Gaff Cards/Adding them midway in a routine

[Sinful07]

Hello- Im wondering if any of you guys work with gaffed cards in a routine- whether Red bicycle gaffs, Ghost gaffs or ultra gaffs, im wondering How do you incorporate them midway in a routine?

i was thinking, I'd let the spectators shuffle the deck first (and let them inspect the cards one by one) and leave the gaff cards in my pocket then i'd do a derren-brown-esque mind reading thing and put the deck back in my pocket.

i'll patter for a bit, pull the deck back out (with hopefully the gaffs either on top or bottom) and place them wherever i need to. (e.g. on top or bottom, etc)

Obviously this resolves a lot of things, such as if im using a ghost deck and i wanted to do some gaffs (with including the box as part of the routine) i'd let everyone examine/shuffle the cards as much as they want before the trick starts just to show that i am perfectly Fair. It also gives them familiarity with the pip colours etc etc.

i was just wondering if you guys have a similar idea on how to accomplish this, i dont tend to rely on palming by the way, im not confident with palming. =/

 

[magicman384]

The ultragaff dvd had a really helpful section on this subject.

 

[TWB]

I have the ultragaff deck and the dvds. They were the first real gaff cards I got. In the ultragaff deck there is a green backed 6 of spades. So here is an idea...... Take a different backed card or something of that sort. Keep it in your pocket. Force the same card from your regular deck and let the spectator shuffle it back in. Then say something about earlier today you made a prediction. Then pull the card out of your pocket. That way there is no palming and you're left clean.

I did that trick yesterday at a football game and got insane reactions.(Note: to make it completely amazing make sure it is an exotic color back like green or yellow. )

Hope this helps.

Peace out,
TWB

 

[Sinful07]

That's a great idea. i could always Tenkai the cards off (if there's one or two gaffs involved)

ive only got shadowmasters/ghosts as 'exotic' btw.

but that's a good idea. thanks for that =]

 

[TheKingOfCards]

i'll patter for a bit, pull the deck back out (with hopefully the gaffs either on top or bottom) and place them wherever i need to. (e.g. on top or bottom, etc)

Obviously this resolves a lot of things, such as if im using a ghost deck and i wanted to do some gaffs (with including the box as part of the routine) i'd let everyone examine/shuffle the cards as much as they want before the trick starts just to show that i am perfectly Fair. It also gives them familiarity with the pip colours etc etc.

i was just wondering if you guys have a similar idea on how to accomplish this, i dont tend to rely on palming by the way, im not confident with palming. =/

Ok first of all, I would totally keep my starting gaff in the deck. As a rule of thumb, never use gaff after gaff after gaff. At most, in a routine of maybe 6 - 7 effects for a positive audience, you'd want to incorporate 2 at most. This is because you need to still do justice to the previous effects in your routine, as well as continue a crescendo effect so that each magic effect is stronger than the previous one, until your conclusion trick which should leaves spectators a memory of you forever. Unfortunately, incorporating gaffs into a routine is VERY challenging (probably with the mindset that you've read Darwin Ortiz's Strong Magic). Good luck with that. Might have to do some digging up for manuscripts specifically discussing this problem.

Secondly, I'm sorry to bust this bubble of using gaff cards from Ellusionist but DON'T! Haha, by that I mean do not attempt to use gaff cards for different decks other than Red or Blue bicycles. Your spectators, no matter how convinced the deck is normal, will always believe it wasn't or will jump to the next conclusion. It's a typical laymen's brain right there. You're much better off finding gaffs that come in red bicycle decks because they are around 100 times more accepted by spectators. Even then, it's a game to modern spectators. half of them will truly believe you that your deck is normal without asking any questions whatsoever, and the rest of the population represents the Criss Angel hecklers who will do anything to find out how a trick is done. Just my take on the idea, and no disrespect to Ellusionist for selling their other gaff decks ( even I bought one in my naive years haha).

Thirdly, do not be afraid to palm. I think you need to watch some stuff from my friend in the UK, James Brown. His 2008 lecture gives advice on attitude for palming, and his is essentially "I Don't Care." Truly, this has helped me exponentially improve my palming. In the case that you didn't know, try laying your hand out flat and place a card on it. My hand is EXTREMELY small and a card goes from the top of my pinky to the lower base of my thumb. Even then, I have found palming extremely easy in the past few months because of natural misdirection. All you need to do, putting it simply, is have a logical and spectator-friendly reason to make every hand motion you do. Remember, the spectator sees only the performance, not the method. To them, a card to pocket routine is a card to pocket routine, not a top palm or bottom palm ---> pocket or a sidesteal ---> palm ---> pocket. They see what you want them to see, and will react the way you direct them to =)

Sorry for the infinitely long spam, but I feel I haven't contributed my knowledge to this forum as of now, and I guess I'm trying to do my best to start now.

 

[Quicho]

I would recommend not buying the gaff cards, but making themyourselves and experimenting with it. A great example of this can be seen on Daniel Madison's "Burn" Ebook, which I strongly recommend.

 

[TheKingOfCards]

I would recommend not buying the gaff cards, but making themyourselves and experimenting with it. A great example of this can be seen on Daniel Madison's "Burn" Ebook, which I strongly recommend.

I think buying the gaff cards is a great way to experiment, if you have the money. If you want to go into financial terms, you're getting your bang for the buck as well as less time spent if you buy a gaff deck from E or some other seller. If you do happen to purchase one, make sure it's something your spectators will have no tell-tale sign of mischief going on. By that, I mean buy a gaff deck that is red. There are soooo many gaff decks available online that are aybe 3x better than the one at E, and I can vouch for that. Just because Brad Christain can act, doesn't mean the idea is practical. Like what the fudge... unzipping a card? Can you scream FAKE EFFING CARDS any louder?

 

[FOO:L]

Just because Brad Christain can act, doesn't mean the idea is practical. Like what the fudge... unzipping a card? Can you scream FAKE EFFING CARDS any louder?

i always thought the zipper card was painfully funny.
then i figured out that i could use a normal zip , lay in on a card back, vanish it and have it appear on the back on the card. the do the whole zipper thingy.
gaff cards are what you make of them eh.

anyway. i think the original suggestion of mindreading and then pulling the deck back out from the pocket is a really good idea. for me, i always have a little packet of gaffs in my pocket so i can add em on during an offbeat moment.

 

[TheKingOfCards]

I guess the zipper thing is funny, but I would NEVER create a routine or alter it ONE SINGLE bit to accomodate a gaff card. With the amount of time and research I put into effect and routine - building, I wouldn't make a change unless some miracle effect came along that would happen to routine well and fit my purposes. But yeah, I have to admit... it's sorta funny. I've had spectators laugh hysterically at some gaffs.

 

[FOO:L]

I've had spectators laugh hysterically at some gaffs.

garcia doing the sexy gaff routine owns all tricks out there. period.
*does the danny flirting glance/stare/raises eyebrow thing

 

[Sinful07]

I appreciate the comments- Though some of the gaffs in the gaff ghost deck is a godsend, and Justin Miller carefully goes through the nooks and crannies into utilizing the gaff deck. (specially Pip Matrix and the bloody 13 of diamonds, which has been a godsend Closer)

Ive bought it like a year ago- i dont find uses for any of the other gaffs (such as the dead kings, the Queen of diamonds/hearts turnover etc) but i find the other ones such as the blank cards, blurred cards and so on helpful.


I will take your advice on palming, but i'd prolly F* up sooner or later. lately i hav ebeen trying to incorporate a routine that involves palming, backpalming, and while im backpalming, stashing the deck away for a deck vanish. (LOL)


Anywho- i think the i'd incorporate a gaff to close my routines. the mindset of letting them touch and whatnot-shuffle and crap like that at the beginning of a trick is a godsend if you ask me. and the cards itself is examinable as well (like in the pip matrix)

I think its easier to do a clean up if you 'restore' the card to its normal state (as in pip matrix/13 of diamonds split into a 10 and 3 of diamonds) then pointing that out, or suggesting methods such as shaking it if i did a shake change or shapeshifter, etc. i think you guys get my drift. =]


and no, dont get me wrong. LOL. 2 gaffs is the minimum, and when i say TWO gaffs i mean like, TWO gaff cards (or 3, max) not like half the deck. lmao


Btw, i laughed my ass off at the zipper card.

 

[TheKingOfCards]

Lol yeah. At one point in time, I think i rewatched that around 4 or 5 times. It was hilarious. That guy is pretty funny, and it's not like he has no skill. He's really good too haha, and innovative as well.

 

[TheKingOfCards]

Yeah sinful, there's a lot of good info floating around. Personally, I don't think my performance style requires spectators to need to handle the deck at all to convince them. For the regulars, I occasionally hand the deck out, and they remember that the cards are ungaffed. This is an easy solution to the problem, and is more effecient in terms of getting the spectators to delve into the effect and not into matters concerning the deck being used. As for strangers, I'm sure your moethod would work well =)

Palming is hard and is easy to mess up, but I wouldn't worry too much. The confidence to perform using them took me months to acquire. I noticed you had an idea about a deck vanish, so I urge you to check out James Brown's (UK guy) lecture 2008 DVD. On there, he teaches some awesome routines that have mutlitple deck vanishes. One, for example, is BoxClever and I use that one a LOT for a closer. It's definitely much stronger than a gaff card. You will gain ultimate and inevitable respect with that routine right there =)

Lastly, I think cleaning up should not be an issue with gaff cards. Gaffs should be introduced into routines very carefully at specific times. You don't want to have a routine that requires you to clean up immediately, thus hindering your performance. Usually, I would think a gaff at the early middle or closer effect would work, but my problem with the closer effect with a gaff is that it probably wont be as strong as the effects I performed previously and I need to end with a BANG. But yeah, keep in mind that your performance flows when utilizing gaffs.

Also, a quick tip. If you blur something, I guess you'd want to make it normal again. IN the case of a closer, NEVER change anything back to normal. Although I think any quick blur or 13 of diamonds closer is cool, the effects are terribly short and spectators will probably only remember that little effect compared to remembering the entire routine and all its highlights. Do let me know how gaff cards work for you though! I'm really interested in finding out what your reactions are and stuff.

 

[Sinful07]

i usually force a 10 of diamonds and a 3 of diamonds onto two different spectators.

I find them obviously, Long distance spinner/(That middle pop thing that Justin miller does which i cant remember the name of, or another colour change or what ahve you. the point here being is that i find both cards)


I then ask them if they do A level maths, or if they're good at maths. ask them to add 10+3, and do a shapeshifter or a shake change. immediately hand out the card.

this is the part where i bask in my glory while the crowd goes mental. I interrupt and say- wait, that's not really your card now is it, you had a 10 and a 3.. *Changes*

*hands out cards while the deck is stashed into pocket *


I have some experience with blurred cards as well, 9/10 times they remember that i made a blurred card, they dont remember that they picked a blank one, i made it blurry, then restored it to the original card.

They just remember that there's a blurry card- and i turned it to normal. Goddamnit!

 

[TheKingOfCards]

Gotcha =) Sorry, I was under the assumption that you only took a ten and a three and made them into a 13 lol. Sorry to be such an a-hole, but 99% of the time I have't seen this correctly routined into a good effect. I like yours though. Gives reason to whatever you do. The next thing I would be interested in learning is your sequence of effects that lead up to this gaff effect as a closer.

The only problem I see in your effec is the time between events within the effect. How long does it take you to individually force two cards, have them replaced, find them again in a nice and fun way, then ask if they can do simple math, take the cards back, execute change, and all with some laughs and hysteric spectators inbetween? Spectators all have ADHD (ADD for some) and will only remember the highlights of your routine, like you pointed out in your blur explanation.
My question is... are you doing justice to the time you spent setting up the effect, to the quite literal 3 seconds of magic moment they will remember you for? It's quite likely that spectators will not remember how you found their cards in the deck with a hotshot over what they will remember about the 13 of Diamonds.

 

[Sinful07]

it frankly doesnt matter how i find the cards, hell sometimes i even just force two cards and just "add" them on the spot.

With the legendary "now now, its not one of those tricks where i cant see the card.. Dont worry ive seen this trick before.. Watch" line (Quoted Justin Miller, Army of 52 Dvd Pip matrix =p)

so the basic Routine would probably involve asking the specs to shuffle the cards/inspect them, do a mind reading trick (classic force, whatever) Long division by Kevin ho (or any variation) then the gaff trick. (its all a theme? the adding and subtracting and whatnot)


its quite clever, ive tried doing it to two spectators (one is a little kid. the older spectator (which turned out to be a one HOT female spectator) was in utter amazement, and the child was just amused. (obviously the child doesnt know there isnt a '13 of diamonds' in the deck.

 

[TheKingOfCards]

it frankly doesnt matter how i find the cards, hell sometimes i even just force two cards and just "add" them on the spot.

With the legendary "now now, its not one of those tricks where i cant see the card.. Dont worry ive seen this trick before.. Watch" line (Quoted Justin Miller, Army of 52 Dvd Pip matrix =p)

To your first comment, that is precisely why the effect is not as powerful as it could be. You must routine the effect in a way that reflects on your ability to create a powerful moment for the spectators. If you honestly chose a method to perform the effect in a random way without sitting down beforehand to analyze what works best in which situations, then you're not doing justice to yourself or the effect.

I also would recommend not using the lines other people like Justin Miller use. His line is specifically catered to his specific performance, and obviously a lot of though was put into creating that DVD and the routines in it. They might work for you, but there is a higher chance that you could come up with something better yourself =) After all, you have taken this simple gaff card and made an entire effect out of it, so maybe the patter should be coming from you too? Just some suggestions, but I'll be glad to debate this more haha

 

[Sinful07]

I think you fail to notice that im not copying miller's routine word for word-sleight for sleight, but the point that im trying to come across is that some of the patter that he does (for the pip matrix for example) works for Routines that ive come up with.


The sleight that he teaches with that specific gaff card is just to take two cards, and slam it onto the table causing them to 'merge'.

i think that's weak. (personally) lol. However i thought about it, and there's a few other effects in the gaff deck that can be easily incorporated onto other effects.

Take DnD's Twinsplit remix for example, isnt that a GODSEND for the 3 and a half club gaff cards?

Or you can even perform kevin ho's 'Long Division' using the 13 of diamonds.

The patter that Justin involves with the routine is similar to all of my effects- Light hearted and non chalant. there is no 'magical Harry potter-esque' moment for my style of magic, More like Comedic-Haha-HOW-THE-F*-DID-THAT-HAPPEN sort of thing that im trying to incorporate.

Put it this way: if Justin backpalmed a card and said "The card just seemed to vanish to thin air *produces* and just like that, it appears"

I wouldve diverted that into: "*backpalms* Holy F*, where the hell did that card go...? oh wait *produces* there it is, Bastard card...."


Another example is with that blurred card effect (Captain Blur?) He says something like "oh my god, you have to use your imagination..." when they pick the blank card.

I just pretend i mess up at this point, saying that there shouldnt even be a goddamn blank card anyways etc and just move on with the effect.

Again, Im not copying him word for word- i just found some of his patter to fit some of my other routines.

Pardon- but isnt the 'ambitious' theme in an ACR a form of patter? (Where it continually rises to the top?) If so- then is everyone else copying whoever made that same patter-even though there are a lot of variations such as card to mouth, pocket, shoe etc?

Why cant it be the 'hustler's card' or something, or Tupac's card. dunno- there just seem to be a gigantic link between 'rising to the top' and Rappers. i figured it'd be relevant to mention it.

Childish pleasantries aside- im sure my point is clearly understood yes?

Oh and on a sidenote- Debating is different from discussing. We are merely exchanging opinions on a matter. =]

 

[TheKingOfCards]

Yeah I put debate in there because I felt like i was debating, when I should have been having a colorful discussion =) And by the way, the ambitious card is not really always going back to the top, and neither is the patter overused or copied. I have at least 6 different ACR routines, but I never really perform them. All have kicker endings and such, but the patters are alll completely different seeing as my cards don't always end up "on top." But then again, the effect was created with that specific patter, so in essence it would work best with that specific patter.

 

[Sinful07]

I think you need to brush up on your magic history. its called 'ambitious' for a reason. Hence ACR. why else would it be called 'ambitious' ?