theory11 — Magic Tricks & the World's Finest Playing Cards
I want to do my own street magic show on youtube.
- Thread starter Mike Lucas
- Start date
QUESTION ONE: Why?
QUESTION TWO: What Are You Calling "A Show"?
I've noticed that many in today's world refer to the act of presenting a single trick (at times) as a "show" when nothing could be further from the truth. Doing a Youtube type spot again, is not "a show" in the majority of cases, in that people rarely deliver more than about 5 minutes of material which equates to a "bit" or "routine" . . . far from being "a show".
"A Show" requires a set platform from which to present the program as well as a script, a sequence of events that will take place that typically run a minimum of 30 minutes to as much as 120 minutes depending on the planned subject matter and content; what is realistically viable. Too, "a show" usually means having a team of people to make the production happen. Contrary to popular assumption, one person or even two cannot create a complete and viable program, they take team work; especially when you are looking at a video styled encounter.
In my first question I asked you "Why?" you wanted to do this, what is the advantage you hope to gain by doing it?
If you want to say that it's for PR then it really should be part of your personal/professional web page; that is where the talent buyers are going to be looking, not Youtube and its various cousin sites. But there is far more to that question, such as Why do you wish to do this when most of what you have to offer is the same thing everyone else has on video?
I'm not stating that as fact in regards to you personally, but on the whole very few people within our craft are able to deliver something fresh that captures the mind of those watching and lures them in.
I'm not trying to knock your enthusiasm, rather, I want you to pause and consider what the advantages are for expending so much energy on a project and too, what you are defining to be "a show".
Personally, I'd suggest you video actual live performances under traditional show settings i.e. on stage or in a living room AND while strolling in a bar or mixer setting and if so inclined, on the streets. I would have a set theme to the program and make certain that EVERYTHING I did fit with that theme vs. jumping from one thing to the next. Balance is another thing that's going to be important; don't just do 20 minutes of card tricks, no matter how good you are you will loose a huge portion of your viewership within 6-10 minutes if you focus only on the one thing. Don't mix disciplines such as Magic & Mentalism. . . I'm not saying you can't do a bit of Mental Magic so as add variety to you program, only that you will loose your audience if you move back and forth between the two genres. I would plan some kind of special "punch" bit as your finale; an escape, the reveal of a headline, something seemingly impossible that you can build on so as to hold people's attention until the last 30 seconds of your program.
I know what I've said seems to take things off to the side of your question but it's all related; you can do that 30+ minute presentation when you have all these things in place, planned out and properly edited together into a cohesive end product that is able to stand on its own, attracting viewers. I'm simply encouraging you to NOT BE another guy with a portable camera dong random shots on the street of poorly framed routines, just to get reaction. . . Oh! On that issue, DON'T fill in time with tons of nonsensical footage that jumps around in an artsy-fartsy manner; you're a Magician, not George Lucas or some other film master. If you want to demonstrate film effects and editing savvy, then create a track just for that and pander to film making forums. Magic fans want to see magic, not film maker masturbation.
I say this for a very simple reason; old farts like my self will turn off a video the instant they see this sort of crap. We will not wade through such things when it comes to a sales pitch or performance piece because it has NOTHING to do with the thing we are there to see -- MAGIC! Many of the companies that cater to the "street performer" idea loose sales because their demo video has too much of the filler and not enough time showing the effect in a clear and concise way. This has resulted in some very negative response and loss of support for certain groups, the moral of the story being, keep such antics to a minimum. I understand and even admire minor use of such when it comes to the video medium, but minimalism is paramount.
I hope I've peeked your willingness to take things a bit further as you plot out this venture.
QUESTION TWO: What Are You Calling "A Show"?
I've noticed that many in today's world refer to the act of presenting a single trick (at times) as a "show" when nothing could be further from the truth. Doing a Youtube type spot again, is not "a show" in the majority of cases, in that people rarely deliver more than about 5 minutes of material which equates to a "bit" or "routine" . . . far from being "a show".
"A Show" requires a set platform from which to present the program as well as a script, a sequence of events that will take place that typically run a minimum of 30 minutes to as much as 120 minutes depending on the planned subject matter and content; what is realistically viable. Too, "a show" usually means having a team of people to make the production happen. Contrary to popular assumption, one person or even two cannot create a complete and viable program, they take team work; especially when you are looking at a video styled encounter.
In my first question I asked you "Why?" you wanted to do this, what is the advantage you hope to gain by doing it?
If you want to say that it's for PR then it really should be part of your personal/professional web page; that is where the talent buyers are going to be looking, not Youtube and its various cousin sites. But there is far more to that question, such as Why do you wish to do this when most of what you have to offer is the same thing everyone else has on video?
I'm not stating that as fact in regards to you personally, but on the whole very few people within our craft are able to deliver something fresh that captures the mind of those watching and lures them in.
I'm not trying to knock your enthusiasm, rather, I want you to pause and consider what the advantages are for expending so much energy on a project and too, what you are defining to be "a show".
Personally, I'd suggest you video actual live performances under traditional show settings i.e. on stage or in a living room AND while strolling in a bar or mixer setting and if so inclined, on the streets. I would have a set theme to the program and make certain that EVERYTHING I did fit with that theme vs. jumping from one thing to the next. Balance is another thing that's going to be important; don't just do 20 minutes of card tricks, no matter how good you are you will loose a huge portion of your viewership within 6-10 minutes if you focus only on the one thing. Don't mix disciplines such as Magic & Mentalism. . . I'm not saying you can't do a bit of Mental Magic so as add variety to you program, only that you will loose your audience if you move back and forth between the two genres. I would plan some kind of special "punch" bit as your finale; an escape, the reveal of a headline, something seemingly impossible that you can build on so as to hold people's attention until the last 30 seconds of your program.
I know what I've said seems to take things off to the side of your question but it's all related; you can do that 30+ minute presentation when you have all these things in place, planned out and properly edited together into a cohesive end product that is able to stand on its own, attracting viewers. I'm simply encouraging you to NOT BE another guy with a portable camera dong random shots on the street of poorly framed routines, just to get reaction. . . Oh! On that issue, DON'T fill in time with tons of nonsensical footage that jumps around in an artsy-fartsy manner; you're a Magician, not George Lucas or some other film master. If you want to demonstrate film effects and editing savvy, then create a track just for that and pander to film making forums. Magic fans want to see magic, not film maker masturbation.
I say this for a very simple reason; old farts like my self will turn off a video the instant they see this sort of crap. We will not wade through such things when it comes to a sales pitch or performance piece because it has NOTHING to do with the thing we are there to see -- MAGIC! Many of the companies that cater to the "street performer" idea loose sales because their demo video has too much of the filler and not enough time showing the effect in a clear and concise way. This has resulted in some very negative response and loss of support for certain groups, the moral of the story being, keep such antics to a minimum. I understand and even admire minor use of such when it comes to the video medium, but minimalism is paramount.
I hope I've peeked your willingness to take things a bit further as you plot out this venture.
actually…
I want to make video like David Blaine.and I do it because my friends and my family request.thats all.
I want to make video like David Blaine.and I do it because my friends and my family request.thats all.
If you want to see some good examples of good performances on youtube check out Justin Wilman and Justin Flom's channels.
These spots or episodes are only around 5 minutes long. They have a beginning, middle and end. Almost all the effects are performed for live audiences in one way or another.
These spots or episodes are only around 5 minutes long. They have a beginning, middle and end. Almost all the effects are performed for live audiences in one way or another.
Dear Craig.
It might sound like all I am doing is playing devils advocate, but I assure you I am not.
Again, you are reading WAY TOO MUCH into simple bbs posts and their titles. You go far into great detail about what a traditional magic show is, how long they run for, the material and themes that are required, etc... and even make more statements as how "so many young magicians these days" bla bla bla...
However, take a step back. Perhaps... the OP just misused the word "show". What if the original post had been, "I want to do my own street magic series on youtube," or "I want to do my own street magic performance on youtube"... Your entire post, minus the "why?" part, would be completely pointless.
Lately, your posts have been one of two general themes, 1: agreement and praise of those who have the exact same beliefs and theories as yourself, or 2: the automatic put down of those who seem "inferior" to your experience and understanding of the world/ magic world.
You rarely, if not ever, just stop, ask questions, or try to figure our more information so you can give an un-biased, un-pompous sounding response. I guarantee you that graceful responses that seem to lead the student on the right path in an overall positive and supportive manner, will be FAR MORE effective than your usual "put down", "dont do this dont do that" style posts.
You could have easily figured all of this out for yourself as well by slowly reading the title and jumping to more logical conclusions than just "another kid looking for fame who will most likely end up being like every other young kid out there failing to put in the time required to truly be great". STREET MAGIC + SHOW, usually does not mean Parlour Show, or Stage Show... but refers more to "street performance" or "tv like show on Street Magic (like David Blaine etc..).
Itt is becoming harder by the day to hold respect for you. It is nearly impossible for you to see any other possibilities than what YOU are already accustomed to and approve of.
Perhaps the OP wants to experiment with filming, experiment with youtube uploading, or like he said, put videos up at his family and friends's request (like he said in a follow up post). Perhaps he wants a place for family and friends to view the videos who do not have the luxury or privilege to see him perform live.
Sure, your advice to take things a step further, and put good production value into the venture, is valid... but totally unnecessary at this point of the discussion. You need to stop jumping to conclusions that everyone is trying to obtain information to reach the same level of professionalism you yourself hold. There can be hobbyists out there who enjoy what they do, and are looking for information that will help guide them on their path, and could go without you putting them down, like many of your posts do. As a grown up with long experience in the field, I would have expected you to understand this.
Just look at Goaters' response. He actually gives valuable information, links to check to see similar youtube videos that may serve as a good reference.
In the end, you mention "wasted energy" in regards to what it will require to go out on the street and try to put together a video for youtube... HOWEVER, perhaps this is the fun thing the OP is looking forward to doing? Going out with a friend or family member for the first time to film his street performance... and all it sounds like is you putting him down his ideas and ambition.
It might sound like all I am doing is playing devils advocate, but I assure you I am not.
Again, you are reading WAY TOO MUCH into simple bbs posts and their titles. You go far into great detail about what a traditional magic show is, how long they run for, the material and themes that are required, etc... and even make more statements as how "so many young magicians these days" bla bla bla...
However, take a step back. Perhaps... the OP just misused the word "show". What if the original post had been, "I want to do my own street magic series on youtube," or "I want to do my own street magic performance on youtube"... Your entire post, minus the "why?" part, would be completely pointless.
Lately, your posts have been one of two general themes, 1: agreement and praise of those who have the exact same beliefs and theories as yourself, or 2: the automatic put down of those who seem "inferior" to your experience and understanding of the world/ magic world.
You rarely, if not ever, just stop, ask questions, or try to figure our more information so you can give an un-biased, un-pompous sounding response. I guarantee you that graceful responses that seem to lead the student on the right path in an overall positive and supportive manner, will be FAR MORE effective than your usual "put down", "dont do this dont do that" style posts.
You could have easily figured all of this out for yourself as well by slowly reading the title and jumping to more logical conclusions than just "another kid looking for fame who will most likely end up being like every other young kid out there failing to put in the time required to truly be great". STREET MAGIC + SHOW, usually does not mean Parlour Show, or Stage Show... but refers more to "street performance" or "tv like show on Street Magic (like David Blaine etc..).
Itt is becoming harder by the day to hold respect for you. It is nearly impossible for you to see any other possibilities than what YOU are already accustomed to and approve of.
Perhaps the OP wants to experiment with filming, experiment with youtube uploading, or like he said, put videos up at his family and friends's request (like he said in a follow up post). Perhaps he wants a place for family and friends to view the videos who do not have the luxury or privilege to see him perform live.
Sure, your advice to take things a step further, and put good production value into the venture, is valid... but totally unnecessary at this point of the discussion. You need to stop jumping to conclusions that everyone is trying to obtain information to reach the same level of professionalism you yourself hold. There can be hobbyists out there who enjoy what they do, and are looking for information that will help guide them on their path, and could go without you putting them down, like many of your posts do. As a grown up with long experience in the field, I would have expected you to understand this.
Just look at Goaters' response. He actually gives valuable information, links to check to see similar youtube videos that may serve as a good reference.
In the end, you mention "wasted energy" in regards to what it will require to go out on the street and try to put together a video for youtube... HOWEVER, perhaps this is the fun thing the OP is looking forward to doing? Going out with a friend or family member for the first time to film his street performance... and all it sounds like is you putting him down his ideas and ambition.
You know, I've had many individuals share their two-cents, just as you have, when it comes to my mini-lectures but more than not, I have had three and four times as many people thank me for making such detailed posts because it helps them on their projects. . . I write to the forum, not just the OP.
Yes, I corrected the OP when it comes to the use of terms but the proven reality is, if you misuse terms and perspectives it will reveal itself in other areas of your work and life. Roughly a decade ago we (the magic community) started employing the terms "Participant" vs. "Spectator" or "Volunteer" because of how it effects us as performers on the psychological level; we've done this with other terms and perspectives as well.
When it comes to those that wish to lecture me about my long posts, I have found that most are persons with limited background who want to cut to the chase and find the quickest, easiest way to get to their goals vs. learning things "properly" and not skipping over the little stuff. Kind of like the Republican party here in the States and how they don't allow themselves to get side tracked when it comes to addressing facts vs. assumption and misinformation.
Fact is, I'll probably never stop posting in the manner I do, it's simply what I do and I do it with the intent of helping everyone, not just the OP. My job is to help the younger and less experienced to THINK, that's how I was taught and that's how I teach, sorry if it doesn't work based on your whims.
Yes, I corrected the OP when it comes to the use of terms but the proven reality is, if you misuse terms and perspectives it will reveal itself in other areas of your work and life. Roughly a decade ago we (the magic community) started employing the terms "Participant" vs. "Spectator" or "Volunteer" because of how it effects us as performers on the psychological level; we've done this with other terms and perspectives as well.
When it comes to those that wish to lecture me about my long posts, I have found that most are persons with limited background who want to cut to the chase and find the quickest, easiest way to get to their goals vs. learning things "properly" and not skipping over the little stuff. Kind of like the Republican party here in the States and how they don't allow themselves to get side tracked when it comes to addressing facts vs. assumption and misinformation.
Fact is, I'll probably never stop posting in the manner I do, it's simply what I do and I do it with the intent of helping everyone, not just the OP. My job is to help the younger and less experienced to THINK, that's how I was taught and that's how I teach, sorry if it doesn't work based on your whims.
Understood and more so, I understand why this is "practical" for you and your goal. You've answered my primary question. It's now up to you to contemplate what I shared previously, so you can design this footage in order to optimize how those people will see you. I say this because others outside your family & friends circle can view this footage and you'll want to impress them as much if not more than you will your target audience.
Please understand Mike, I only want you to create the best end result that's possible. Sorry if I sound like a grumpy old bear, but like most bears, it's just my growl that's confounding. Once you get past that you'll find that I'm more of the "Teddy Bear" variety. ;-)
When I first read this I thought you meant a professional show but after a few replies I think I misunderstood. If you want to have a YouTube "show" for your family and friends then get a cheap camera, record your magic, upload it to YouTube and edit it with YouTubes video editor. Job done.
Look at the people on talent shows like xfactor Craig. A lot of the terrible people on there have been encouraged by people to audition when the reality is that they have zero talent. Just reminding you that you shouldn't always listen to people giving you praise. I personally I don't read your "mini-lectures" but I'm sure there is solid advice in there.
Look at the people on talent shows like xfactor Craig. A lot of the terrible people on there have been encouraged by people to audition when the reality is that they have zero talent. Just reminding you that you shouldn't always listen to people giving you praise. I personally I don't read your "mini-lectures" but I'm sure there is solid advice in there.
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I'm quite aware of this and have written extensively on what I call "Club House Kudos" -- you will see it on forums as well as in the various clubs, chums patting one another on the back for a job well done when in fact they stink and everyone knows it.
I know that you prefer short cuts, formula and you generally detest any semblance of authority, which is sad given how much you loose out on as the end result.
I can't believe anyone would think either political party would not be considered guilty of creating intentional side treks.
That's hilarious.
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Don't assume that because I'm direct with my posts I prefer short cuts. I was only suggesting that you should reconsider your posts sometimes as sometimes questions don't require a full write up.
Get a decent handheld camera, get some nice clothes, find a friend who is willing to hold the camera for you. Learn a decent editing program, and just scope out a few places you think might have a reasonable enough foot traffic.
The perfect response.
Craig, its not your job to do anything, you take it upon yourself to make these posts. This guy is not looking for a lesson in how to think in regards to magic, and neither are the rest of us.
I'm not going to argue with Formula (who more than anyone, loves to pounce on me) and now you Wyatt. . . whoever you are. Some people do appreciate my in-put and they far outweigh the two or three (thus far) that give me grief about what I offer.
The philosophy projected by you two is exactly why the public tends to laugh at magic & magicians and why so much on Television makes parody of our craft; no one has taught you the value behind details and not placing the cart before the horse.
The philosophy projected by you two is exactly why the public tends to laugh at magic & magicians and why so much on Television makes parody of our craft; no one has taught you the value behind details and not placing the cart before the horse.
Bit dramatic. I think you could answer people's questions rather than writing about peoples questions, it's a minor criticism that I've probably mentioned less than a handful of times.
People don't laugh at magic and magicians, they laugh at bad magicians.
I wasn't very clear in what I meant, and I apologise. I didn't mean that absolutely nobody has any interest in what you say, but nobody who clicks on a thread about starting a youtube street magic show is coming here expecting an essay on the philosophy of magic, what I meant is that this thread is not the place.
I know I for one give Craig a hard time on the long write-ups, but not on the length, just on the manner. In fact, sometimes the manner in which he writes them seems spot on, I just felt otherwise this time.
And you are right, it is not his job to do so... However, it is none of our jobs to do so, minus the forum administrators and t11 staff. One should be grateful that people of experience spend time on these forums to give out their wisdom (for free).
It is up to the reader to take said wisdom/ advice, not at face value, but to take it and analyze it to the best of their ability. Sometimes this leads to conflicts, true.
And your comment, "the rest of us aren't looking for lessons on how to think about magic"... well speak for yourself. Some people are. If you have already shut off your mind to absorbing new ways of thinking when it comes to magic, etc... you are at a loss.
Anyway, back to the OP.
I believe in the "learn from your mistakes and successes" sort of learning. There are many other methods that also prove valuable, but for your question. Get a camera, go out, shoot some footage, take it home and edit it, and then get feedback, is a great way to learn. Just be able take the feedback as not all of it will be positive. Remember to have a clear idea of what you are trying to accomplish, and plan accordingly. This goes for all sorts of projects, not just street magic videos. You can even create a storyboard if you want, briefly and roughly outlining what kind of shots you want. Perhaps even types of cut shots, if you want to plan that much detail. But, definitely have a general video duration in mind, how many locations you want, etc... and maybe a theme. Everything else comes with practice.
Forgot to mention that you should at least have some idea of the general direction you want the video's to go. Otherwise it will be very random seem like some kid on youtube vlogging. Which get's annoying enough already.
So write down a few effects you perform, then look at them and maybe see how they connect. I would also suggest not doing all the filming in one go. Film yourself performing one effect for Group A, then the next day a different effect for B, rinse repeat.
Then just go through and watch the videos and edit out the stuff that doesn't fit. (People walking by and ruining a shot, the wind picking up, Th battery dying.) things of that nature.
So write down a few effects you perform, then look at them and maybe see how they connect. I would also suggest not doing all the filming in one go. Film yourself performing one effect for Group A, then the next day a different effect for B, rinse repeat.
Then just go through and watch the videos and edit out the stuff that doesn't fit. (People walking by and ruining a shot, the wind picking up, Th battery dying.) things of that nature.