theory11 — Magic Tricks & the World's Finest Playing Cards

Dai Vernon: The Spirit of Magic

kennethcmerrill said:
I watched this through today, for the second time in a few years. While I disagree with many of his life decisions, Dai Vernon is a fascinating character and one of the greatest magicians to ever live. This documentary is well worth a watch if you haven't.

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I've watched that documentary before and it had me thinking that they should do a live action biopic of Dai Vernon. I think it would easily be an Oscar-worthy contender. The question is, who should star as Dai Vernon?
 
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TylerScottIllusionist said:
I've watched that documentary before and it had me thinking that they should do a live action biopic of Dai Vernon. I think it would easily be an Oscar-worthy contender. The question is, who should star as Dai Vernon?
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It'd need to be somebody who wasn't just doing it for the money because it was a gig. The actor would need to at least care about magic a little. Ideally, it'd be somebody with a little bit of skill in the art coming in to the project. Neil Patrick Harris might be able to do the middle years.
 
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Who, outside of the magic world, would be that interested in a biopic of Dai Vernon? It would take a skilled screen writer to create a movie that would be interesting to people outside of this world.
 
ChristopherT said:
Who, outside of the magic world, would be that interested in a biopic of Dai Vernon? It would take a skilled screen writer to create a movie that would be interesting to people outside of this world.
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Are you serious? Between all the drama involved in his private life, his obsession with his craft, and his narcissistic personality; Vernon's life is begging to be made into a feature. His life is every bit as interesting as Howard Hughes and look at how well Aviator did among critics. Plus the Oscars are obsessed with historical biopics since they usually very successful at the Oscars year after year. Vernon has been called the last great undiscovered artist of the 21st century and the film industry eats that stuff up especially when the protagonist is a controversial figure.

But to answer your question more directly, look at how well The Prestige did with only a budget of $40 million. It pulled in almost $110 million at the box office and you can't tell me it was just the magic world that supported that film. Also films like Now You See Me pull in a lot of attention outside of the magic world.

If the production values are of a high quality with the right marketing campaign the film would easily do well.
 
The Prestige was a feud movie that had magic as the setting. Kind of like the difference between card magic, and magic that happens to use cards. This is a movie that happens to have magic in it. Unlike The Illusionist - which is a magic movie. The whole second half of the movie one long magic trick. The Illusionist, however, did around 87 million in the box office.

Now You See Me is a heist movie with magic in it.

Cast Away was a story about survival against the odds - the volleyball thing was just quirky.

A movie about Vernon could definitely do well - a movie about anyone could do well, and he was an interesting character in life. The trouble would be getting someone to care enough to put the effort into making it that good. Also, my guess is that if they did make a successful movie about his life, magicians won't like it on average.
 
ChristopherT said:
The trouble would be getting someone to care enough to put the effort into making it that good.
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As a script writer myself, I saw the script writing itself as I watched the documentary. All it would take is for an accomplished script writer to watch the documentary and they would easily see how they could have something on their hands.

ChristopherT said:
Also, my guess is that if they did make a successful movie about his life, magicians won't like it on average.
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I'm curious as to why you think this. I know films like Burt Wonderstone and Now You See Me did a bad job of portraying how magicians actually are which upset most of the community but a biopic wouldn't have as outlandish characters as what those movies had. It just can't make the mistake of of the Houdini biopic that the History channel made which was not historically accurate. I think if they get that right, the majority of the magic community would appreciate it.
 
Because to make it appealing to a general audience they will focus on the drama and conflict, probably blowing it up a bit more than it was in history, and then magicians will complain that there isn't enough magic and that the movie is dragging their beloved Professor through the mud for ticket sales.

I've already mentioned a perfect example of this -
The Illusionist vs. The Prestige. The Illusionist is demonstrably more of a 'magic' movie than The Prestige. The Prestige is all about the drama and feud between Angier and Borden, whereas The Illusionist was a magic trick in and of itself. The Prestige did 30 million more in the box office. Also - have you read The Prestige book? The story they put in the movie was about half of the story from the book. Coincidentally, the dramatic half.
 
I could see his parenting style becoming the main focal point. Instead of being a great magician who wasn't Father of the Year, it'd be a flick about a horrible, awful, terrible father who sometimes did magic.
 
The trick of biopics, like Christopher is hinting at, is that life is inherently boring. It takes a lot of skill to pick the drama out of an entire lifetime and make it interesting and relatable to the average person. The documentary I posted did a pretty great job; though I will say that I doubt most non-magicians would find it entertaining at all.

If I were going to make a biopic about Vernon, I would just make a screen adaptation of the book "The Magician and the Cardsharp." I haven't read that book yet (I'm looking forward to it!) but it seems like it chose a good chapter of Vernon's life to cover. Vernon has a clear but elusive objective: find the man who can deal from the middle of the deck. It's rare that someone has such a clear and tangible objective in their life that is also so uncommon and mysterious. The movie would be about a man who is obsessive to a fault, who must be the best at what he does even though it's very arguable that what he does is trivial. What does that kind of pursuit do to someone?

Well, it probably doesn't actually do as much as a movie would make it out to do :)
 
The biggest lesson I learned in film school was that what interests me doesn't usually interest others. And the even harder truth is that even the most interesting things can be rendered completely inert by a poor storyteller. It made me realize how difficult it actually is to be a good magician. Sleights and tricks are the easiest part of a magician's job. The actual difficulty is getting people to care about pieces of pasteboard and billiard balls and handkerchiefs.

When I first got into this hobby, I wanted to perform all the time for everyone--I would rush tricks out the door before they were sufficiently mastered, not even thinking about how to present them. Now I feel stupid performing the most basic effects because I still haven't figured out why anyone should care.
 
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kennethcmerrill said:
The biggest lesson I learned in film school was that what interests me doesn't usually interest others.
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The woes of a film maker in a nutshell. ;)

Currently having that issue with some projects I'm working on. I realized that some of the stuff that I like and goes to festivals won't appeal to mass audiences. So I'm wondering if I should sacrifice my identity and passions for mainstream entertainment or stay true to myself and have it go unappreciated. It's a struggle.
 
Myself and all of my brothers are starting to get established in film. So maybe in a couple of years when we're hopefully even more established we could do it as a family! Haha I'm so hoping this will happen!!! :)
 
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TylerScottIllusionist said:
So I'm wondering if I should sacrifice my identity and passions for mainstream entertainment or stay true to myself and have it go unappreciated. It's a struggle.
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You know it's funny because people call guys like Paul Thomas Anderson or Wes Anderson or Spike Jonze "auteurs" because they have such distinctive styles. But they're not auteurs. "Auteur" originally meant a director who can still do something interesting and distinctive even though his films are studio films with all that pressure for commercial appeal. A great example of a modern auteur would be Clint Eastwood. He makes mainstream entertainment with commercial appeal, but his identity and passion shines through. Anderson and Anderson aren't auteurs; they get to do whatever they want; they get paid to be quirky and weird--that's their job.

Now, I'm sure we would all like to be an Anderson, but the truth is I don't think commercial appeal and passion are mutually exclusive. Just ask Clint Eastwood.

That's just my opinion though :)
 
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Sorry for the double-post. We're into the busy period and I'm a bit scattered today.

I think a biopic about Vernon finding the center deal could be interesting and appeal to both the magic and lay audiences. As you said, the specific goal and obsessive goal hook could work really well.
 
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