I was wondering if anyone could tell me exactly how the Japanese practice the muscle pass with weights. They do this to get a higher jump of the coin. Basically I would like to know what the best methods and weights and materials are for practicing with. Glue the weights on the coin, glue coins together?
Japan Muscle Pass Practice
- Thread starter medic91w
- Start date
Apollo Robbins said it
Actually on "Cultural Exchange 1 or 2" Apollo Robbins mentions it while he and Shoot are explaining a trick, but they didn't go into detail Apollo only said that they use weights in Japan to get a higher muscle pass.
Actually on "Cultural Exchange 1 or 2" Apollo Robbins mentions it while he and Shoot are explaining a trick, but they didn't go into detail Apollo only said that they use weights in Japan to get a higher muscle pass.
dunno about the training methods in Japan, but if I practice with US halves, then go to the thin, "chinese coins" I have, those things fly almost double height. Makes sense.....
If you would actually like to see how *some* Japanese people practice the muscle pass you need to watch the "Busters 3" DVD by Shoot Ogawa.
There is a demo on that video of the muscle pass being performed by Hiroki Ito. Hiroki places the back of his hand flat against a small round pad on a table. Sitting next to the pad on the table is a strange device that looks like a pole vault for the muscle pass. On the front of it is a ruler (or meter stick) and there is a metal arm that is adjustable for height. The goal is perform the muscle pass over the bar, just like in pole vaulting. All I can say is the demo is amazing.
Also on the video Shoot Ogawa goes into great detail explaining various training methods for the muscle pass; such as placing the backs of both hands flat on a table and then perform the muscle pass from one hand to the other. After you can do that, stack a few decks of cards on the the table and place them between your hands and see if you make the coin jump over the height of the decks, if you can keep adding more decks. Challenge your friends and see who can do the most!
Shoot also provides lots of other methods and tips for height as well as use of the muscle pass; however this isn't a muscle pass video. Also on the video:
* Card Setting
* Coin Roll
* Thimbles
The sections on the coin roll and card setting (going from a shuffled to a known order) have demos which are also equally amazing as the muscle pass stuff.
Now the bad news, I believe you can only get this video if you attend Shoot's lecture. However there is a photo of it on Shoot's Myspace page.
http://www.myspace.com/shootogawa
Anyway, I believe the *real* secret is not worry too much about how other people train, just make a game out of training (challenge your friends) have fun and try to constantly find new and different ways to measure, test and develop skill. Your motto should be "keep going"...
Hope this helps.
There is a demo on that video of the muscle pass being performed by Hiroki Ito. Hiroki places the back of his hand flat against a small round pad on a table. Sitting next to the pad on the table is a strange device that looks like a pole vault for the muscle pass. On the front of it is a ruler (or meter stick) and there is a metal arm that is adjustable for height. The goal is perform the muscle pass over the bar, just like in pole vaulting. All I can say is the demo is amazing.
Also on the video Shoot Ogawa goes into great detail explaining various training methods for the muscle pass; such as placing the backs of both hands flat on a table and then perform the muscle pass from one hand to the other. After you can do that, stack a few decks of cards on the the table and place them between your hands and see if you make the coin jump over the height of the decks, if you can keep adding more decks. Challenge your friends and see who can do the most!
Shoot also provides lots of other methods and tips for height as well as use of the muscle pass; however this isn't a muscle pass video. Also on the video:
* Card Setting
* Coin Roll
* Thimbles
The sections on the coin roll and card setting (going from a shuffled to a known order) have demos which are also equally amazing as the muscle pass stuff.
Now the bad news, I believe you can only get this video if you attend Shoot's lecture. However there is a photo of it on Shoot's Myspace page.
http://www.myspace.com/shootogawa
Anyway, I believe the *real* secret is not worry too much about how other people train, just make a game out of training (challenge your friends) have fun and try to constantly find new and different ways to measure, test and develop skill. Your motto should be "keep going"...
Hope this helps.
Last edited by a moderator:
Amazing advice from ThisOneGoesTo11!!
I would love to have a copy of that video, but i think you can get a lot out of just those comments, id never thought of measuring how high i could shoot it, altough i do often practice with my hand flat against my thigh when sitting down.
I have an old english coin that i found in an antique coin shop, its very dark and thick, and i have used it for practice before with great success. I would say try your local coin shop- not only will you find some lovely old silver coins for routines, but im sure you'll find some weird heavy coins for practice.
My favourite coin at the moment is the English Silver Florin from 1870. lovely
I would love to have a copy of that video, but i think you can get a lot out of just those comments, id never thought of measuring how high i could shoot it, altough i do often practice with my hand flat against my thigh when sitting down.
I have an old english coin that i found in an antique coin shop, its very dark and thick, and i have used it for practice before with great success. I would say try your local coin shop- not only will you find some lovely old silver coins for routines, but im sure you'll find some weird heavy coins for practice.
My favourite coin at the moment is the English Silver Florin from 1870. lovely
Thanks, I'm glad you got something out of it.
Here are a couple of photos of the "measuring device" I was trying to describe:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21994129@N03/
...I'm pretty sure that they built this themselves, so it shouldn't be too hard to create something similar.
There is other good muscle pass advise on the video, so you may want to email Shoot to get an idea of his lecture schedule.
-ThisOneGoesTo11
cool! thanks for that mate, i love the way that peice of kit they've made themselves looks so scientific, it concerns me how good japanese magicians seem to be, i think i need to practice a bit harder!!
I've found a nice way to practice the muscle pass is to sit on the sofa with a chair infront of me, i rest my hand on the seat of the chair and try to shoot the coin over the back.
Its funny though, i put so much practice into this move, and i dont even have that many applications for it. At the moment i only use it for 'the coin that falls up' , a coin in pencap routine, and the occasional vanish. the more i think about it the i think i should be practicing palming stacks of coins instead!
I've found a nice way to practice the muscle pass is to sit on the sofa with a chair infront of me, i rest my hand on the seat of the chair and try to shoot the coin over the back.
Its funny though, i put so much practice into this move, and i dont even have that many applications for it. At the moment i only use it for 'the coin that falls up' , a coin in pencap routine, and the occasional vanish. the more i think about it the i think i should be practicing palming stacks of coins instead!
You will find the exact same phenomenon with other aspects of Japanese culture. (In addition to magic, I also train in nine old school Japanese martial arts.) To me it seems that as a culture they place more value on the cultivation of skill than some other cultures. (Such as my own.) While Magician's often complain about people "stealing" (their routines, patter, etc.) I believe that "stealing" is very important. I feel that we should "steal" their passion and dedication to the cultivation of great skill and make it our own. We should try to "catch" their spirit of joy in training. For most of us, training is WORK, hard work. We should turn our work into a game and have fun doing it! If you are having fun, skill ends up taking care of itself.
Good idea!
This may give you some ideas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKc8sq2inRc
...I haven't picked up this DVD yet, but I plan to do so soon. A full description can be found here:
http://www.themusclepass.com/Contents.html
There is another muscle pass DVD out by Jay Noblezada (Nice guy! I was introduced to him briefly last July when I was in Las Vegas) however based on the trailers and descriptions, if I only had to chose to purchase only one, I believe I would go my David's instead of Jay's. My advise is to cruise over to Penguin Magic and check out Jay's trailer and DVD description and see which seems like a better fit for you.
-ThisOneGoesTo11
Shoot Ogawa has just released a 2 DVD set on the muscle pass!
From www.holyshoot.com products page:
Muscle Pass: A Master of Muscle Pass (2 DVD set)
This DVD is design for beginner Magicians:
* How to start and study Muscle Pass.
* How to use the Muscle Pass
* How to train length and control
* How to show (flourish)
* How to hide (Secret)
* How to think (Theory)
----
-ThisOneGoesTo11
From www.holyshoot.com products page:
Muscle Pass: A Master of Muscle Pass (2 DVD set)
This DVD is design for beginner Magicians:
* How to start and study Muscle Pass.
* How to use the Muscle Pass
* How to train length and control
* How to show (flourish)
* How to hide (Secret)
* How to think (Theory)
----
-ThisOneGoesTo11
Practicing the muscle pass is hard, getting started is not bad. But then getting that required height that you want is hard to train your hand for.
Does anyone know when David Kong plans on releasing his muscle pass DVD?
Does anyone know when David Kong plans on releasing his muscle pass DVD?
When training for height you have to learn to lose as much rotation of the coin as possible. If the coin is spinning rapidly, then you are wasting energy on rotation that could be used for height. When done properly the coin should remain flat and not spin.
I've had my eye on this video for a while, but there is still no release date on David Kong's web site. Just keep checking this site:
http://www.themusclepass.com
Do NOT forget to include the word "the" in the URL!
I think I am going to pick up Shoot's muscle pass 2 DVD set on Friday, just ran across a demo video of one of the routines on it here:
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=27095436
Definitely a complicated routine for laymen to follow, but a real magician fooler which looks like a lot of fun to learn!
-ThisOneGoesTo11