Hey I am 16 and I am putting out Lecture notes and a DVD...Cool huh?

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Sep 2, 2007
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Guys,

Let's share our ideas and opinions with each other.

That being said, there is no need attack other members. If you disagree with their point, a respectful and courteous rebuttal is welcome.

I'm leaving this thread open for now, but shall we refrain from divisively arguing, et al., because it's unneccesary and offensive.

Thanks,
JTM
 
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Sep 1, 2007
38
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Hong Kong
This is such a humorous read.

So to say, Justin directed everyone's attention to people publishing poor materials, and blamed it to age.

IT has been repeated a few times in the thread now, to sum it up, yes partly true.............but, who TAUGHT these "kids" to publish crap anyway?


Like we dismissed of WHO was there to INFLUENCE at the first place?
 
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Aug 31, 2007
115
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Newton, MA
"ok.............So, who TAUGHT these "kids" to publish crap anyway?"

I think one of the problems is that they are NOT BEING TAUGHT! There are many kids who do not take the time to learn...I understand that is not a complete age thing, honestly it is mostly kids who are putting out these "groundbreaking effects" to make a quick buck. I have to agree with Justin.

My .02
Adam
 
Sep 1, 2007
38
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Hong Kong
I'm not disagreeing with Justin. This issue of "flooding the market with crap" Needs to be addressed.

quoting his line:
"THEY HAVE NO IDEA OF HOW TO BE A REAL MAGICIAN! "

Great.......so why do they not have an idea of being a magician?

You're right too baskitboy, they aren't "taught", because if so we disgrace the word "taught". it's improper influence....

You see, they can't NOT have a "teacher"......at least there has to be a SOURCE of INFLUENCE.

because like why would they KNOW there is this method of:
"making a quick buck with selling magic"
and like REALISE they can put out stuff and hype it with "ground-breaking" too.....

.....They can come up with new ideas in magic just from their heads,
but the idea of "selling their ideas for profit and get fame/publicity/status"?
Who were the first people to be doing these things at the first place?

I can Easily quote two lines from the E site to illustrate the concept:

"CREATE. GET FAMOUS."
"After releasing Revolution, Kevin Parker simply retired from his job"

Well this point has been addressed on page 10 already, so I shouldn't repeat the points now.

Just to recap the idea here:
It's not the under-aged, it's those who was there to INFLUENCE at the first place.
 
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Sep 4, 2007
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Originally Posted by YoungScot

But Miller, you cannot attack a problem, but then become part of the core reasons for that problem. By joining "E" and endorsing, advertising and selling products you have proved that you are worse than the magicians you dislike for feeding them the very capatalist fuel to become annoying, fame seaking individuals.

Joe.

It may seem strange that I am coming to Justin's defense, but that was an ignorant statement. I am sorry, Jack the Magician, but there is not a more polite way to frame the obvious.

Justin collaborated with E, as a talent, to produce his own material, and to help produce product of other magicians. He and I may not always see eye-to-eye, but he is one hell of a performer. He took some of the stuff he was given and brought it to another level. Yes, he was paid to do so. Bet he put a lot of food on the table for his family as well as making sure they have a roof over their heads. It is what he does, he is a professional magician.

Why would you condemn him for endorsing, advertising and selling products? Is any magician who does that a sell-out? Is Chris Kenner, Bayme, Asher and the rest of the crew here sell-outs because they endorse, advertise and sell their products? See, here is a little secret that may have escaped you...Theory11 and Ellusionist are both magic sales sites. We sell magic, to people like you. We promote our products and we ask professional magicians to help us do this. We profited from Justin doing this, and he profited back.

Did you remember to condemn him for getting on here and endorsing the first edition Guardians? Remember, he bought 12 bricks for use in his shows...although it seems he is giving most of them away as a sales special for one of his products. Bad boy....smart boy.

Sorry, I just do not understand the direction you are coming from. It seems you just thought you found a new chink in the armor and wanted to work your finger into the crack.

RJ
 
Sep 1, 2007
488
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Philadelphia, PA
Just reposting my thoughts from the Cafe here because I realize not everyone is a member at the Cafe or can't post there.

I knew without a doubt that after I read the age category that the entire point of Justin's post would be lost. The majority of the point is based on releases by some of the younger generation, no question about that. However, this is not something that is an age specific problem.

I am not a worker or a pro, just a hobbyist with a genuine passion for magic. It is something I love more than any other hobby or pastime I can recall. I love to see other magicians enthusiastic about their own magic and practicing others creations. I think that if a creator could step back and look at things from an objective viewpoint and ask the question: "Would I buy this?" or "Would I ever use this material?" then you might see some of creators policing themselves. When you are able to step back and ask those questions and give yourself honest answers I think you will do a ton more for your own growth as a creator/magician as well as your own reputation within the magic community.

I wish the state of things in magic was better, truly I do. To be completely honest I don't see them getting any better which means the consumers will have to be better educated, more informed, and scrutinizing every effect that comes onto the market. I am all for giving the new and upcoming young guys a chance to break out and be the next best thing but they better have done their homework and asked the questions I feel need to be asked before I give them that chance.

--Jim

p.s. Calvin keep your head up bro, please keep your head up and stay on course through all this crap.
 

Lied about what??
I said i would stop selling the DVDs... but i AM human, i dont have some ability to empty a wherehouse of DVDS that already been made.
i can however, ask that they stop producing any more.
and if it has to do with the claims in the ad, the stupid site i produced it with (STAY AWAY FROM THEM) over exaggerated almost everything i told them to put in the description.
all im claiming, is that its my take on a 4 coins only shadow coins effect.
did i miss something?
how did i lie? Im trying to stay truthful.
thanks.

Calvin Lauber
 
Sep 1, 2007
410
0
well now that my rep. here has pretty much been ruined, and ive been embarrassed by a
grown adult.
can we please delete this thread?
thanks,

Calvin Lauber?


Oh stop being such a drama queen. This is not the Disney channel. I don't see why people would not like you. The fact the a pro even talked about you, sadly, most people would kill for that on here.

Get over it and make some magic. We don't have time for this.
 
Sep 1, 2007
410
0
well now that my rep. here has pretty much been ruined, and ive been embarrassed by a
grown adult.
can we please delete this thread?
thanks,

Calvin Lauber?


Oh stop being such a drama queen. This is not the Disney channel. I don't see why people would not like you. The fact the a pro even talked about you, sadly, most people would kill for that on here.

Get over it and make some magic. We don't have time for this. the world is to close to blowing up to mope around.
 
Oh stop being such a drama queen. This is not the Disney channel. I don't see why people would not like you. The fact the a pro even talked about you, sadly, most people would kill for that on here.

Get over it and make some magic. We don't have time for this.

A little harsh, but well put. This thread needs to be left to die. I've tried to avoid it, and I did well for 14 pages dont you think? But it's getting rediculous. Calvin is a cool guy. Think what you wanna think. Feel what you wanna feel, but please let this thread DIE.
 
Oh stop being such a drama queen. This is not the Disney channel. I don't see why people would not like you. The fact the a pro even talked about you, sadly, most people would kill for that on here.

Get over it and make some magic. We don't have time for this.

I dont see how im being a drama queen.
Im just saying, people are done with this thread, and i defiantly
am done with it, so why not close it?
And i dont know.. how ANYONE... who looks up to someone..
would KILL to have that person say something negative about them.
Its just not nice.
But i dont want to argue, and thats all i see coming out of this thread now.
thanks

Calvin Lauber
 
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