Tough to Present Effects.

[worldwideme]

Hey Guys,

I've been working with some stuff and trying to hammer out some more solid routines. (its a never ending battle)

and i keep coming across stuff i love to do, but is really hard to get a creative and meaningful presentation. i figured this would be a good place to share our thoughts on presentations for tricks were struggling to present well.

why? it helps to eliminate bad magic just a little bit more. 'but i don't want to share my own creations!' thats fine, then don't. I'm sure a lot of us would appreciate it if you did. but its your right not to.

just post some effects you have a hard time presenting. and also post some ideas for effects other have posted. its a pretty simple idea.

heres a few i'm struggling with:

Card sandwich effects! i used to have a really long drawn out story about jimmy johns. but it was too long. any ideas?

Spongeballs are kind of tough. i've got an idea i'm still pounding out... and then pounding out some more. its very rough.

 

[Aaron.Williams]

I do sandwich effects almost every day and the only real advice I could give you for this is that unless spectators are paying for a show, they usually don't want a trick that involves a story (especially a long one). I usually do the "Ace Shake" and the reveal slowly with kings with my own little handling and the spectator holding the deck (audience interaction is a good thing). Sorry I've never performed spongeballs so no help there.

The effect I have the most difficulty with is Stigmata. It's probably because I'm black but I'm kinda light, if you want to use that terminology, and red shows up very vibrant on my skin when it shows up but there's always that gamble if the mark will or won't show up.

 

[worldwideme]

i wasn't talking about putting a story to every effect. just ways to present effects. for example. when i perform linking rubber bands i don't just say "watch if i rub them together like this...THEY LINK!!"

i use sillybandz and tell them that the way they make them is to cut and then reattach pieces of the bands at odd angles...leaving small openings that magicians like myself can get through...

 

[TheatreHead]

depending on your presentation style, it might not even be necessary. Look at how Blaine does it. It's still magic presented well, but he doesn't really have accompanying patter.

When I do my ACR, I don't use patter to "explain" that the card is magically moving itself up through the deck. Sometimes, effects don't need patter. They're magical just because they are.

 

[houdini1111]

Lol i was thinking about myself and almost any tick that applies I use stage magic comparisons like i'll say "Have you ever seen linknig rings? well they suck" lol or i say "im too poor i cant afford those" or a torn and restored card ill say "have you ever seen where they cut a lady in half? well im gonna show you the same thing but not with a real lady because last time i tried that it didnt turn out so good lol but i mean if your just yourself you kind of let the magic become you if you know what i mean.

 

[WitchDocIsIn]

I've never really had an effect that was tough to present if I was actually interested in it. Everything I perform, I do so because when I heard about it or saw it, I thought, "Hey! I could do X, Y and Z with that! That would be great!". If I don't have that reaction, I usually don't pick up that effect. Or if I'm reading it in a book, I just sort of remember what it is and where it is, and if I have an idea later I'll come back to it.

Now that the majority of my performances are while busking, my scripts have become more 'commercial' based and less 'artistic expression' based. I have a bunch of lines that I use at appropriate places in my performance, and the rest is off the cuff responses to what my audience is saying and doing. My show can be anywhere from 10 to 30 minutes, depending on audience reaction and participation.

When I do other performances, I subscribe to a less is more philosophy of scripting. I like to use as few words as possible, while still making the instructions and effect clear. I use a lot of silence, facial expressions and gestures. But that is what suits me. I'm a very quiet person, usually. I only speak when I have something to say.

 

[SKSleighofHand]

For the card sandwich, you could present that the two of a kind (or four of a kind) are cops and represent justice. The selection can be bank robbers and the four of a kind are trying to capture. It is easy for the audience to follow along.

 

[praetoritevong]

Hey Guys,

I've been working with some stuff and trying to hammer out some more solid routines. (its a never ending battle)

and i keep coming across stuff i love to do, but is really hard to get a creative and meaningful presentation. i figured this would be a good place to share our thoughts on presentations for tricks were struggling to present well.

why? it helps to eliminate bad magic just a little bit more. 'but i don't want to share my own creations!' thats fine, then don't. I'm sure a lot of us would appreciate it if you did. but its your right not to.

just post some effects you have a hard time presenting. and also post some ideas for effects other have posted. its a pretty simple idea.

heres a few i'm struggling with:

Card sandwich effects! i used to have a really long drawn out story about jimmy johns. but it was too long. any ideas?

Spongeballs are kind of tough. i've got an idea i'm still pounding out... and then pounding out some more. its very rough.

Sure, I get that. Sometimes I love an idea but really just have trouble fitting it to a presentational hook. Or, I read a presentation, and I just have to change it completely because nothing about it fits me at all - it's not convincing.

As far as card sandwich effects... The key to presenting a card sandwich effect in my opinion is: why are you using two cards to find one?

Although I have not performed any for a while, one of my favourite sandwiches is the one in Advocate (perhaps the only d+M effect/product I've liked/used). The reason I like it is because there is a reason those two cards are in play. Once you work out why the cards are there, then you'll have your presentation.

 

[LuseifHo]

Like wise...
I hate it when I come across a lovely effect but dont find a satisfying presentation.
Like you, the sandwich has been my One. I could never justify why anyone would find 1 card with 2 cards and just... whats the point? For all my other effects, I am able to make a justifyable patter that is more than a story... ACR- explaining misdirection, Biddle Trick- explaining poker training, Dr. Daley's Trick- explains Black Jack, etc. But sandwich bugs the hell out of me. I have played with the patter of cheating in cards with sandwiches... But it is more of a sandwich with 4 cards finding 1. Like a poker hand missing 1 finds the right card or what ever... but I didn't really like that.

 

[Mat La Vore]

I don't really do big drawn-out presentations for my close-up material. Usually I just come up with a presentational hook and then let the effect speak for itself. What I've found is that magicians either tend to talk way too much because either A) they feel that's what good presentation is, or B) they aren't comfortable enough with the effect to let it speak for itself so they force a presentation onto it. And on the flipside, sometimes magicians are so focused on the effect they forget to present it at all. Here's an example, using Daniel Madison's effect Bad Influence, by what I mean by just using a presentational hook:

BAD INFLUENCE
Mat
Are you the type of person that believes life is more about destiny or more about chance?

Alex answers.

Mat (to Chris)
And you?

Mat (to Sam)
And you?

Mat
So (percent) of you both believe life is more about (choice) than (other choice). (Pause) That’s interesting.

I want to try an experiment. Can you shuffle cards?

Alex responds.

Mat
Good. I want you to shuffle these up and then spread them out face down so you can’t see which card is which.

Good. Now, without thinking about it, when you feel like you’ve come to the (name of card) I want you to just push that card out a little bit. This one? Ok, please hand the deck on to Chris.

Alex hands the deck to Chris.

Same thing. Spread the cards and when you feel like you’ve come to the—(name of card) just push that card forward. Perfect. And onto Sam.

Chris hands the deck to Sam.

Same thing. We did (names both cards). (Pause—names card)

Mat
OK. So we have three cards here. Yours was?

Mat points to the other two prompting them to name their cards.

Mat
Before we started I asked each of you if you believed life was more about destiny or chance. (Pause) Look at this.

Mat shows and names the three chosen cards.

As you can see there is no direct statement in the script about what the effect is supposed to be about--it's just a conversational line in the beginning, and a reminder of that line again right before the climax. That's it. It's enough to give them something to think about both for the effect and, on a larger scale, their own lives. It's a universal question brought up in a casual manner that doesn't overshadow or crowd the magic--it just prods the spectators to consider their own beliefs on a subject and gives the magic some context.

Now I'm not saying this is a brilliant script, but it works for me and it's how I like to present magic. I like when an idea is thrown out and the magic then comments on that idea. Sometimes it's an open-ended comment (like above in Bad Influence), and sometimes it's something a bit more definite. But in my experience I've found it doesn't take much more than that to communicate the magic and give it meaning.

 

[worldwideme]

Thanks Guys! this is all great stuff.

Prae and Lusief. thats exactly where i'm at. theres no real hook when i do sandwich effects. its just like "look i found your card! with these two cards!!" its just kind of lame and nobody really cares. haha. but i think i have an idea. let me know what you guys think...

i call the two cards that act as the bread of my sandwich my assisstants? just say something stupid like 'I've always been fond of the red kings,well look, this dude has an axe and the other guy is stabbing himself in the head. they are obviously either really tough guys....or messed up in the head. or both. its like the represent the extremes in all of us, that and they are really good at hunting down cards that aren't the way they're supposed to be, here i'll show you, pick a card and mark it all up. thats right draw all over it.

or something to that effect?

 

[Liderc]

Think about the impossibility of a properly done sandwich effect:

not only do you locate their card, but you get it "Between" two cards... the impossibility of how you could load a card between two cards in view that's where you should focus on


Bad Influence is such a Fantastic effect, my handling of it requires no peeks a'tall..

oh and as mentioned above me.. it's all about "The Advocate"

 

[TheNextIllusionist]

What I like to do is what Jim Carrey does alot, called riffing. Without even thinking about an effetc, I just lay the props out, & in front of a camera just play around & let my imagination run wild, acting like a total goof. Just let go, & your true self & personality will really come true. Theres nothing like immitating yourself!!!

 

[worldwideme]

Think about the impossibility of a properly done sandwich effect:

not only do you locate their card, but you get it "Between" two cards... the impossibility of how you could load a card between two cards in view that's where you should focus on


Bad Influence is such a Fantastic effect, my handling of it requires no peeks a'tall..

oh and as mentioned above me.. it's all about "The Advocate"

so you think more of a probability or 'lets think about this for a second. NOT ONLY did i find you card. BUT i placed Two cards in precise locations in the deck, that i could not possibly have known." approach is a good way to go at a sandwich effect?

 

[zdogmagic]

hey guys,

please dont bash me for this but i have a hard time presenting an acr well! i just feel like i cant get the trick to end up looking good presentation wise! i dont know but i just dont think i should do that trick anymore unless i could really get a good idea... go figure!

i also agree with a post above me that said sponge balls. i can never think of a way to present that either.

 

[Aaron.Williams]

hey guys,

please dont bash me for this but i have a hard time presenting an acr well! i just feel like i cant get the trick to end up looking good presentation wise! i dont know but i just dont think i should do that trick anymore unless i could really get a good idea... go figure!

i also agree with a post above me that said sponge balls. i can never think of a way to present that either.

ACR is a really hard trick performance-wise. If you overthink it. Ambitious card routines shouldn't be more than 4 parts long. And really think about what your ending should be, you could do the pop up move or some other thing that blow the other parts out of the water. just be yourself. If you usually use patter, you can make their selected card the "Houdini" card. Or if you don't use patter just let the magic speak for itself. Get creative. Nobody can really tell you how to do an ACR, it's all about your creativity and your personality.

 

[zdogmagic]

ACR is a really hard trick performance-wise. If you overthink it. Ambitious card routines shouldn't be more than 4 parts long. And really think about what your ending should be, you could do the pop up move or some other thing that blow the other parts out of the water. just be yourself. If you usually use patter, you can make their selected card the "Houdini" card. Or if you don't use patter just let the magic speak for itself. Get creative. Nobody can really tell you how to do an ACR, it's all about your creativity and your personality.

Thanks Aaron! your post helped me a lot! See this is why i joined the forum, to have people like you help me out NICELY...

I will rethink my ambitious card with your thoughts in mind.

Thanks

 

[Liderc]

Depends on your sandwhich effect, is it more of a collecters? or are the Two Card seperate from the deck and their card materializes inbetween.

i don't like to tell people how they should perform, i'm here to give advice, help and suggestions

think of this

Test Conditions: i have these two cards it would be imposible for me to get anything between them without you seeing. and their card materializes.. play with it