Major Problem!

[ThrallMind]

And by the way I'm sorry, when exactly did you and I cross path that it obviously gives you the idea that you know me and know what experience I have and don't have?

When you said you never did a kids party earlier in this thread:

Yeah, not in a party setting though.

I am not doubting your talent as a magician, bud. I've never seen you perform, so I can't say. However, from what you said when I asked if you performed at a kids party before, and you said no, that leads one to believe you've never performed at a kids party...

-ThrallMind

 

[adjones]

And by the way I'm sorry, when exactly did you and I cross path that it obviously gives you the idea that you know me and know what experience I have and don't have?

You saying you'd never done a show in that setting was a pretty big giveaway.

 

[Justin.Morris]

In agreement to the first advice. Just politely let this Mother know that your show will last 30 min. Apologize for any inconvenience, as she may have planned around you.
A tip for next time (which I'm sure you are learning already, but just to articulate it...)
-Confirm the details of your gig before you go into it. This included cost, time, & expectations. If the client wants a longer show, let her know the extra cost, and possible difficulties that may be involved (like lack of attention spans).
-Also, just because you can't meet her expectations of time, don't lower your price. Remind her that the price you discussed earlier was for a thirty minute show. If she feels that is too much money, then you may lose that gig, but you will maintain your integrity as a performer, and it will give you more time to prepare your show for the next time. Don't sweat it.
-Make sure your routine is really well practiced. Don't add stuff last minute. -Take your time with each routine. (If each effect (hypothetically) only lasted 5 min, then you only need 6 routines. As your routines become polished, they can last much longer. -for example, the performance of Luke Jermays latest routine EI was around 25 min and there is really only 3 effects in the routine. )
-Also feel free to post your show routine here and get lots of feedback (positive and negative). There are a lot of smart minds here that can help contribute and tweak your routines and overall performance.
-and lastly, make sure next time, that you have your show FIRST, then sell it, so you don't run into this 'last minute panick' problem again.

Hope that helps some.
Good luck!

justin

 

[Brad Henderson]

We all have different opinions and I stand strongly on the fact that it can be done from "experience"

Lets just stick to what each one of us knows.

How many times have you performed a 90 minute stand up show for children?

Can you name any successful children's entertainer who performs an in home 90 minute stand up show for children?

And how exactly do you do you "through creativity and tailoring your material to the audience" stretch 30 minutes into 90? How slow CAN you talk?

Brad Henderson

p.s. You're being paid to do a job. No one cares if you have fun.

 

[Elyk]

you dont have to do the show by yourself either. maybe you could have a friend thats also into magic to help out with another 30 min.

 

[KAL-EL]

If you can't have fun, whats the point then?

Regardless if it's a job or not, if you don't have fun while performing then it will reflect and you'll end up with a crappy show.

I disagree with you on this.

 

[Brad Henderson]

Then apparently you know nothing about the theater or acting. Do you think that all actors are having "fun" when they are on stage? Do you think it's "fun" to make yourself emotionally vulnerable night after night, dealing with tragic issues? Do you think it's "fun" going onstage when your best friend just died or you are are being audited by the IRS? Do you think it's "fun" having to give all you have when you are sick?

Do you think for a moment that the audience knows or cares?

No, they don't.

For a hobbyist it may be about fun. But then again, for a hobbyist it is often about their own pleasure, not the audience's.

When you decide to take money for a show, you have promised to deliver. The audience cannot tell what you FEEL. They can only SEE what you show.

May I suggest you take a moment to study a bit of Meisner or read David Mamet's brilliant True and False.


So often we read posts by people who claim to know what they are talking about, and then they write things that clearly demonstrate they do not.

This is one of those cases.

Brad Henderson

 

[KAL-EL]

Then apparently you know nothing about the theater or acting. Do you think that all actors are having "fun" when they are on stage? Do you think it's "fun" to make yourself emotionally vulnerable night after night, dealing with tragic issues? Do you think it's "fun" going onstage when your best friend just died or you are are being audited by the IRS? Do you think it's "fun" having to give all you have when you are sick?

Do you think for a moment that the audience knows or cares?

No, they don't.

For a hobbyist it may be about fun. But then again, for a hobbyist it is often about their own pleasure, not the audience's.

When you decide to take money for a show, you have promised to deliver. The audience cannot tell what you FEEL. They can only SEE what you show.

May I suggest you take a moment to study a bit of Meisner or read David Mamet's brilliant True and False.

Then maybe they should find something else to. As for the audience, Then why would they go see a play or show if they aren't even into it.

So often we read posts by people who claim to know what they are talking about, and then they write things that clearly demonstrate they do not.

This is one of those cases.

Brad Henderson

To each his own my friend,...to each his own.

 

[ThrallMind]

Then maybe they should find something else to. As for the audience, Then why would they go see a play or show if they aren't even into it.

Buddy, if you could find a job where you are always, 100% of the time happy, never let go of it. I promise you, ask any entertainer, they will say they have made sacrifices, or that there have been times they couldn't put their heart into the work. What you said here is just, well, ignorant. If something tragic happens, no amount of "love for the art" will make you forget about that. As Brad said, if your best friend died the night before a performance, I'm sure it will be on your mind if you manage to make it to your show that day to begin with.

I can speak with 100% personal experience that magic can take your mind off of things, but it will still be in the back of your mind.

I changed my mind, it isn't ignorant, it's just plain stupid for you to say that if someone can't forget a parent died that they should give up their art. To do that would mean you are an unfeeling, emotionless, heartless human being. I would much rather be someone who cannot give 100% all the time than be that.

To each his own my friend,...to each his own.

That doesn't even make sense...

-ThrallMind

 

[Brad Henderson]

Then maybe they should find something else to. As for the audience, Then why would they go see a play or show if they aren't even into it.

The point is, the audience does not know if the actor is "into it." It's called acting. The audience cannot see what you feel. They do not know what you are thinking. Further, they do not care. What they care about is what they SEE - or more specifically, what you show them. It is what they see which affects them. As a human being we often show one thing as we feel another. It is the essence of magic. Do we really feel the coin has disappeared? Of course not. But we offer artifice.

When you perform you do the same. The audience does not know if you were abused as a child, but you can make them believe you were - or hide it from them. The audience does not know if you just were dumped by the love of your life. But you can make them believe you were - or you can hide it from them.

Kind of like our coin, no?

Our responsibility is to our audience. Our feelings are irrelevant. Now, you can be arrogant and think "If I don't have fun, I'm not going to do it." And for a hobbyist, that's fine. But when you put your name on the bottom of the contract you are obligated to deliver!

Otherwise, you are a failure.

Brad Henderson

 

[KAL-EL]

I changed my mind, it isn't ignorant, it's just plain stupid for you to say that if someone can't forget a parent died that they should give up their art. To do that would mean you are an unfeeling, emotionless, heartless human being. I would much rather be someone who cannot give 100% all the time than be that.



That doesn't even make sense...

-ThrallMind

I never said that they should forget anything that makes them unhappy just so they can perform. If something like what you said happened, well no ****, no one on Earth will be able to perform no matter what. The normal thing to do in a situation like this would be to cancel the show and move it to another date.

I don't think you understood what I was trying to say.

What I mean is that you need to like what you do and have or find some fun doing it. I know not everyone is happy doing some of the things they're doing right now, and if that 's the case then maybe they should continue searching for that one thing that makes them happy. For example, if you chose to be a teacher, or doctor you become one because you like it and in so doing you also have fun doing it. I know that on certain days you might not like it because of x reasons and you wouldn't be able to perform efficiently, that's why you take your days of or whatever it is this people do to deal with that feeling of sadness, or lose. But ultimately you chose that line of work because you like it not because some one forced you into.

Now this guy, the thread beginner, got hired for a job which he accepted. He comes on here asking what to do as far as the situation is concern. All I said was that he should relax and add some tricks he knows and change the patter for his kid audience, GRANTED HE STILL WANTS TO DO THE HOUR AND HALF SHOW. Now if he doesn't think he could meet the customer's demand for and show three times as the original then by all means he should do what some of you have suggested. I'm not telling him to quit performing because he finds it hard to fill an hour long show.

And furthermore, I agree with you Brad, obviously this guy likes to perform. He might have a hard time fill the demand of the customer, and he should decide whether to do it or not. If he choses to do the show, I'm saying relax and have fun with it. If he doesn't, he should politely tell the lady he's not doing it. And just to clarify, if he choses the last option, I'm not saying he should quit.

 

[Brad Henderson]

If something like what you said happened, well no ****, no one on Earth will be able to perform no matter what. The normal thing to do in a situation like this would be to cancel the show and move it to another date.

No. You DO perform. Every performer encounters this situation. Where do you think the phrase "the show must go on" came from?

You can't cancel the date. You get your head together, and you deliver like you are required to....and the audience will NEVER know!

Brad Henderson

 

[KAL-EL]

No. You DO perform. Every performer encounters this situation. Where do you think the phrase "the show must go on" came from?

You can't cancel the date. You get your head together, and you deliver like you are required to....and the audience will NEVER know!

Brad Henderson

I'm referring to what the person before said. If someone died, God forbid, the normal thing some people would do is to cancel the show and move it for another day.

On the other hand, if you find yourself going out and hating what you do then you're probably in the wrong business.

 

[morpheis91]

Now this is an interesting thread. First off I would not make my show 1.5 hours. That is absurd for a childrens venue. This is what you need to do. Now this is a business agreement you want half and hour and she wants 1.5 hours. In business there is a term known as a comprimise. What you can do is tell her about the short attention spans of children if she then says no, maybe try and sell her the idea of 45 min (this is still much for me) and if that still doesnt work sprin her the idea of 30 min for the kids then 30 min for the adults. You and I both know that adults enjoy magic very much, I am an adult and I obviously enjoy them. I did a walk around on wednesday for 1.5 hours at a counrty club and it was amazing because of the adults. There were kids running around but they were pleased with small candies coming out of their ears and things like that. I think thatyou should Definite try and do 30 min for the kids and 30 min for adults, I think that you will enjoy the 30 min with the adults very much. Please tell us what happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[KAL-EL]

the idea of 30 min for the kids then 30 min for the adults. You and I both know that adults enjoy magic very much, I am an adult and I obviously enjoy them. I did a walk around on wednesday for 1.5 hours at a counrty club and it was amazing because of the adults. There were kids running around but they were pleased with small candies coming out of their ears and things like that. I think thatyou should Definite try and do 30 min for the kids and 30 min for adults, I think that you will enjoy the 30 min with the adults very much. Please tell us what happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree with you on this. It's one of the suggestion I had given earlier, but someone had a feeling it would be a bad idea.

Walk around at a kids party? That isn't a good idea. With parties, parents pay you to take the kids off their hands for about 45 minutes. Once the kids don't have to sit down and watch you, don't even THINK about getting their attention if they are occupied with something else, such as playing with little Billy's new toys. As far as the parents, very rarely will they care to see what you have to show. It's a kids party, not a "street" environment. You need to act as such. Unless the only thing thats at the party is the magic, the kids will go ADD on you.-ThrallMind

Go figure.....

 

[Corey]

O.K. So I've been following along with this thread since yesterday. First, I would like to say good luck to the guy who started the thread(jackofclubs I think). Second I would like to say that children will not sit still to an hour and a half show that has not had enough time put into it.
Children are allways looking to be entertained, and if you lose their interest, and the parents notice, then you'r show is done, and you'r reputation might go up in flames. The half-an-hour show is good enough, an hour and a half will be too much in a days time. I don't care how long you've been doing magic, no-one has the ability to create an hour and a half show in one day. The largest contributor, is that you have to practice, and make sure it will last that long. Twenty four hours in a day.... I don't know about you, but I have to go over my routines countless times before performing them. And at an hour and a half per full practice routine, I think you would get pretty tired and not get much proper practice in.
I have a four hour walk-around gig in my town next weekend, and I have put literally tonns of time and money into it, but I have had a month to do it. If someone told me they wanted me to make it 12 hours now, I would say no, not because of the time, but because of the time I have left to get everything together.
I think most people on this thread will agree with me and say, it would be really hard to do you'r job efficiently enough for the parents, and children. If I were you, I would tell the lady that you just don't have enough material to cover an hour and a half, rather than trying to tell her that her kid won't sit still that long.
But again, the best of luck to you, no matter what you decide.

 

[KAL-EL]

Well, I think he said the show was today, I'd like to know what he's going to do.

 

[Brad Henderson]

Corey,

With a walk around gig, you only need to perform two or three tricks for a group then you move on. I have worked large gigs where I have done only one trick all night. 12 hours though is sheer madness. You will loose your voice and be beat. But when it comes to walk around, having two or three killer tricks and learning how to mingle will go a lot farther than pockets bulging with magic toys.

Brad

 

[Guardian452]

Tell the mother that a 90 minutes kid show would be a mistake. The attention span of a child is far less than that. 20-30 minutes is ideal. 45 if you know what you are doing. Clearly this is something new for you.

Let her know, politely, that the show is 30 minutes long.

If she does not budge, then perhaps it would be best to step back from the show. Find a more experienced magician in your area, and send them the work. This would be far better than showing up and doing a poor job. As to the money you deserve...well, how much to you deserve when selling a show you have never performed before?

The material sold here and on E is not children's magic. If this is something you wish to pursue, buy Seriously Silly by David Kaye and Paths to Enchantment by Michael Yaffe. While I am not a fan of the David Ginn approach to magic, you might want to look at his work as well as that of Samuel Patrick Smith. Lately, Mike Bent has offered some clever material appropriate for this audience.

I think you may have bit off more than you can chew. Either convince the mother to keep it bite sized, or differ to someone who can cover for you.

Good luck,

Brad Henderson

i just crapped myself.

thats absoutely right, great post

 

[Brad Henderson]

I'm honored