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Was The Magic Cafe Right For Banning Me?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Michael Moore, Jan 24, 2011.

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  1. Help me out guys, I just wanna know if Im out of line, or if Ive been totally crapped on for no good reason. OK, I am a big fan of David Copperfield, & I am trying to collect every tv show appearance he has ever done aside from his TV specials, of which I have all of them. As of today when I am writing this, the only commercially available official release of any Copperfield tv special footage is his "Illusion" DVD. So, obviously, anything else that I have obtained on video is from recordings off of tv. Now, if there was an official DVD release of everything Copperfield has ever done that you could buy officially at a store or on-line, Id buy it & this wouldnt be a problem. Sadly, this isnt the case, as the ONLY way to come across these vids is again, through someone who has personally recorded it off of tv. So I post on The Maic Cafe listing all the video I do have, & a list of what Im looking for, & if there was anyone out there who wanted to trade me, or sell me the videos I was after if they had it. So I get a message from Magic Cafe saying "You posted in the wrong area, as there is a place in the forum for trading, but you have to have 50+ posted messages to access it, & everyone here thinks your videos are not originals & are bootlegs & we dont tolerate bootlegging." So I wrote back to the administrator who sent me that messaage saying- "In my post, I never once said that my vids were originals & not bootlegs. Sorry I didnt know the rules about trading. Whats the big deal with wanting to trade videos that arent otherwise commercially available, that the ONLY way to get them is through someone who recorded them off the TV? & even if I get acccess to the trading forum, & repsted my message, would it just get removed anyways since I am trading "bootleg videos?" My response back....PERMANENTLY BANNED!!! I was like ***!?! R U KIDDING ME? No response back? Not a no, "you cant re-post your message", or "You cant trade those videos here/ This will be a warning" etc. No, NOTHING!! Just POOF! Account BANNED!!!! I just dont get it. To me, bootlegging would be buying a legal copy of a movie DVD, & burning an ILLEGAL copy of it, than trying to sell/trade it for something/ put it o the internet as a torrent. So what are you supposed to do in my case where the vids Im looking for YOU CANT BUY ANYWHERE???? Anway, I dont think I would be as pissed if I at least got an answer to my question back to them with them saying at least WHY I am being banned & some what of a reason/justification for them banning me, but no, nothing. & Ive never gotten in trouble with them for anything else before either. & heres the extra kicker- whenever I try to even go to the site, I get an error message saying Im banned, if there are any questions, to contact the website administrator. So If I cant even go to the site, HOW IN THE HECK CAN I CONTACT THE WEBSITE ADMINISTRATOR????????? Not that it matters, cause even if they un-banned me, the damage is done & want NOTHING to do with them ever again, as I feel the way they treated me & handled this matter was TOTALLY unethical & un-called for. All they had to say was- "Were sorry, but since your vids are bootlegs, & you try posting that message again, you will be banned" Than I wouldve listened, & it wouldnt be a problem, no big deal. But they just treat me like I was some troller posting tons of hate messages & harrasing people & deliberately causing trouble. So from this day on, if anyone ever asks me about the Cafe I will say nothing but negative things about them, just not on the internet though, cause that would be trolling, & I dont do that.
  2. They probably banned your computers IP address. If that's the case, you won't ever be able to access the site from that specific computer. I do think this sounds like Crap, though.
  3. ATH


    Try restarting your router. That may change your IP address. (Doesn't work for everyone, though.)
  4. IP is issued by your service provider. You can't change it unless they change it.
  5. [rant] insert flaming rant about the Cafe here. [/rant]

    I'm going to withdraw what I said earlier about the Cafe, less it come back to bite me in the rear later. But needless to say this isn't the first time I've heard of something unfavorable like this happening on their website.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 24, 2011
  6. They may have been a little quick on the draw, as their warning was not really clearly a last warning. But then, to come back and say "I never once said that my vids were originals & not bootlegs" could be read as an admission of sorts that they are bootlegs (and I believe technically they are - if they were never licensed for reproduction or anything besides a broadcast {and the private use as a recording}, then they're right.

    Will PM you the email to you to sort out this misunderstanding.
  7. However out-of-line the magic cafe was, I'm thinking you were a little out-of-line as well. I know that they aren't available, I understand that. But the fact that the footage is copyrighted and you don't own the right to legally distribute or obtain the said footage makes these, in all technicality, bootlegs. It was wrong of them to not respond to you, but then again you kinda set yourself up.
  8. As I understand it, videos recorded from TV for personal use and not for commercial distribution are perfectly legal. Starting from the invention of the VCR, there's plently of precedent for not-for-profit recording, lending, and trading of TV shows. I would email the Magic Cafe, clarifying that the recordings in question are personal recordings from TVof shows that have not been commercially released, as I think the message you sent them could have been misinterpreted. I think they may have reacted based on your use of the word "bootleg", which has connotations of an illegal copy. Does anyone remember all the old videos Lee Asher used to post on his site? I don't imagine he owned the copyright to them, or received written permission from the copyright holders to distribute the videos in this way.
  9. Yes and no. You can record for home use based on the 1984 Supreme Court decision in Sony v. Universal Studios. You can't record and then sell the copy. That violates copyright law. From a legal perspective trading is the same as selling. That is, you give them a copy and get something in return. It doesnt matter whether that somethig is money or a copy of another video.

    By asking people to sell or trade, you are offering to engage in a transaction that violates copyright law. It doesnt matter that the recordings are not commercially available. MooreMagic's response could be misread as arguing about the legality.

    To MooreMagic, if you contact the Cafe, explain that you didn't realize that what you were doing was wrong and that you researched the issue and realized your mistake. Apologize and ask to be reinstated. Arguing or coming across as if you've been wronged wont help.
  10. Well to be honest, you were kind of speaking in a youtube lets trade magic secrets way. If you responded to the moderator that banned you like the way you wrote it out to us, I'd probably ban you too. I don't know what you are doing, I don't know what kind of merit you have, etc. Also the reason why most of DC's specials aren't on DVD is because of music rights.
  11. He can use a proxy server to overcome that problem.

    But why? As much as I like the quality of the posts in that forum, I don´t like the administration. They are a bunch of %"§&", sorry.
    It´s not worth it.
    And no, I was never banned from that site but I have some experience with their politics and behaviour.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 24, 2011
  12. ChrisKenner

    ChrisKenner theory11 artist

    Moore Majik,

    I know you very well and have even emailed you to see if you have a clip online. Magic Cafe is run by Steve Brooks. If you get hold of him tell him to contact me if he still has an issue with you asking for Copperfield videos.

  13. Wow, thanks Chris! I will contact Steve & see what he says. I didnt want to contact you about the matter as I know Ive bugged you enough in the past about DC videos & your a busy guy, & I apologize for that. I did e-mail you back a couple of times about that video you were looking for but you didnt respond back, so I figured you did come across it. But I still have it if you still need it. Again, thanks for helping me out, it means alot to me.
  14. congratulations!

    You will learn that the Green Swill Pond is one of the biggest laughing points in the really big world of Magic. . . more so if you are involved with Mentalism and/or Bizarre Magick (the two areas from which the majority of booted off bandits come. .. but then most mentalists & bizarrists aren't known for holding their tongues nor, for being a butt kiss of any sort. . . we won't even get into the Political & Religious orientation points that will get you ousted from that sight).

    Wear your banning proud. . . consider becoming part of the "How Many Times Can I Get Banned from the Cafe" club. . . there's hundreds of us and most all of us got booted for the same exact reason; we thought we lived in a FREE nation where one could simply talk like a normal person would; being allowed your opinion, beliefs, etc. without retribution. . . :confused: guess we were wrong :rolleyes:

    I can't name names, but there are some very big players that have been banned from the Cafe so you are amongst good company. Don't take it personal and choose to move on -- YOU DON'T NEED THEM!
  15. I have never even bothered to sign up there because of stories like this.
  16. It's like but funnier. You should read it more often.
  17. Wha? The Cafe is the property of whoever pays the bills there. We do live in a free nation where you can establish your own voice on your own dime. If the owner(s) of the Cafe are paying to keep the Cafe running, then they can call the shots. Right? Wrong? I can't say. I can only say to learn the culture, rules and customs of any community online before sticking your neck out. Every site/room/forum is different, even if they cover familiar topics.

    I would also like to say that I like seeing this side of Chris Kenner. Not just the kindness he is showing to a fan, but the man who has a positive and productive answer.
  18. I was banned from the cafe too... But mine was for no reason (or I think it was). All I did was create a thread, and reply to people. Nothing disrespectful, nothing rude (again not that I noticed). Next time I went on the website my thread had disappeared. I tried logging on, and guess what? ACCOUNT BANNED PERMANENTLY. No warnings, nothing. I tried emailing the owner, asking if there was a mistake or something, and got no reply back. I thought it was weird, but whatever, cause I use other forums. This happened some months, almost a year ago, I don't care anymore, but still don't know why I was banned.
  19. And therein lies the problem with the Cafe: it's poorly run. The mods are draconian, but unreliably so. Bannings are sometimes arbitrary, the rules are enforced inconsistently, and favoritism get played. No working pro goes there unless they have a product to sell. It's a massive circle jerk of cretinous insipidity played out among a confederacy of dunces. It's a community for wannabes and nevergonnabes run by more of the same.

    I'm taking Craig's side on this one. The Magic Cafe is free to suck far away from me and anyone else with an ounce of self-respect.
  20. Aaaaaand, he's back :)
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