What's an Index?

[Maaz Hasan]

What is an index, and where can I learn about one/find one?

From what I understand, it has all the cards in a deck, and you can easily find and palm one off, from your pocket or something? I've only just run across it a couple times now and am super interested.

 

[luca_gire]

What is an index, and where can I learn about one/find one?

From what I understand, it has all the cards in a deck, and you can easily find and palm one off, from your pocket or something? I've only just run across it a couple times now and am super interested.

Look up the Advocate by Daniel Madison. He teaches an index that can be placed in your pocket which is pretty cool.

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Look up the Advocate by Daniel Madison. He teaches an index that can be placed in your pocket which is pretty cool.

Thanks! I was thinking of picking up Advocate, since that is where I first heard of the index.

I was wondering if there are any other sources for it though.

P.S. Will the book/manuscript suffice? There is only a $2 difference between The Advocate Download & DM's Devilry book (which has a lot more), so...

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Oh I also did some research, and found that the Encyclopedia of Card Tricks has one in it. Does anyone know if the Index from The Encyclopedia is any good?

 

[WitchDocIsIn]

An index allows you to quickly and efficiently locate and palm a thing (Whatever is indexed). Annemann teaches a couple for billets or pellets in Practical Mental Magic. The Advocate is a full deck index. Christopher Taylor has one in one of his routines (I don't remember which, since I learned it from his lecture at ECSS) that is used for like 12 items I believe, for predictions/readings.

 

[Maaz Hasan]

So I am right in assuming I could use the Advocate's Index in a ton of different routine's right?

 

[HectorE1]

What is an index, and where can I learn about one/find one?

From what I understand, it has all the cards in a deck, and you can easily find and palm one off, from your pocket or something? I've only just run across it a couple times now and am super interested.

Get yourself a copy of annemans practical mental magic, in it he teaches how to construct a card index which in my opinion is better and more practical, no pun intended haha, than Madisons advocate index... here's an idea of what it would look like https://www.google.com.pr/search?q=...&biw=360&bih=559&dpr=1.5#imgrc=BZsigioOLS0hOM:

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Which one teaches it better, because I get mixed up all the time while reading through books.

Encyclopedia, Advocate, or Practical Mental Magic? Or is there another source I could use?

 

[Maaz Hasan]

Get yourself a copy of annemans practical mental magic, in it he teaches how to construct a card index which in my opinion is better and more practical, no pun intended haha, than Madisons advocate index... here's an idea of what it would look like https://www.google.com.pr/search?q=...&biw=360&bih=559&dpr=1.5#imgrc=BZsigioOLS0hOM:

Oh, I was looking into this, but found out that that is an index for billets, not cards?

 

[DavidL11229]

You should just get Encyclopedia of Card Tricks and Practical Mental Magic for this and so many other reasons.

I see that Encyclopedia of Card Tricks does have a number of tricks that use some form of an index. There is not a section on indexes nor does he seem teach "an index", but he does discuss a few different indexes in the course of teaching various tricks (p. 63 for one).

Practical Mental Magic does teach you how to construct a billet index (you can also get wallets that contain billet indexes). Also see Vertigo Prediction gimmick.

Advocate if you know you really want to do a lot of card index work. It doesn't matter which of his products you purchase to learn the actual index itself (as long as they both contain a description of it of course). There may be a difference in content for additional routines or such, but any product of his that contains a description of it will teach you the index just fine. Devilry looks like it contains the full Advocate anyway. I just thought Advocate was a bit $$ by itself, but if you use it then it's worth it and if you buy the package it's not a big deal.

Just get Hugard and Anneman, because you should anyway (though this probably applies to Madison too, though I've only read Advocate), but if you think you really really want a good card index system the pick up Devilry. It's a better index than what's in Hugard, but it's not a huge bleepin' deal either way.

 

[HectorE1]

Oh, I was looking into this, but found out that that is an index for billets, not cards?

It's a card index I have the book

 

[HectorE1]

It's a card index I have the book

Sorry technically yes it's a billet index but with a little modification it can be used for cards

 

[Maaz Hasan]

I am already buying The Encyclopedia, simply because of everything in it.

The Advocate DVD will run me the same amount as the Practical Mental Magic book, and I am definitely more of a visual learner.

Now, I understand that I will be getting a ton more out of the Practical Mental Magic book, but at the moment, I don't perform too much mentalism, and when I do, it is almost 100% sleight based. Don't get me wrong, I will definitely pick up the book later down the line, but at the moment, I know it will just sit on my shelf forever. So I think I'll pick up the Advocate, unless there are some other sources I should consider (I know Marlo had an Index chapter somewhere, but Idk where to find it). Furthermore, the Advocate has a Pocket Card Index, where as the one in Practical Mental Magic is one for Billets, and I have no Idea how Indexes really work, so I wouldn't be able to change much.

 

[HectorE1]

I am already buying The Encyclopedia, simply because of everything in it.

The Advocate DVD will run me the same amount as the Practical Mental Magic book, and I am definitely more of a visual learner.

Now, I understand that I will be getting a ton more out of the Practical Mental Magic book, but at the moment, I don't perform too much mentalism, and when I do, it is almost 100% sleight based. Don't get me wrong, I will definitely pick up the book later down the line, but at the moment, I know it will just sit on my shelf forever. So I think I'll pick up the Advocate, unless there are some other sources I should consider (I know Marlo had an Index chapter somewhere, but Idk where to find it). Furthermore, the Advocate has a Pocket Card Index, where as the one in Practical Mental Magic is one for Billets, and I have no Idea how Indexes really work, so I wouldn't be able to change much.

The best thing imo about practical mental magic isn't so much the effects in the book, don't get me wrong they're great, but I think you get more out of all the principal's and methods that are in the book which can be applied to magic also... plus theres a lot of good card based effects

 

[DavidL11229]

I think card index gimmicks used to be more of a thing than they are now. You will be learning gimmickless card index systems, but if you really want to know all the options it's something else you'll have to look into.

 

[Maaz Hasan]

I think card index gimmicks used to be more of a thing than they are now. You will be learning gimmickless card index systems, but if you really want to know all the options it's something else you'll have to look into.

I think my best bet right now is to study the Index in one or two of the sources discussed above. If I need to make gimmick, I will do so.

Later, I might create my own personal index gimmick if I need to. I've looked into it, there are very few card Index sources out there, and the one's that go in depth about them are in some pretty hard to find resources. In fact, I don't think any of them are going to be easily obtainable, except for The Advocate & Encyclopedia (not including the other book, since it has a billet index, doesn't really talk about cards from what I understand).

 

[jakeherndon24]

What is an index, and where can I learn about one/find one?

From what I understand, it has all the cards in a deck, and you can easily find and palm one off, from your pocket or something? I've only just run across it a couple times now and am super interested.

I have and perform Advocate and it is amazing. I know you hear it about a ton of different effects and such but you are only limited by your imagination when it comes to routines. I would definitely recommend getting comfortable with the Gambler's Cop (which DM has a lot of videos and books on). Best of luck!

 

[Maaz Hasan]

I have and perform Advocate and it is amazing. I know you hear it about a ton of different effects and such but you are only limited by your imagination when it comes to routines. I would definitely recommend getting comfortable with the Gambler's Cop (which DM has a lot of videos and books on). Best of luck!

Thanks! Gambler's cop is a super strong angle palm. I use it on a daily basis actually. In fact, I like holding cards in Gambler's cop all the time.

 

[Ned Devine]

I don't buy Ellusionist stuff very often but when I heard about a whole deck single pocket index, I had to try it. It's so good. In my opinion one of the best out there, simple to make and effective. I always carry one when at a gig, so good for impromptu magic or a total F up on my part saved my bacon a few times for sure.

 

[Josh Mickelson]

Yo have you looked at OSYN? It comes with the Advocate download.