How Advanced are You?

Apr 25, 2009
459
0
40
Yorktown, VA
I always seem to get caught up with this question. People tend to throw out statements like, this book/DVD is not for the beginner, but I don't even know where I fall into the scale of skills. I always like to think that I am an advanced beginner, but how do I truly know??? What are some key signs to look for???
 
Aug 10, 2008
2,023
2
35
In a rock concert
I always seem to get caught up with this question. People tend to throw out statements like, this book/DVD is not for the beginner, but I don't even know where I fall into the scale of skills. I always like to think that I am an advanced beginner, but how do I truly know??? What are some key signs to look for???

Mmm, I guess that it has be about how comfortable do you feel with a deck of cards, most people tend to throw that word alot and half of them arent even good, its a different experience for each one.

For example, It took me more time to get the Gravity half pass to a decent performance level rather than the Clipshift wich didnt took me that long. Yet a lot of people say that the clipshift is one of the hardes sleights out there.

Its not about "Hey this is only for super-out-of-this-world-I-have-davebuck-hands skill level dudes, stay away from it" its just, you have to see how really comfortable with the deck youare and if you like the material, well give it a shot.

If you are super experienced or are just breaking the barriers and getting to intermediate, its the same thing, you still are going to practice, and the move is going to feel new, no matter how experienced you are.

Of course being experienced gives you an edge and you can actually dominate the sleight easier, but again is all personal preference.

:)
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,410
6
Sydney, Australia
This is a very good question. And to be perfectly honest, I don't know the answer. I don't know if there is an answer.

The problem in my mind is this:

The HUGE majority of the time, members try to be a bit humble, and perhaps downplay their skill, or whatever. "I'm an advanced beginner." "I'm an intermediate."

The problem is this: From my experience, I would say that personally, no reflection on you KoS, having read their other posts in these forums, even when they try to be humble, they are still massively overstating their skill level!

Which is not to say that they can't perform a double lift, or a pass, or whatever.

But I feel that too many magicians haven't begun to comprehend what magic is, beyond a series of tricks performed dealer-demo style. And that makes them a beginner in my book.

So in other words, the problem is this: Magicians tend to rate skills on sleight of hand skill only. In doing so, they vastly overstate skill level, because the majority of magicians ignore the performance theory aspect of magic, and couldn't present to save their lives and don't understand magic at all either.

The problem is compounded when we have a large amount of rubbish flowing out of the production lines. When you ask when something like that is suitable - well, the only thing it teaches is a few weird moves, but nothing more important than that - so we can only rate the product based on the difficulty of its sleights - which is again, bad for the development of a magician.

Brad Henderson once told me, upon asking him for advice, about a particular book: (Brad, if you read this, I hope you don't mind reproducing this sentence; if you do, let me know and I'll remove it immediately) "The perfect beginner's book with lessons no beginner would understand."

And I bought the book, and I saw what he meant.

I look through a book like Psychological Subtleties 2, to use a more recent Mentalist's resource. And it's too easy to say, oh, PS2 just has a whole bunch of tricks. It's so much more than that. Within those tricks are lessons that, if you didn't read carefully enough, you simply wouldn't learn. And it takes some certain knowledge of magic to actually recognise the lessons when you see them. But they're all there. PS2 is an example of a book that shouldn't be rated on sleights or effects "for beginners" or "for intermediates" simply because the lessons are there for everyone.

So if I had to give a general answer, I think skill should be based on understand of magic and ability to perform it. This includes sleight of hand chops of course, but at the same time is much, much more.
 
To me if you think a book is or will be good, go ahead and pick it up as long as the reviews agree with you. Magic is a lifelong goal to create the ultimate flow of motion from phase to phase/ then from trick to trick. I don't own forces unseen but you hear about how advanced it is all the time. I won't suggest it to someone just starting out, but once you relies that you will most likely spend many months and years with magic then you should pick up any book you think will be useful. Even if you get the most advanced book available in the magic world and you do spend months and years to get each sleight down as long as you like it, and it fits your style it's a huge win for you and a big obstacle you just overcame. I hear forces unseen is really good about giving you advice you will use in ever performance, so even if you can't get the sleights down you still got a book full of good advice.
 
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