've had a good experience with magic previously is to anchor their reaction to the remembered effect and attach it to something you perform yourself. For example, if they enthusiastically describe how a magician made their watch disappear and reappear somewhere else, you agree enthusiastically..."Yeah, I think it's one of the most impressive things, for something to disappear and reappear somewhere completely different. Didn't it feel really [insert adjective that they used in their description] when that happened right in front of you? Yeah, that's brilliant, coz I do something that's a bit like that..." Then you can go into anything that fits that vague plot, something disappearing and reappearing somewhere else, even an ambitious card routine, and elicit that remembered reaction. The thing is, the trick they describe to you probably didn't actually happen, but it's become exaggerated in their memory, therefore you're essentially got a reaction to a genuinely impossible trick.
 
Mar 29, 2008
882
3
What if they told you about a magician who sucked and from that point on they think ALL magic sucks.

You are more likely to face someone NOT interested because of past magic mal-practice situations.

Personally, I try to win them over with my personality, before the magic comes out - and if you are good at what you do, then they will be able to see the difference. Just because you don't like the Backstreet Boys, doesn't mean you won't like N'Sync - who doens't love JT :)

Just like there are bad musicians or singers - there are bad magicians, but people don't usually get to compare. When they do, you are actually lucky, as long as the last guy hasn't ruined it for you - and they give you a chance.

If not - then just say thanks...and Bye bye bye.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
So do you have any particular way to handle that situation?

I let them tell me about and get them talking. They have a story they want to tell. Who the hell am I to interrupt them? Besides, if they're telling you this story it means they're interested.

Then it's your job to prove them wrong.

Or I just avoid wasting my time and move on. Much less stressful than making like a Southern Baptist preacher.
 
Sep 2, 2007
1,186
16
42
London
I let them tell me about and get them talking. They have a story they want to tell. Who the hell am I to interrupt them? Besides, if they're telling you this story it means they're interested.



Or I just avoid wasting my time and move on. Much less stressful than making like a Southern Baptist preacher.

Hang on there. You seem to be missing something. If we imagine that we're in a situation in which we're paid to perform, we earn our money by performing, not by moving on every time we hit a slight obstacle. One reason why Southern Baptist preachers do quite well for themselves is because they put effort in to engaging the audience before any message is even delivered. The reason why magicians get a negative response is overwhelmingly because they've failed as performers to engage the audience before they try to deliver their "message".

We, by which I mean close-up/walk-around performers have a unique task. Our audiences haven't paid for their seats in advance, they probably don't care one way or the other if they're entertained, because that's not why they came out in the first place. The religious simile is apt, because we have to do two jobs. One is to "convert", and the other is to deliver "the gospel". There's no point walking up to a random person and telling them that Jesus cast out a legion of demons and made them enter a herd of swine. However, if you initially make them accept the Bible and then try and do that, you're likely to have more success.

Most people haven't seen live magic. Therefore the impression they have of it is from the TV or from slightly suspect uncles. We have to find a way in. That way is clearly to engage them as people before the word or the concept of magic is introduced. Then we have to communicate to them as people. Walking up to someone and expecting them to be interested in what we have to offer as magicians is as ridiculous as a comedian walking up to tables in a restaurant and asking "Can I tell you a joke?". It's intrusive and quite disturbing. We are the only performers who have this problem. Actors, comedians, dancers, jugglers, etc., don't have to deal with this situation. We are the only ones who have to prepare their audience before they perform. Therefore we need to do that, do that extra bit of work before we perform, we can't hope to make it happen during a performance.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Hang on there. You seem to be missing something. If we imagine that we're in a situation in which we're paid to perform, we earn our money by performing, not by moving on every time we hit a slight obstacle. One reason why Southern Baptist preachers do quite well for themselves is because they put effort in to engaging the audience before any message is even delivered. The reason why magicians get a negative response is overwhelmingly because they've failed as performers to engage the audience before they try to deliver their "message".

Granted, I am assuming a strolling environment. When you're doing a parlor or stage show, it's generally assumed that anyone paying for the tickets is already amiable to magic.

Therefore we need to do that, do that extra bit of work before we perform, we can't hope to make it happen during a performance.

But no still means no. If someone doesn't like magic and doesn't want to watch a performance, it's a waste of my time to stick around. Whether or not they like me as a person is totally irrelevant at that point because I'm on the job.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
Steerpikes point is that if people aren't interested you shouldn't waste your time or theirs trying to convince them. Otherwise it will just get annoying and they will be EVEN less likely to enjoy what you are showing them. You can't force people to enjoy magic. If they don't want to see it, then it's their loss, you move on and go about your day.
 
Sep 2, 2007
1,186
16
42
London
Steerpikes point is that if people aren't interested you shouldn't waste your time or theirs trying to convince them. Otherwise it will just get annoying and they will be EVEN less likely to enjoy what you are showing them. You can't force people to enjoy magic. If they don't want to see it, then it's their loss, you move on and go about your day.

What differentiates a successful performer from an unsuccessful one? I won't let you think too long about the answer because it's obvious: The number of people who enjoy your performance.

The sentence "you can't force people to enjoy magic" is true. BUT...and that's a damn big but...you can make people enjoy magic who didn't expect to. Study the techniques of the salesman. I've been in sales as a day job for a good few years now. I've met people I'd never seen before in my life, they weren't looking for what I was selling, and by the end of the day they'd spend fifty thousand pounds (do the conversion math(s) yourself) on my product and were very happy about it, even to the point of recommending my company, and me especially, to their friends.

There are no bad audiences. There are only bad performers.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
What differentiates a successful performer from an unsuccessful one? I won't let you think too long about the answer because it's obvious: The number of people who enjoy your performance.

From an entertainment perspective, yes. But if I'm doing strolling magic at a cocktail party, I can get to more people if I don't waste my time trying to win over people who aren't receptive.

When busking, a bad audience is less likely to tip me, whereas a good one probably will. Thus my retreating in that context is motivated less by artistic cowardice (or whatever) and more by my desire to put food on the table.

There is nothing wrong with a strategic withdrawal. I'm not saying that I bale at the first sign of resistance. It's downright insulting to say that I do. But when you get people who state very clearly that they don't want any magic, you have to stop and consider that pushing the issue is not doing you any good.

You say to study salesmen. And while it is true that a no is just a delay to getting a yes, that doesn't automatically mean you're getting the yes that same day no matter how eloquently you make your case.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
What differentiates a successful performer from an unsuccessful one? I won't let you think too long about the answer because it's obvious: The number of people who enjoy your performance.

The sentence "you can't force people to enjoy magic" is true. BUT...and that's a damn big but...you can make people enjoy magic who didn't expect to. Study the techniques of the salesman. I've been in sales as a day job for a good few years now. I've met people I'd never seen before in my life, they weren't looking for what I was selling, and by the end of the day they'd spend fifty thousand pounds (do the conversion math(s) yourself) on my product and were very happy about it, even to the point of recommending my company, and me especially, to their friends.

There are no bad audiences. There are only bad performers.

Yes and the bad performers are the ones who try to push their performance on you. I doubt you are going to get people on your side if you keep trying to push your magic on them. They might say "yes". But it won't be a good yes. I'll bet that they'll be less impressed with your magic and will most likely turn into a heckler. Which ended up being your fault.
 
Sep 2, 2007
1,186
16
42
London
You say to study salesmen. And while it is true that a no is just a delay to getting a yes, that doesn't automatically mean you're getting the yes that same day no matter how eloquently you make your case.

That depends on how good you are as a salesman. And, coincindentally, it depends on how good you are as a performer. There are a lot of people who can tell jokes, but they aren't all professional comedians. There are a lot of people who can do a card trick, but they aren't professional magicians. What makes you a professional performer is how well you deal with people. I'm fairly sure that the dictionary definition of "professional" is to do with money, but that's clearly bulllsh*t because you can't earn money as a "professional" unless you appeal to actual, genuine, people.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
That depends on how good you are as a salesman. And, coincindentally, it depends on how good you are as a performer. There are a lot of people who can tell jokes, but they aren't all professional comedians. There are a lot of people who can do a card trick, but they aren't professional magicians. What makes you a professional performer is how well you deal with people. I'm fairly sure that the dictionary definition of "professional" is to do with money, but that's clearly bulllsh*t because you can't earn money as a "professional" unless you appeal to actual, genuine, people.

Not really true, there a ton of performers out there who don't appeal to people and yet they are able to make a living. The difference between a pro and an amateur is pretty much one makes money doing it, while the other just does it as hobby.
 
Dec 29, 2008
183
0
GA
I heard some request that I walk on water. I replied with a "where did you see that from". The answer "On tv Criss Angel did it". "Criss who?" is how I end it and move to another trick.
 
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