Things that I always wonder about

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Bliff, May 27, 2018.

  1. As magicians, we are playing the part of real magician.So i
    thought about some questions.
    -Would a real magician carry cards with him?
    -Would a real magician say, he
    doesn't have anything on him,
    when he is asked to perform by someone?
    -Would he feel entitled to be mean and make stupid jokes?
    If we agree mentalist is someone who is playing the part of real mind reader...
    -Would a real mind reader ask you to write something down?
    -Would he ask you to look at a page of a book and choose a word to "read your mind"?
    -Would he bore you to death because there is nothing visual
    to look? And everything he says seems something he memorized and lifeless?
     
    Lord Magic likes this.
  2. Questions of life with Morgan Freeman
     
  3. As a real magician and mentalist, I feel qualified to answer.

    Would a real magician carry cards with him?


    Possibly, if they liked to play cards. Better question is whether they would carry a Run Rabbit Run prop.

    Would a real magician say, he doesn't have anything on him, when he is asked to perform by someone?

    No. They would say, I really don't need to perform for you on command like a trained monkey.

    Would he feel entitled to be mean and make stupid jokes?

    Depends on their personality and whether the spectator did something to deserve to be ridiculed.

    Would a real mind reader ask you to write something down?

    Yes, because otherwise nobody else will know if you are telling the truth about what you thought of. A real mind reader knows that people lie.

    Would he ask you to look at a page of a book and choose a word to "read your mind"?

    Yes, because it allows you to think of a truly random word. Real mind reading is difficult without a way to focus the thoughts of the person's who's mind you are reading. You really don't want to read what they are actually thinking... you would be disappointed what you find.

    Would he bore you to death because there is nothing visual to look?

    Assuming entertainment is the opposite of boredom, you don't need something visual to be entertaining. Impossibility, amazement and wonder occurs in the mind's eye. It is what you experience, which is more than what you see.

    And everything he says seems something he memorized and lifeless?

    There is nothing wrong with drafting a script and them memorizing it. The problem is that when you perform it you have to make it seem spontaneous. If you've ever done a demonstration or presentation in front of a group of people, you will know that you are better off having something written down, practicing it and then presenting as if it is impromptu.
     
  4. #4 Al e Cat Dabra, May 27, 2018
    Last edited: May 27, 2018
    I honestly don't think we are playing the part of a "real magician." At least speaking for myself, I am not. People are not naive enough to think we are doing real magic. I try to be first and foremost an entertainer who uses props, presentation, skill and illusion to entertain. With the performance of mentalism, as opposed to "magic," however, it may be a different story, as there is an element there of conveying real psychic powers.
     
    Gabriella J and Mr_ARPY like this.
  5. I feel the ironi in this question line. I can agree with those who write before me. And yes, a magician is someone, who act like a "real wizard", this is the quote, but in my opinion this is not always true, not so. Magician is a magician, its kind of something can stand alone, not to relate, or connect or has to copy or whatever something. Magician do tricks, and can do tricks, and fool you like hell, that you maybe think, Oh Gosh, HOW? maybe this is real? or not? But the importance I feel, is that this fact always stay open (until you reveal the secret). And because of this, people maybe start to think more, or just wanna search for some answers, many of my spectators after my short or longer shows reported back, that they started to read more, and be more curious to the World, be more open, and more precise of how to see the things around. Its really importan I guess. And sorry for this bullshit I talked about… its just a meditation in this warm Sunday haha :) Greetings to you All guys :) Cheers
     
    Mr_ARPY likes this.
  6. RealityOne, I loved your answers.
    Infact some of the ideas you mentioned are the answers I give myself and my brain makes other
    points.
    1-When you are performing with cards, you are demonstrating skill.Skill can be part of magic but magic isn't just a skill.
    2-Most people, when they ask you to perform for them,they aren't doing it to be rude or think you are trained monkey.
    4-When a mentalist asks you to write something down, you can give reasons why but what you are performing will not feel "pure".
    5-You can ask them to choose to think something "random" but from a book isn't logical and doesn't make sense.
     
    Greg0ry likes this.
  7. When you are performing with cards, you are demonstrating skill.

    It can be portrayed that way, but that isn't necessarily the only way to portrait it. There are card routines that look like skill and those that look like magic.

    Skill can be part of magic but magic isn't just a skill.

    True. See the first part of the Robert-Houdin quote about being a magician (which you don't have in your post)

    Most people, when they ask you to perform for them, they aren't doing it to be rude or think you are trained monkey.

    Agreed. I see your point that a true magician should be that 24/7... which means learning magic with everyday objects or being prepared by carrying things to perform with. But my point was that you don't ask a doctor to perform surgery or an accountant to balance your check book -(it does have to be yours because it wouldn't be real if the checkbook wasn't borrowed) if you meet them at a cocktail party, why would you ask a magician to do magic?

    When a mentalist asks you to write something down, you can give reasons why but what you are performing will not feel "pure".

    That is the view you have decided to impose on yourself. I have no problem crafting a routine where it seems perfectly rational for the person to write down what they are thinking. I've never had any spectator question why they have to write something down. It may be different if you are performing for a single person, but if you are performing for multiple people, it is the only way that the other people can verify that you accurately named what they were thinking of. As a result, if I could really read minds, I would have them write it down as a way for the audience to see that I'm correct.

    Also, there are many routines where the spectator is not required to write something down. Thus, it can be justified in one effect and there be no need for it in another. Also, there is a lot of symbolism in writing something down - especially if it is a name of someone, a fear or problem, a question, etc.

    You can ask them to choose to think something "random" but from a book isn't logical and doesn't make sense.

    It is up to the magician or mentalist to explain (in a plausible manner) why they are using the book. It is also up to the magician to sell the effect.

    I was watching a friend's magic and mentalism show. I had helped him develop and script parts of the show. My friend had introduced me to the person who was in charge of the charity that was hosting the show as his "theatrical and technical consultant." I was talking to person in charge the charity after the second show of the evening and she expressed a little bit of sadness that she couldn't experience what the people who were called up on stage experience. I smiled and asked her if she wanted to try something. She agreed. I grabbed one of the three books that had been used in the performance (they were the performer's books that he actually bought at a bookstore when he arrived in NYC). I had her flip to any page she wanted and pick out a prominent word or phrase. I asked her to focus on the word or phrase and to visualize it. I looked in her eyes and then closed mine. I told her "I have a sense that she was thinking about noticing something but that I was also getting an image of writing something down but not actually writing it down but thinking about it." I looked at her with a look that said "am I on the right track?" and she very subtlety nodded. "There is something I'm missing." She bit her lip as if she wanted to tell me what I'm missing. "It is taking something." Pause. "It is taking notes or a note." Pause. "But you are thinking it. It's a.." Pause as if I'm looking for the exact phrase. "Mental note. Is the phrase you are thinking of "taking a mental note?" The look on her face was a combination of amazement and belief. Based on her reaction, she has an amazing story that I suspect she has retold many times. I can almost guarantee, in none of those stories she said, "Yeah, but it was strange that he used this book that was sitting on the nearby table."​
     
    Al e Cat Dabra likes this.
  8. Yes to all your questions.
     
  9. That depends on how you would describe what we do? I myself consider myself to be a sleight of hand artist. If anyone asks me how I did something, I would say lots and lots of practice. When you do magic for someone, even if you do really good, they still think there is some trickery behind it. The best approach is what Derren Brown does. He says he is using psychology and body language(even if he isnt) and when the spectator understands that you arent trying to convince them that you are a superhero or an alien with supernatural abilities, they wont try to treat what you do like a puzzle.
    All in all, that is the best approach in my oppinion and as you see, at least I dont pretend to be a "Real" magician.
     
    Al e Cat Dabra likes this.
  10. The reason I asked this questions is, when we have better answers, we become better performancers. (In my opinion). By the way I do
    routines that require to write things down or to look in a book and "choose" a word.It all comes
    down to making what we do logical, framing and the right context. I appreciate your answers, especially RealityOne for consistently answering.
     
    RealityOne and Al e Cat Dabra like this.
  11. In that logic, I cannot help but think that then, a real magician would not do ANYTHING at all, because then,

    THEY WOULD BE BREAKING THE INTERNATIONAL STATUE OF SECRECY!!!

    If you notice anyone doing anything like that, please report the matter at once. The offender shall be asked to appear for a hearing at the Ministry of Magic.
     
  12. Your audience will have an idea of how you do the things you do. Either they will decide it's all tricks, or they will decide it's real, or they will decide THAT one was just a trick, but THIS one is -definitely- the real thing.

    Personally, I kind of feel that trying to convince them one way or the other is a bit of an insult.

    Instead of trying to say, "Everything I do here is a trick! You're going to think it's real, but I assure you, it's not," I feel it's far superior to create scripting and presentations that will make it clear what your intention is.

    When I perform I make it clear that I'm not trying to convince anyone of supernatural things. I'm just creating unique experiences for them to talk to their friends and family about. Many of the skills I demonstrate are genuine. Usually if the skill isn't genuine, the skill isn't the point of the demonstration. For example, when I do a Smash and Stab routine, it's not about my ability to locate danger - it's about the audience's motivation to see my show.
     
  13. I consider myself to be a magician. A little less pretentious and easier for the people I perform for to understand.
     
    Mr_ARPY likes this.

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