Daniel Madison is a thief?

[Undialer]

Many of you must get the sankey magic newsletter. If you do, I refer you to the recent email update sent out. Scroll down to the "Sincerest Form of Flattery!" and you will see something quite interesting.

I will quote from the newsletter:

Jay writes:[FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif] THE SINCEREST FORM OF FLATTERY
If theft is indeed the "sincerest form of flattery," then Daniel Madison must be a BIG fan of mine! Many of you recently emailed me drawing my attention to the fact that several of Daniel's marketed releases bare a striking resemblance to my own. His effect "Wrath" is very similar to my world-wide bestseller "In A Flash," and his effect "Bound" is very similar to my effect "Housebound" from my most recent book "Sankey Unleashed." (Hey, at least he altered the title of the trick...a bit!) And finally, Daniel's release "Outlaw" is almost identical to my very popular "Blackpool Effect" from my best-selling 'Restaurants and Bars' DVD. It will come as no surprise that Daniel's bio states, "after 6 months as a card-cheat, the repercussions of an exposed sleight of hand technique landed Daniel on life support in hospital." Some guys never learn. I contacted Daniel and he replied with, "I do not have any involvment in the magic industry at this point as I consider myself to be a visual artist and not a magician." Daniel, I couldn't agree more.

I feel that not only did one of the newest members of this site steal, but in his last line lie as well. He is obviously a part of the magic industry as he is a part of this website.

I want to know what you guys feel about this.

[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[Farrell]

Meh who really cares people get stolen from everyday. People not giving credit is stealing. Every magician alive and dead has stolen something from someone else, get over it.

 

[JoeCarr]

anyway he's taken those effects off, and tbh, Sankey annoys me anyway, the way he acts makes it seem like he thinks he's god's gift to magic, i think he needs to chill out and shut the hell up, lol....

And i agree with what was said before, effects have been repeated, its happened before and it'll happen again, look at Mercury for instance...

 

[FliXeRoCk107]

And i agree with what was said before, effects have been repeated, its happened before and it'll happen again, look at Mercury for instance...

I agree. Its all inspired. And i like Daniel Madisons stuff, and at least he gives the tricks cool names!

Felix

 

[Sean_Raf]

Sigh...

Well if a big name has said it then it makes everything complete factual truth and so we must all make up our minds based on that.

I'm seriously waiting and wanting for the day some one big name and one smaller name get together and the big name in one of their weekly newsletter "So and so stole this of mine etc." JUST to see how quickly it erupted.

I'm not saying Jay Sankey is wrong or anything please don't get me wrong, but he is a little subjective to the topic so he's not exactly going to say "Daniel and I talked over the matter and we've settled things like grown-ups do, follow our example kids "

Meh, I'm going off on an unnecessary rant, I'll stop.

I did wonder why those effects had been taken down and now I guess I know.

- Sean

P.S. Next time anyone wants to post a topic such as this, consider this for a title "Daniel Madison - Is this true?" Or "So what do you guys think about this?" Let's not be silly and jump on the bandwagon because one of our big leader's is unhappy! Still, I'll shut up.

 

[JoeCarr]

P.S. Next time anyone wants to post a topic such as this, consider this for a title "Daniel Madison - Is this true?" Or "So what do you guys think about this?" Let's not be silly and jump on the bandwagon because one of our big leader's is unhappy! Still, I'll shut up.

yeh also, why believe something he says just because he's 'the Jay Sankey', this threads title needs changing by mods i think... well pointed out Sean..

 

[Sean_Raf]

yeh also, why believe something he says just because he's 'the Jay Sankey', this threads title needs changing by mods i think... well pointed out Sean..

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Jay Sankey is lying or anything. He's got credentials and a reputation I don't think he'd lie just for sake of lying

It just irks me how things get blown way out of proportion than they need to be because die hard fans want to back up their superstar. (again I'm not saying that's what is happening here, I'm sure Undialer just wanted to bring this to attention and see what we made of it )

- Sean

 

[Jack]

The only thing that really bothered me about that quote was Daniel's response to the e-mail. That was a pretty weak cop-out!

I like Daniel and I like the effects he performs for the way HE performs them. He adds his own style and flare to a trick that it's taken this long for people to realize that the effect might not have originally been his. Sankey kept using phrases like very SIMILAR, ALMOST identical, and striking RESEMBLANCE. These are not absolutes! If he was using the same routine, method, and presentation that would be stealing. What I believe Daniel has done is improve on some already great effects. Selling them as his own... ehh I'm not so sure.

All that said he should still man-up and not make a b.s. statement like "I do not have any involvment in the magic industry at this point as I consider myself to be a visual artist and not a magician." I did expect a little more than that.

Cheers!

 

[Cyrus]

anyway he's taken those effects off, and tbh, Sankey annoys me anyway, the way he acts makes it seem like he thinks he's god's gift to magic, i think he needs to chill out and shut the hell up, lol....

I have to agree, I really don't like the way Sankey acts and I really hate his style of showmanship...I feel it ruins the magic.

And Daniel Madison took these effects off his website, so whats the big deal again?

As far as not being part of the magic industry is concerned, if you actually read some of Daniel Madison's stuff, I think you would understand why he says that. I have to agree with him, he is not part of the magic industry.

-Cyrus

 

[JoeCarr]

meh, dont get me wrong, im not saying sakneys a liar, its just he seems to have overreacted, but on the other hand, that response is pretty weak but hey, we dont know the whole story to be fair...

 

[Rabid]

The disregard for morals and ethics displayed in this thread astounds me.


Rabid

 

[Cyrus]

The disregard for morals and ethics displayed in this thread astounds me.


Rabid

We don't know the whole story, so it would be "ethical" to judge based on lack of information? You make me laugh.

-Cyrus

 

[Rabid]

We don't know the whole story, so it would be "ethical" to judge based on lack of information? You make me laugh.

-Cyrus

Glad i make you laugh mate.

You obviously need to read peoples comments before judging me.
It's irrelevant if someone stole something or not...that's not what i was referring to, as is plainly obvious.


Rabid

 

[Cyrus]

Glad i make you laugh mate.

You obviously need to read peoples comments before judging me.
It's irrelevant if someone stole something or not...that's not what i was referring to, as is plainly obvious.


Rabid

Thought you were referring to certain comments in particular.

-Cyrus

 

[robotsunshine]

Ignore me, I type too slow. [comment removed]

 

[Sean_Raf]

I think he was referring to things like

"Meh who really cares people get stolen from everyday. People not giving credit is stealing. Every magician alive and dead has stolen something from someone else, get over it."

- Sean

EDIT: Or what that guy above me said >_>

 

[Sam Hardy]

In my opinion, I couldn't care less. Daniel Madison's a fantastic magician / visual artist (whatever) and whether he "steals" his ideas from other people doesn't bother me. Magic is all about inspiration.
Besides, I can't stand Jay Sankey. I could write some hateful comment about him, but I won't.

 

[Bijlogg]

Rabid is completely right.

It would seem there are quite a few Madison fans here... I'm surprised so many people leapt to defend him. His reply to Sankey is complete BS.

Also, if someone can give me an explanation as to why telling people you've been stolen from is overreacting I'd love to hear it.

Tom

 

[Rabid]

In my opinion, I couldn't care less. Daniel Madison's a fantastic magician / visual artist (whatever) and whether he "steals" his ideas from other people doesn't bother me. Magic is all about inspiration.
Besides, I can't stand Jay Sankey. I could write some hateful comment about him, but I won't.

I rest my case.


For an Underground Magic Epicenter dedicated to furthering magic...this is just bloody sad.


Rabid

 

[samuelmshin]

Here's what I saw a whole bunch of:

"It's ok to steal as long as I like the person who's stealing and dislike the person he's stealing from." Now that's all well and good when you talk about the altruism of Robin Hood, but that's not what this is about.

A theft is a theft, and if this is in fact true, Madison is not stealing for the betterment of the general magic community, but rather for his own gain, and therefore doesn't achieve that Prince of Thieves status.

I don't know all the facts in this matter, so I'm not in a position to say whether or not Sankey's accusations are true. Regardless, it seems like most of the people who hop to Daniel's defense aren't defending whether or not he stole, but rather accepting that he stole and saying that it's ok.

Theft is wrong. The fact that it's been around forever doesn't justify it by any means, and for Sankey to be upset about it is completely understandable. It doesn't matter if you like him or not, he feels he was wronged and responded appropriately. Madison's response, if it is accurately stated by Jay, was definitely and absolutely a copout.