Stage Hypnotism questions

[YRAMagicMan]

What credentials should a stage hypnotist have? How would you know if you were hiring a good, safe, hypnotist as opposed to some guy who bought one of those new DVDs that claim to teach hypnosis?

I ask because a local high school is looking to hire a hypnotist for a bit of after prom entertainment and my family is friends with one of the organizers of the event and they are currently considering the risks and possible objections to this particular form of entertainment.

 

[D ICE R]

The required credentials are different depending where you live. My advice would be to call a few local hypnothreapists as they will either know what is required or where to point you they probably know a few hypnotists aswell.

The single most important question you should ask any hypnotist is what their insurance is like and what safety measures they take. I preform a little hypnosis in my shows and I make sure I am covered for it.

 

[eostresh]

First let me say, I defer to DiceR, but I think I should add.....There might be some stage hypnotists that are using conjuring and mentalist tricks to give the appearance of Hypnotism. If you can find someone like that in your area it might be no more of a hassle than hiring a magician. That said....Not exactly sure how you broach that topic with someone who performs as a hypnotist? You might search for magicians in your area who mention hypnosis as part of their act.

 

[Cedric Taylor]

To be truly honest, you need to see him live. A trust hypnotist should be viewed live before you ever think about hiring them. I've had some really great one and some not so great ones perform for me. There are a lot of guys who can put people under but only a handful who can make it entertaining.

This guy here is a good example. The girl on stage is actually my friend and a reality tv show star herself. But anyways, you should really be careful about who you get as a hypnotist because for one, people's attentions span are really short and by the time the bigger phenomena starts to happen, the audience are no longer interested:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wuf6MZm9B5w

 

[YRAMagicMan]

Thanks a lot. I'm sure this will help the decision process for the people in charge of the entertainment for the event.

 

[Craig Browning]

The one thing you really need to stress to this committee is that there is a big difference between stage hypnosis vs. "real" hypnosis; 90% of what's done in a stage show is pure B.S. when you get right down to it; a fast thinking showman that knows how to take credit for natural human behavior coupled with a hint of psychology. Read through the Ormond McGill Encyclopedia of Stage Hypnosis and Orville Meyer's Telepathy in Action and you'll have more than an idea as to what's really going on. Kenton Knepper has several books about "Trance" work as well that show you how to manipulate participants leading them as well as the audience into believing true hypnotic states exist.

Back in the days before people were so sue happy many an old timer literally pressed their thumbs against a person juggler while "putting them under" -- the blood choke would make them light-headed and susceptible to suggestion, the most common suggestion created at the key point was "you want to participate in this demonstrations and go along with things so everyone has fun." I know this because I've watched my mentor use the technique more than once.

 

[Randy]

I'd suggest you pass this offer up, unless you are certified. Because if something goes wrong, specially now days and with hypnosis, you could end up finding yourself knee deep in a losing lawsuit. Specially if you tried to defend yourself in court with the words "I learned it from books and DVD's."

 

[WitchDocIsIn]

I'd suggest you pass this offer up, unless you are certified. Because if something goes wrong, specially now days and with hypnosis, you could end up finding yourself knee deep in a losing lawsuit. Specially if you tried to defend yourself in court with the words "I learned it from books and DVD's."

He didn't say he was trying to get the gig. He's asking what qualifications the committee looking to hire someone should be aware of, and also that they are just considering a hypnotist.

 

[Craig Browning]

I'd suggest you pass this offer up, unless you are certified. Because if something goes wrong, specially now days and with hypnosis, you could end up finding yourself knee deep in a losing lawsuit. Specially if you tried to defend yourself in court with the words "I learned it from books and DVD's."

I'm trying to understand what you mean by things going "the wrong way". . . it's really close to impossible for anything to go wrong in a hyp act when it comes to the participants and typically what goes wrong is their unwillingness to PARTICIPATE in the act. The people involved only think they have been put under, they are at best, in a light trance and the performer isn't (shouldn't) be dealing with anything suggestive of therapeutic questions or ideas. People going off in some "dark" way is Urban Myth and little other . . . sometimes, for the sake of PR hypnotists have had plants deliberately go too deep too fast, it's a psychological ploy and little other.

Other than McGill's material, which only offers very light trance perspectives, 99% of the material on Stage Hypnosis negates the fact that people are ever really put under (the only current source I know of that does otherwise, is "Reality is Plastic" but I'm not going to cough up some of the outrageous prices others are asking for their "courses" in hypnosis. For roughly the same price you can take courses that are legit and give you school credit to boot).

For many years any legit stage act would get certification because of laws and ordnances in various parts of the country based on unsubstantiated fears and myths tied to Mesmerism. I can assure you of two things; no matter how deep a person is taken in Hypnosis they will wake up, usually in under an hours time. Secondly, unless a suggestion is implanted over and over again for a period of time, a hypnotist cannot force a person to do something against their will; when it comes to a stage act they simply lower people's inhibitions and give them an excuse to do some very silly things while not be responsible for their actions, this is why a hyp show works.

 

[eostresh]

I'm pitching in with Craig on this one. He is doing a much better job of explaining the details than I do but I want to add my two bits none the less. My big question is......

What is this sudden obsession with magicians and mentalists, who want to perform hypnosis for entertainment purposes only, to try to learn actual hypnosis to the point of certification? In many cases, actually hypnotizing someone, is kind of a long boring process. Now I think that the stuff that Anthony Jaquin's group publishes is of great value to magicians. That said, that's about as far as I need to go with it. Most of what I have learned from them I use to enhance my presentation, not my method. When it comes to method start studying stage whispers, Dunninger Principles, and dual reality. Beyond that, you can use straight up conjuring tricks! Look into "out to lunch." Effects on the market that I have used to give the illusion of hypnosis are, Alvo Stockman's "Battle of The Sexes," and Alex Loredo's "CaPtivated." I'm sure there are many more if you look around for them.

In short, if you want to be a hypnotist then be a hypnotist! But, if you are an entertainer who wants to "play the part" of a hypnotist, then study some of the fundamental techniques of magicians and mentalists. Use those techniques as the "method" side of the equation and relegate the hypnosis to the presentation side.

Sorry for the rant but sometimes I hear stuff come out of magicians that just make me think to myself, "My god man! You are a magician....Start thinking like one!"

 

[Mat La Vore]

All I'm going to say is based on the quality of the responses in this thread I would definitely recommend you post this question in a hypnosis forum instead of here so you can get some actual educated advice. You have not been given qualified advice here. At all.

The hypnosis forum on the Magic Café isn't a bad place to start.

Good luck.

 

[Craig Browning]

All I'm going to say is based on the quality of the responses in this thread I would definitely recommend you post this question in a hypnosis forum instead of here so you can get some actual educated advice. You have not been given qualified advice here. At all.

The hypnosis forum on the Magic Café isn't a bad place to start.

Good luck.

A wise suggestion on one part; let's face it, if you want to learn how to build fine wood cabinets you wouldn't ask a plumber or brick mason to show you how. On the other hand, sending someone to the cafe for anything I feel to be taking two steps back, you'd get a more accurate overview going to Wikipedia (and do click that link for some perspective)

I do believe you've sold several people short in your comment, especially when sources like "Reality is Plastic" and "The Encyclopedia of Stage Hypnosis" are both highly acclaimed and supported; the latter being akin to Corinda when it comes to learning the foundation elements of the work.

I've never done a hyp act but I have done Telepathy in Action which is, let's face it, the same basic thing without the claim of hypnosis. . . at least that's what Ormond McGill said when we discussed the act; Ormond, Arnold Furst and Jerry Valley being the three most credited stage performers and "experts" in Hypnosis for many a long decade, all three being noted for clinical practice; kind of makes me wonder how referring someone to their material is an "uneducated" thing to do. . . almost makes me wonder how many aspiring stage hyp-acts out there even do their homework when it comes to both, foundation building and knowing the Who's Who of said craft.

That all said, here's a couple of other resources on the topic of STAGE Hypnosis

The Mark Lewis Course in Stage Hypnosis

Bob Cassidy's "The Real Work of Stage Hypnosis"

Richard Webster has a few books on the topic but I'm unable to track them down presently, I'd encourage you to take the time to find them however.

and here's a few links to Stage-Hypnosis Forums
The Hypno Forum
Stage Hypnosis Center
Hypnosis World

Hopefully my lack of education of this topic won't offend anyone and these links will prove viable to those curious about this topic.

 

[eostresh]

On a personal level I have enough respect for Matt La Vore, DiceR, Mr. Browning, Cedric and all the others on this thread to feel that we can have this discussion here. Matt is probably right, in that, there are professional hypnotists who make a living doing this stuff at the Magic Cafe'. I think we lack that expertise here. However this thread has sort of drifted into another direction. One which I feel should be had here(if not specifically in this thread than at least in another) at Theory 11.

The fact is that T11 is a beginners website(okay so card guys and flourishers have plenty to keep them going until well past intermediate.) Because of that, this is the place is the kind of place we should be asking questions about how one might want to approach these subcategories of the magical arts. The fundamental question that really needs to be asked(my opinion only) is "Do you want to hire(become) someone who really is a hypnotist, or do you want to hire(become) someone who puts on a good show as a hypnotist?"

Some certified hypnotists put on a good show. Some do not. Some guys, who use nothing more than conjuring and mentalism tricks, put on great shows as hypnotists even though nobody on stage is actually hypnotized during the performance. My point is that weather you are hiring one, or performing as one, the bottom line is "Good Show." Becoming a certified hypnotist can cost hundreds, even thousands of dollars. It is definitely the way to go if you want to be both a hypnotherapist and a performer who does a hypnosis stage show. If, however, all you want is a stage show, and you have no desire to become a tharapist then that just seems a bit excessive to me.

A good friend of mine, Pete Turner, used to have a great clip of a knock back induction on youtube. The beauty of it was that it looked every bit as real and amazing as anything you might have seen on the Zap dvd or the Manchurian Approach dvd. The key difference being, it wasn't hypnosis. Just damn clever thinking. Now the next thing you are probably thinking is "stooge," but if you walked up to the subject after the performance and asked her about it you would still be convinced it was hypnosis.

So I go back to my original hypothesis, "Why aren't magicians thinking like magicians any more?" Much of this hypnosis craze over the last few years reminds me of the NLP craze that swept through Mentalism a few years back. The irony of that craze being that much of it was spurred on by Derren Brown who openly admitted to being skeptical of NLP and felt it was just a "charlatans game."

As James Randy said to "psychics" bending spoons, "If you are using psychic powers to bend a spoon....you are doing it the hard way." I feel you could modify that statement to stage hypnosis as well. "Why do it the hard way?"

 

[Mat La Vore]

A wise suggestion on one part; let's face it, if you want to learn how to build fine wood cabinets you wouldn't ask a plumber or brick mason to show you how. *

Exactly.

On the other hand, sending someone to the cafe for anything I feel to be taking two steps back, you'd get *do believe you've sold several people short in your comment, especially when sources like "Reality is Plastic" and "The Encyclopedia of Stage Hypnosis" are both highly acclaimed and supported; the latter being akin to Corinda when it comes to learning the foundation elements of the work.

I never said anything against either of those books. They are both excellent.

I've never done a hyp act but I have done Telepathy in Action which is, let's face it, the same basic thing without the claim of hypnosis. . . at least that's what Ormond McGill said when we discussed the act; Ormond, Arnold Furst and Jerry Valley being the three most credited stage performers and "experts" in Hypnosis for many a long decade, all three *being noted for clinical practice; kind of makes me wonder how referring someone to their material is an "uneducated" thing to do. . . almost makes me wonder how many aspiring stage hyp-acts out there even do their homework when it comes to both, foundation building and knowing the Who's Who of said craft.

First, you are not the author of the material you are referencing. So throwing out book titles and mixing the authors' credibility with your opinions on the subject is not a fair or accurate way to represent yourself, or the authors you are referencing. The authors' opinions are not your own, and visa versa. They are separate. Disagreeing with something you've said does not mean someone is disagreeing with Ormond McGill. Equating the two as you are doing now is manipulative. Second, you are purposely putting the emphasis of my comment on a few book suggestions you made and completely disregarding everything you said in your posts that were representative of your actual opinions--which was clearly the subject at hand.

Lastly, the OP wanted advice on hiring a hypnotist, not becoming one. So throwing out book titles is missing his point completely. (Just as you have mine.)

My point in posting was to direct the OP to a proper channel of advice. So, as I'm not one to spend my time debating non-sense on internet forums, I'll leave it at that and just say that I think for someone interested in the subject you've listed some great resources.

 

[Craig Browning]

I love it when people get all intellectual to defend themselves. . .

My response was in regards to your comment inferring that no one in the thread up to the point of your post was "educated" on the subject and the tone, as I read it mind you, came off rather cocky and arrogant which is why I responded as I did.

I was not directly referring to books when it comes to Ormond, Arnold & Jerry these are people I've known and interacted with so I know their philosophies and credentials; but again, how I understood your previous post, Matt, seemed very self-important and rude. Besides that, I don't trust anything that spews from the Cafe, it is a highly overrated social club rife with politics and back stabbing, as well as thieves the management protects.

When it comes to wanting to hire a Hyp-Act, I do believe the original poster was given a great deal of valid insight that needed to be known of in that some areas do require board certification when it comes to such acts while others are perfectly fine with magicians that create the illusion of mesmerism. . . the latter frequently proving far superior to the "more legit" (kind of how Mental Magic is a far superior commercial a product than Mentalism, when it comes to corporate & club situations).

JUST TO BE CLEAR . . . my response above is based on how I felt when I read your previous posting and how your words (even in the above post here) seemed very arrogant and snobbish -- "I'm the lord of Hypnotism and no one knows what they are speaking of here but me" -- this is what it sounds and feels like. We both know how this is the bane of the Internet and how, what we intend to convey can be confused when read, so let's leave this as my not understanding your tone and perhaps, on your part, a lack of realization when it comes to how certain phrases might be seen as insulting.

 

[Mat La Vore]

I love it when people get all intellectual to defend themselves. . .

I honestly don't even know what that means unless you're just used to discussing things with stupid people and are bothered by those that don't fit into a category you are comfortable with.

My response was in regards to your comment inferring that no one in the thread up to the point of your post was "educated" on the subject and the tone, as I read it mind you, came off rather cocky and arrogant which is why I responded as I did.

I don't see how. I did not offer any opinions of my own or claim to be any type of authority. And I still don't. That's why I directed him to a proper forum to get advice from those that know more than I do on the topic. But I do stand by my original post that I do not feel anyone gave him any educated advice here. Sorry if that hurts your feelings.

JUST TO BE CLEAR . . . my response above is based on how I felt when I read your previous posting and how your words (even in the above post here) seemed very arrogant and snobbish -- "I'm the lord of Hypnotism and no one knows what they are speaking of here but me" -- this is what it sounds and feels like. We both know how this is the bane of the Internet and how, what we intend to convey can be confused when read, so let's leave this as my not understanding your tone and perhaps, on your part, a lack of realization when it comes to how certain phrases might be seen as insulting.

Yeah, far from it. I am just a fledgling little fish in a giant ocean of much bigger fish when it comes to the subject. I think you're just being a bit too sensitive about this, but I'll agree with your last comment and give you a kiss anyhow.

 

[YRAMagicMan]

This thread took off in a direction I wasn't expecting! Thanks for the replies. I got the answer I needed, and a whole lot more.

 

[IncredibleHypnotist]

What an interesting thread! Wanted to throw my hat in the ring and let you know that someone can take the title of Stage Hypnotist by committing to a hypnosis training program. Some of these programs are less than a few weeks so it's important that you do your research on the stage hypnotist you're looking at.

I've compiled a monster blog with 50 of the most asked questions surrounding stage hypnosis. Hope you find answers to other hypnosis questions.

http://incrediblehypnotist.com/2017/07/18/50-comedy-stage-hypnosis-show-faqs/