In Search of Street Magic By: Jamy Ian Swiss

[Steerpike]

Book Clone? Dvd clone I believe you are referring to people who copy presentations from DVDs, which is common. The books I refer to are not those of presentation, but of sleights, and effects, Royal road to Card magic, and Expert at the card table.

Any form of elitism hurts you. You say they shouldn't copy one magician, then go and tell them to do it just line another guy. Normally, that kind of cognitive dissonance requires massive amounts of alcohol, or a career in politics.

I am sorry I care about these people being broke because they bought 4 ellusionsit dvds, and know their first 4 magic tricks, which costed them $120.

You're not their parents. Stop acting as if you need to shelter and protect people.

REverse engineer? no, encourage creativity yes, once you know the basic sleights, creativity comes in and you stop worrying about new effects, but creating presentations and effects of your own.

You're approaching it from the perspective that the way you learned is simply correct.

I learned Out to Lunch from a Docc Hilford book. By your logic, I would only ever use the Out to Lunch principle for that one routine because I'm just that stupid and naive.

Yes I have gotten to the point that recently I have little faith in the knowedge on newbies magicians because I have shown people at my club effects of mine, and have referred to something like a top change, and they didnt know what it was.

That is the most curmudgeoning thing you've said yet. A phrase like that should never pass your lips unless you're over the age of 70.

These were not new magicians, they have done magic for 2-3 years, close-up, and dont know basic card sleights. It may jsut be the 3 people in my magic club.

What do they do? Do you actually try to mentor them? Or do you just whine online about how they aren't as good as you?

 

[-Ty]

I LOVE BANANAS AND COLORING!!!!!

Why can't weeee be friends? Why can't weeee be friends?

On a serious note, I hear you people constantly complaining about magic being a dying art. How do you expect it to stay alive when the people who are supposed to keep it alive are being like this? Come on guys.

Because people love to complain.

I don't think magic isn't dying at all. Kids give themselves far too much credit.

It may be an interesting time for magic, but it certainly isn't dying.

Ty

 

[TKH]

No I teach them, I help them. I understand that you are not a beginer, so you would know that prinicples can be adapted for different uses, that is called creativity, I have to say I don't think most newcomers, who would be at E and buy the dvd, are creative enough and know enough. I am sure many are, but as you said, you aren't born with knowledge of magic.

I am sorry that I don't like being ripped off, and don't like others being taken advantage of.

 

[Steerpike]

I have to say I don't think most newcomers, who would be at E and buy the dvd, are creative enough and know enough.

Are you familiar with the DVD set Live at The Jailhouse? If not I suggest you get it.

Garrett Thomas and Justin Miller both talk about how when you're starting out, right in the very beginning, you're going to be a clone using somebody else's effects and words. It just happens that way.

But as you perform more, as you begin to garner more experience, you grow more bold and begin to experiment. The performance elements that aren't you fall away, leaving only the core that is you. It's a process that takes time, and you can't expect someone to do it over night.

I admit with no shame whatsoever that when I first started out, I didn't know the full extent of how to apply the few sleights I knew. I was using other people's scripts. It wasn't until I started coming up with my own scripts that things changed. Once I internalized components of performance theory and began to gain more experience, I was able to act more like ME.

I honestly believe that most magicians, artists in general actually, forget what it was like to be a newbie. That's why they get so angry and frustrated with newcomers to their art. They get offended with people who accomodate those newcomers, they lash out at new paradigms, they seek out scapegoats.

Brad Christian and Ellusionist are just the boogeymen for the old guard magicians. You said yourself that you don't any of the E DVDs. But you'll gladly pass judgment on them anyway. Did you know that Brad is an excellent teacher? He explains every move in detail, he gives advice on routining, he explains why the acts of misdirection in a particular presentation work. He gives people training wheels and the information to internalize the concepts.

When you buy an Ellusionist DVD, it's not just for the methods. If your only complaint is that they teach effects that are already taught in an older book, you're missing the point.

I am sorry that I don't like being ripped off, and don't like others being taken advantage of.

Why do you assume that anyone is out to get you?

 

[BlueBackedBikes]

Very well said, Steerpike.

 

[TKH]

No sorry dont own live at the jailhouse, did hear it was good though. I don't believe I said I don't own any ellusionist dvds. I actually own how do to street magic, my first magic dvd I bought like 5 years ago. I helped me a lot, I agree Brad was a fine teacher, very thorough.

Great Post by the way. I believe though that newbies should be taught the basics, and learn from like the tarbell course in magic, which takes you from 0-60 in 8 volumes. Id just rather E try to write a book, because no one would pay 15 bucks for a 10 page booklet. It would be awesome, if E got creators like DAnny Garcia, Justin Miller, bucks, and stuff, to create a book of (what I'll call) Modern Magic.

 

[Steerpike]

I actually own how do to street magic, my first magic dvd I bought like 5 years ago. I helped me a lot, I agree Brad was a fine teacher, very thorough.

Then what's the problem? A well-made teaching resource should be taken for what it is.

I'm sure not a one of you can tell me that the old standards such as Royal Road and 13 Steps aren't dry in the extreme. They're textbooks. And with the advent of DVD and video technology, there's a new way of getting people to learn that's more engaging.

The trouble is that so many magicians are still so attached to how they did things that they try to pound into our minds the superiority of their chosen medium. Worse yet, people are starting to believe it.

I believe though that newbies should be taught the basics, and learn from like the tarbell course in magic, which takes you from 0-60 in 8 volumes.

I don't question the legitimacy of resources like the Tarbell course. What I take issue with is that people let Mr. Swiss make up their minds for them and completely shut out a new generation and paradigm in magic.

That article is proof that no one is immune from kvlt kiddie syndrome. Just look at his attempt to define street magic. It's a goddamn joke lined with strawman arguments and fallacies.

Ellusionist is a legit business and learning resource, and neither the company nor its customers need to apologize for who they are, especially not those parroting talking points given to them by Swiss' article.

Id just rather E try to write a book, because no one would pay 15 bucks for a 10 page booklet.

You'd be surprised.

 

[JackOSpadesNik]

It's not a new generation of magic. It's a company taking old material from old books and making them into new Dvd's. It just looks new to you because they made it with new music and a teacher that has shades glued to his face.

Steerpike, E does have an Instant download which sells a throw vanish/tenkai palm for $13.

I never said I didn't make mistakes as a begginer. That's why I'm informing begginers now that you can't go out and ask random people if you could show them a trick. Would you rather not tell them and have a bunch of people trying to be David Blaine?

Please explain why E is advertising for Phenomenon and telling them people that you could learn mentalism like that from E? E isn't about mentalism. That's hilarious. This proves they just take advantage of kids who want to learn magic just because they watched an episode of Mindfreak or Phenomenon. They don't want to learn magic. They want to learn a couple tricks and they'll be done with it.

E isn't keeping magic a secret. There trying to expose themselves to as much people as possible (even those who don't care for the art) and suckering them into there giant armpit of overpriced Dvd's instead of taking begginers into the right direction.

Also, please don't reply with you insulting me with half your post.

 

[MitchellStafiej]

It's not a new generation of magic. It's a company taking old material from old books and making them into new Dvd's. It just looks new to you because they made it with new music and a teacher that has shades glued to his face.

Steerpike, E does have an Instant download which sells a throw vanish/tenkai palm for $13.

I never said I didn't make mistakes as a begginer. That's why I'm informing begginers now that you can't go out and ask random people if you could show them a trick. Would you rather not tell them and have a bunch of people trying to be David Blaine?

Please explain why E is advertising for Phenomenon and telling them people that you could learn mentalism like that from E? E isn't about mentalism. That's hilarious. This proves they just take advantage of kids who want to learn magic just because they watched an episode of Mindfreak or Phenomenon. They don't want to learn magic. They want to learn a couple tricks and they'll be done with it.

E isn't keeping magic a secret. There trying to expose themselves to as much people as possible (even those who don't care for the art) and suckering them into there giant armpit of overpriced Dvd's instead of taking begginers into the right direction.

Also, please don't reply with you insulting me with half your post.

I've been performing magic for 7 years, and I perform on the streets EVERY day, so PLEASE don't tell me that magicians can't perform for random people, because I've been street performing like that for 4 years.

Mitchell

 

[BlueBackedBikes]

Steerpike, E does have an Instant download which sells a throw vanish/tenkai palm for $13.

Not anymore, they don't.

Thought that was worth mentioning.

 

[Steerpike]

It's not a new generation of magic. It's a company taking old material from old books and making them into new Dvd's. It just looks new to you because they made it with new music and a teacher that has shades glued to his face.

Don't insult my intelligence.

I find it ironic how much you whine about advertising, when it's clear to me you're as much of a rube as anybody else.

Steerpike, E does have an Instant download which sells a throw vanish/tenkai palm for $13.

Ah yes, making individual effects from the DVDs sold for those who don't want to pay for the whole package. Or as you call it: the collapse of Western civilization.

I never said I didn't make mistakes as a begginer. That's why I'm informing begginers now that you can't go out and ask random people if you could show them a trick. Would you rather not tell them and have a bunch of people trying to be David Blaine?

I'm all for people making mistakes. It augments the learning process.

And if some show-off does a bad DL because he couldn't play guitar to impress chicks, pfft! No skin off my back.

Please explain why E is advertising for Phenomenon and telling them people that you could learn mentalism like that from E? E isn't about mentalism.

Says the guy who doesn't own a single E DVD. Here's a list of stuff they carry that contains mentalism, or material applicable to mentalism: HTDSM, Inside Magic, Crash Course 1, Explicit Content, Osterlind's Mental Miracles DVD set, Guerrilla Guide to Loops, Pre-Thoughts, PK Touches, Psychokinetic Silverware, Glass, Stigmata, Electric Touch, and Mindbender.

That's the trouble with not checking your facts: somebody else will.

That's hilarious. This proves they just take advantage of kids who want to learn magic just because they watched an episode of Mindfreak or Phenomenon. They don't want to learn magic. They want to learn a couple tricks and they'll be done with it.

Then you're going to have a coronary when you find out about these things called magic shops. You see, they're brick-and-mortar buildings that, and I'm not ****ing kidding, sell magic and magic-based supplies! It's crazy! They're not hidden, they don't make you pass tests before buying anything... there's not even a password to get in the door!

I went to a couple of these shops, and some kids walked right in and bought stuff like Thumb Tips and gimmicked coins! I just about had a stroke. Sweet chocolate Buddha, these magic shops are opening the floodgates for all kinds of poseurs to cheapen our art and ruin magic!

Or maybe not. Maybe there is no molehill to make into a mountain. But that's just the opinion of me, a lone sane individual.

E isn't keeping magic a secret. There trying to expose themselves to as much people as possible (even those who don't care for the art) and suckering them into there giant armpit of overpriced Dvd's instead of taking begginers into the right direction.

Kvlt kiddie syndrome at 12 o'clock. Shields up!

Also, please don't reply with you insulting me with half your post.

If I have something to say to you, I won't sugarcoat my words. You want a more relaxed forum, and you got it. If you want to talk to me, you have to be a thickskinned because I don't pull punches, and I will tell you what I'm thinking.

More importantly read and heed this:

I've been performing magic for 7 years, and I perform on the streets EVERY day, so PLEASE don't tell me that magicians can't perform for random people, because I've been street performing like that for 4 years.

Mitchell

Facts. Sometimes inconvenient, sometimes unpleasant, but good medicine tastes bitter.

Ask your doctor if facts are right for you.

 

[JackOSpadesNik]

I've been performing magic for 7 years, and I perform on the streets EVERY day, so PLEASE don't tell me that magicians can't perform for random people, because I've been street performing like that for 4 years.

Mitchell

I never said that. I mean that you shouldn't go up to someone and say " wanna see a trick?" You should build a crowd, and perform.

 

[BlueBackedBikes]

I never said that. I mean that you shouldn't go up to someone and say " wanna see a trick?" You should build a crowd, and perform.

Why not? What's wrong with that?

Serious questions here. What's so wrong if I want to walk up to a person or small group of people, ask to show them a 2 or 3-trick routine and then go do it again?

And I do believe you're over-estimating how many people go David Blaine style and walk up to people and say "Want to see a trick?".
I, for one, perform for single people/small groups on the street all the time and my greeting goes something like: "Hey guys, my name's Ryan, and I'm a magician. (Would you guys like to see something?/If you don't mind, could I show you guys something?)". Then, if they say yes, "Awesome! But first, let's get names..." and then I shake each of their hands and say "Nice to meet you".

 

[Minister of Magic]

I'm a kid and this was a great read. I agree entirely. E doesn't have any respect for the art.

Also, kids need to stop thinking that they can just go out and bother people to show them a trick. That's not street magic. If you want to see Street Magic one of the most modern examples would be Gazzo. You have to build a crowd. Not just bother some hot chick and say " wanna see a trick" That would be stupid.

He's not being negative. He's telling people the truth. Ecspecially that stupid advertising on How to do Street Magic. No magic whatsoever should be that easy to learn. You need to practice. Even on a self-working trick.

Every magician should read this. He has a lot to say and it should be heard.

Yes considering nobody uses the term street magic correctly. Considering that yes Gazzo is indeed a street performer, everyone else including your heroes here at Cookie Cutter 11 are what's known as Strolling Magicians.

Cookie cutter is not a knock at you guys who run this site, but people demonize ellusionist, and put you guys as saviors, but there is no need for this. Let's face it you guys have similar styles, and design. Which is okay,...

 

[joshua barrett]

I've been performing magic for 7 years, and I perform on the streets EVERY day, so PLEASE don't tell me that magicians can't perform for random people, because I've been street performing like that for 4 years.

Mitchell

how much money have you made doing this?

real street magic is not this marketing crock of bull T11 and E is selling. real street performers are out there making a living doing what they love.

 

[Steerpike]

how much money have you made doing this?

real street magic is not this marketing crock of bull T11 and E is selling. real street performers are out there making a living doing what they love.

So it's not legit magic unless you are currently making a living off of it.

Glad we got that cleared up.

 

[TKH]

performers are those who perform, if you want to do it for free, consider going to hospitals, they would love you to entertain the patients, and they wont run away from you when you perform. Or got to nursing homes, street just means modern, not actually real street magic, or what is called busking.

 

[Steerpike]

if you want to do it for free, consider going to hospitals, they would love you to entertain the patients, and they wont run away from you when you perform.

You're still buying into that transparently bogus strawman argument.

What on earth gives you the dellusion that nobody on the streets would want to see a strolling performer? It astounds me how many of you buy into Swiss' bogus argument and then sit there behind your keyboard and tell the rest of us what is and is not legit magic.

 

[The Now]

Jamy says every truth about today's magic generation.

Sorry, but I find it much more likely that Jamy has never met anyone in today's younger magic generation. The man is such a prick. He obviously did no further "searching" for street magic than the first three pages of a google search could yield to him. He even took a stab at a personal friend of mine, which really burns me.

All he has really seen is simply freaking advertisements for retail magic, which he has the preconceived notion of being all that street magic is allowed to consist of. I also love how so many of his primary sources are simply snide remarks about street magic quoted from one of his equally condescending friends.

The man assumes that everyone who purchases a "street magic" dvd or trick performs it exactly as described and does not even realized many magic retailers do not include much presentation as to discourage copy cat performances in beginners.

I also dislike his presumption that it is simply not permissable for busking and "street magic" to be one in the same.

-Snafu

 

[MitchellStafiej]

how much money have you made doing this?

real street magic is not this marketing crock of bull T11 and E is selling. real street performers are out there making a living doing what they love.

If you think magic is about making money then you are looking at magic in the wrong way. I do also perform for corporate parties and birthday parties, but the money I make never goes into my pocket. I immediately donate it to either Save Darfur or the Canadian Diabetes Association. Aside from that I DON'T accept money because that's not what I do magic for. I do magic to entertain, not to fill my pockets with money. I do what I love to do what I love.

I honestly can't see myself keeping money I make from doing magic. That's why I'm looking for a job.

Mitchell