Peter Popoff?

[urban entropy]

You still forget to mention how energy was around forever. Surely you don't believe that something could be around for that long could you?


-Michael

Once again, another believer in the illogical and completely unfounded Creationism thought process completely avoids a logical argument by putting up a strawman argument in a 'mysterious one-point sentence' that ultimately, means nothing.

Good job Michael. Like the rest of your kin, you continue to put your shoe farther and farther into your mouth.

You know what is mature? Trying to start a fight in an online forum. That's not what this place is about.

Clearly you are outdone here Michael, and you continue to dig yourself deeper by not defending your position in an intelligent and forthcoming nature. Instead, you resort to condecending circular talk that goes nowhere and only serves to frustrate your antagonizers.

Truly, your arguments are full of air, and so is your ego.

I have yet to meet a follower of Creationism who isn't hot under the collar; like your god, I guess the rules, morals and ethics you spew forth don't directly apply to you.

Glad to see your not going to post on this thread anymore. Tale tucked where it should be.

urban

 

[GusEds]

Peter Popoff (born July 2, 1946) is a German-born U.S. televangelist and claims to be a faith healer. He performs crusade services on national television which include laying on of hands. His ministry is based in Upland, California, and is funded through donations. A widely popular minister in the 1980s, he went bankrupt in 1987 after James Randi and Steve Shaw debunked his methods by showing that instead of receiving information about audience members from supernatural sources, he received it through his wife, via an in-ear receiver.

Lets get this thread back online

Anyone ever heard of the Placebo effect? I think it applies.

Gustav

 

[TheBlack&WhiteIllusionist]

Lets get this thread back online

Anyone ever heard of the Placebo effect? I think it applies.

Gustav

I was thinking the same thing earlier. He's a sugar pill. Tell them you're a healer from heaven and their mind will do the rest.

 

[lunatic core]

Lets get this thread back online

Anyone ever heard of the Placebo effect? I think it applies.

Gustav

The only really interesting thing about Popoff is how he has manage to resurface. Flim Flam is invading our culture, attacking our schools, corrupting our government. We have powerful people trying to change our laws that believe in faith healing and talking in tongues(sp). People that believe that they are at war with science.

 

[GusEds]

I was thinking the same thing earlier. He's a sugar pill. Tell them you're a healer from heaven and their mind will do the rest.

Yea, there's no harm in that. The governemnt funds Placebo. Whats different about this?

You're paying for placebo, as well asyou would be paying to see Peter Popoff.

Gustav

EDIT: after readin' Luantic's post (which popped up right before mine) :

Hum, yes, that is a problem. But as long as there is religion, man will be at war (internal or external). The way I see it, you will ALWAYS have conflict if your moral and ethical values are even slightly different to your neighbours.

The solution?

Eradicate religion. Easier said than done though.

 

[lunatic core]

Yea, there's no harm in that. The governemnt funds Placebo. Whats different about this?

You're paying for placebo, as well asyou would be paying to see Peter Popoff.

Gustav

There is harm. Placebos can be used to attempt to treat people that "think" that have a problem. However faith healing has caused people to avoid getting proper treatment fast enough. There is a fatal difference. www.Whatstheharm.net

 

[GusEds]

There is harm. Placebos can be used to attempt to treat people that "think" that have a problem. However faith healing has caused people to avoid getting proper treatment fast enough. There is a fatal difference. www.Whatstheharm.net

I am not so in tune with this, so I was not aware of that. But I did believe I read that Placebo affects those who actually do have something wrong.

When it comes down to it though, unlike Placebo - It's the person's choice to follow so called 'faith healing' isn't it?

Gustav

 

[lunatic core]

I am not so in tune with this, so I was not aware of that. But I did believe I read that Placebo affects those who actually do have something wrong.

When it comes down to it though, unlike Placebo - It's the person's choice to follow so called 'faith healing' isn't it?

Gustav

Generally attempts at creating a placebo effect by a scientist is done with harmless substances in controlled situations. This is after you have gone to a proper place of health care. You probably won't die from a common treatable disease or the pill. The frauds can hurt you directly with the "cure", keep people from getting real treatment, and hurt you finacially.

 

[Deleted member 2755]

I just performed major heart surgery on this thread by deleting a ton of posts from the last 3 pages. Let's keep things non-argumentative.

-Doug

 

[FOO:L]

meh. sinful, how was my post not relevant?

 

[TheBlack&WhiteIllusionist]

I just performed major heart surgery on this thread by deleting a ton of posts from the last 3 pages. Let's keep things non-argumentative.

-Doug

I feel hurt Doug . Eh, most of my stuff was bull anyway.

Well, i'll put this up since I think it might help a little.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/782650/faith_healer_peter_popoff_fraud_exposed_in_tv/

 

[Steerpike]

While I happen to think Pike is a S.O.B. (I wouldn't put it past him to confirm it)

With great pride.

Generally attempts at creating a placebo effect by a scientist is done with harmless substances in controlled situations. This is after you have gone to a proper place of health care. You probably won't die from a common treatable disease or the pill. The frauds can hurt you directly with the "cure", keep people from getting real treatment, and hurt you finacially.

And therein lies the danger. Year after year, numerous Christian Scientists resort to prayer instead of medicine and die of completely preventable ailments. I think we can safely assume that divine intervention is not a reliable medical procedure.

But it's tempting to the emotionally vulnerable all the same.

Where it gets really sinister is when you have people like Sylvia Browne. She apparently consults people who have a phone reading with her to take a certain herbal medication whenever they describe some sort of physical ailment. It's the same one every time. I don't recall the name off the top of my head, though it is mentioned at Stop Sylvia Browne dot com in one of the articles.

What's the problem? The drug she recommends is OTC, yes. But some people are allergic to it. And if I remember correctly, it's only a variant on aspirin. It can't do a lot of the things she tells people it can.

If the idea of a psychic telling you over the phone to take a pill to solve all your physical woes even though said drug cannot provide that sort of relief and there's a chance you might be allergic to it doesn't scare you, you're made of stone.

 

[lunatic core]

I feel hurt Doug . Eh, most of my stuff was bull anyway.

Well, i'll put this up since I think it might help a little.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/782650/faith_healer_peter_popoff_fraud_exposed_in_tv/

The submitter of that video is a goldmine of lulz.

 

[TheBlack&WhiteIllusionist]

The submitter of that video is a goldmine of lulz.

I'm gonna have to check out the rest then.

 

[DrGonzo]

Reading through this has been very interesting. So i thought I would throw my two cents in.

I agree that Peter Popoff is one of the nastiest cons in the world. Using scam to give people hope for trading in a few dollars is in my mind wrong...but it is nothing new. The organized Christian religions have been doing it for about 2009 years. Now that is not a slam against any religion, but it would be really hard to deny. Religion in and of itself is a beautiful thing. If it can inspire people and give them hope, then that is a great thing. However, people will believe so blindly in faith, that they throw reality to the wind. And that is where Peter Popoff is making his fortune. And if you are a Christian believer, then you know someday his judgments will come and he will have to answer.

But enough about religion, now onto science. Human consciousness is a bizarre and powerful thing. Look at the mind over matter phenomena. If you can change your thought process into a positive spin, good things will happen. The same goes for negative, if you always think in a negative attitude, negative things happen. You can take that as a religious aspect...but scientists are experimenting with human consciousness and the outcomes of thoughts. It is quite amazing. However they are a few millennia behind Eastern religions. .

Case and point. If this Popoff guy would sell his miracle stuff, and an instruction book on positive thinking, then it would cease to be a scam, and it could truly help people. However, selling miracle water or miracle bread...don't agree with it at all.

Thanks for hearing my peace. And remember, think positive.

 

[nexusmagic]

Placebos what is a placebo? I do not know what fake medicine you all speak of. In order for me to get smarter I buy these 1 ounce vials of natural spring water for about 30 dollars a pop. They seem to be making me smarter 2+2=3 was my answer before taking these shots, now it is 2+2=....... I know the answer is 4 but I need to buy the $40 bottle for numbers.

 

[TheBlack&WhiteIllusionist]

With great pride.

As well you should.



I understand why people need to grasp something like religion. They need to believe, especially in times of utter crisis, that there's something more than what's infront of their eyes. I can't say if there is or if there isn't, I honestly don't think that anyone can, cause in the purest sense of knowledge, we don't know. And I refuse to let someone with as much proof as anyone of us tell me otherwise. And I don't want anyone to get the wrong impression either, I am a very open minded individual. I love to listen to what other people have to say, I feel that it, at times, can help me to become a little more knowledgeable even about something I feel I already have a pretty good grasp of. And if i'm proven to be wrong, I except that. But if Faith (being religions biggest princaple) is by definition blind, How can you believe in religion? It's like if I closed my eyes and hit the gas 20 feet before a stop sign and said "I have faith that no one's on the other road.". I wouldn't know that for a fact, and I assure you, people would indeed call me "Crazy" at the funeral.

In talks of religion I can never ever, nope not once leave out Carlin. I know i've mentioned it before, but I can't help it, God save me .

"When it comes to bull****, big-time, major league bull****, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bull**** story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time!

But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bull**** story. Holy ****!"

 

[Randy]

The thing tho with placebo's is that doctors will usually give them to people who are worry warts. Somebody who thinks they have a serious illness when in fact they might just have the sniffles.

 

[Deleted member 2755]

meh. sinful, how was my post not relevant?

My apologies. Your post should not had been deleted. I just saw you quoted Nasello and kind of hit that delete button. Feel free to remake the post. I'll just put it here meanwhile. (I would bring it back, but no one would see it since its on the last page.)

speaking in terms of blind faith and whatnot, im interested to hear how steerpike relates this to his presentations in shows. Having presented yourself as a "shadowlander", do you lead the audience to actually believe you can do what you present, or do you have some sort of disclaimer before/after the show?

This is all of course, no attack on your style, im merely curious.

-Doug

 

[Steerpike]

To answer FOO:L's question, my press materials do call what I do a theatrical production, but it's for that same reason that I never break character while on the job.