Card Counting

dejavu05

dejavu05

Nov 30, 2007
821
0
Hey everybody! I looked up card counting on the search bar and surprisingly there were almost no threads on them. One or two kind of touched on them but not so much. So what I was wondering is does anyone here count cards (as in blackjack). I am finding counting cards very interesting. So my question to you is do any of you count cards and do you know any good places (websites, books, DVDs) to learn how to count cards. Thanks in advance!
 
Ky1eNewton

Ky1eNewton

Aug 11, 2008
30
0
United Kingdom
www.youtube.com
Well here's a dvd i found just doing a quick search on google http://www.amazon.com/Blackjack-Team-Counting-Secrets-Bloch/dp/B00161WFOG but i for one wouldn't condone such a thing as if you get caught then you could be in quite a sticky situation, i'm not sure if it's true but I think I heard something about Daniel Madison getting in quite bit of trouble counting cards or something before he started his underground magic career.
 
dejavu05

dejavu05

Nov 30, 2007
821
0
Ky1eNewton said:
Well here's a dvd i found just doing a quick search on google http://www.amazon.com/Blackjack-Team-Counting-Secrets-Bloch/dp/B00161WFOG but i for one wouldn't condone such a thing as if you get caught then you could be in quite a sticky situation, i'm not sure if it's true but I think I heard something about Daniel Madison getting in quite bit of trouble counting cards or something before he started his underground magic career.
Click to expand...

He did get caught and got in a lot of trouble.
 
chrystal baller

chrystal baller

Jun 27, 2008
219
1
Illinois
i am able to count cards. i learned from one of my brother's buddies in college. it is all simple math (adding and subtracting) what makes it hard is you have to do it fast and not count just for your own cards but count every card that is dealt.. i would not go to Vegas and count cards though; it is not illegal but you can get in a lot of trouble. counting cards is not exact either. what you are doing is keeping a count on the deck so you know when the deck is hot (when it is likely to produce desired cards). counting cards is better used for private games in my opinion. hope this helps! if not pm me
 
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samgold89

Nov 11, 2007
88
0
Memphis, Tennessee
Back in the day actually, card counting was great and effective. Knowing when the deck is hot only increases your odds mildly because you can't just switch from betting the minimum to betting all you got. What they did in Bringing Down the House (21), was call someone over the table in the middle of the shoe. Not only do they not allow that in casinos anymore, but there's another snag that renders counting completely useless.

They continuously shuffle the cards back into the deck. Thus, there's no "past" to the game, so counting doesn't do anything. The only time counting could be effective is if you're playing with a bunch of friends, and you're using multiple decks.

Sorry if this didn't make much sense, I'm drugged out 'cause my wisdom teeth just got removed.

SG
 
brainblower

brainblower

Jul 21, 2008
94
1
32
Finland
My friend told me one popular way (+ and -) to count cards. And that is exactly the same they used in the movie 21. Is there any other more advanced methods? Im interested too :D
 
C

conner.mcdonald

Jan 21, 2008
8
0
Ha, I love how people are just stating what they saw in the movie "21." That method is certainly not the only, or the best, method out there. The most common and effective for most situations includes counting how many time the cards are shuffled and how many times the cards are cut, and which way they are cut. Which allows you to know the vague position of cards you saw in the last game. It is usually hard to do with more the two cards you are trying to follow, and is by no means exact. But it does improve your odds if you follow two aces, and know they are in play, or other similar situations. I wish I could find a link to a book I had, it covered many methods along with their pros and cons.
 
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samgold89

Nov 11, 2007
88
0
Memphis, Tennessee
What I'm saying, because people don't seem to get the picture, is that card counting is impossible now. Most major casinos now have a machine that shuffles the most recently discarded cards in with the rest of the deck. This means that there is no PAST to the game anymore. The whole principle of counting cards is based on the idea that Blackjack has a past, present, and future. In this particular game, eliminating the past (shuffling the cards back into the shoe) means that while there is a future, it CANNOT be calculated or determined by any sort of counting. It's been reverted back to a game of chance, and skill of course, but the casino now has the odds.

To summarize, counting cards does not work anymore.

SG
 
M

M_dalgashon

May 16, 2008
106
1
In my pocket, next to the card you thought of
In one of his popular DVD's (the DVD's for the general public), Derren Brown briefly explain his way for card counting with a memory technique. His way of doing it is picturing in his mind a big room with 52 different objects which symbolizes the cards in the deck, and then he puts a white sticker on the object if that card has already been delt, that way he can see which cards are left.
Anyway, I don't find card counting very exciting, at least in the type of magic I do... I'm not really a gambler type of personality :p
 
S

samgold89

Nov 11, 2007
88
0
Memphis, Tennessee
ElisG said:
In a casino, virtually NO cheating you will get away with, a private game is a different thing altogether though...
Click to expand...

Agreed, but in that private game, you'd need to be playing with 3 or 4 decks in order for your count to mean any thing. With only 52 cards, first of all the deck will never get very "hot", and if it is, it'll last for a hand or two maybe.

SG
 
T

TheCadet

Nov 28, 2007
4
0
where to start card counting

I have done a lot of research and practice. I first started learning from an old book i found, but after that came Andy Bloch's DVD at expertinsight.com. Andy was the Prof. who led the M.I.T. team. He has his own site that you can join and ask him questions.
I would also recommend blackjackapprenticeship.com.
They are one of the best sources. Good Luck and practice practice practice. You can usually tell who is serious about making serious money and who just wants to learn a skill by how much effort they put into it.
 
chrystal baller

chrystal baller

Jun 27, 2008
219
1
Illinois
i know counting in most major casinos is a thing of the past that is why i said i would only use it at private games. the guy that taught me (his name is Jason) uses counting at some "river boat casinos" idk where though (my brother went to school by Chicago, but idk where this guy Jason was from).
 
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s::VI

Aug 5, 2008
95
0
I count cards .... just so everyone understands card counting is NOT illegal your just using your mathematical knowledge with info that is there for everyone.

PM me for videos and books.
 
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shemhamforash

Sep 3, 2007
38
0
samgold89 said:
What I'm saying, because people don't seem to get the picture, is that card counting is impossible now. Most major casinos now have a machine that shuffles the most recently discarded cards in with the rest of the deck. This means that there is no PAST to the game anymore. The whole principle of counting cards is based on the idea that Blackjack has a past, present, and future. In this particular game, eliminating the past (shuffling the cards back into the shoe) means that while there is a future, it CANNOT be calculated or determined by any sort of counting. It's been reverted back to a game of chance, and skill of course, but the casino now has the odds.

To summarize, counting cards does not work anymore.

SG
Click to expand...

Actually MOST casinos in the U.S. do not employ the continuous shufflers yet. I was in Vegas just last year and was surprised to see that even most casino's in Vegas don't use these devices yet. The reason why they don't use these is the average Joe customer doesn't like them. When a couple of casinos in Vegas did try to use them on a bunch of their tables customers didn't play at those tables. The customers determine what goes at the game. Another strategy to beat card counting is to cut the deck higher so less cards are dealt before the cards are shuffled. That didn't work either players quit playing those tables. I've been in and around casinos every day for the past 4 years, and only a few casinos i have been in employs the continuous shuffler.

Now a days if you get caught card counting (and I did get caught last time i was in vegas, i was playing to erratic of a betting spread) the pit boss and a couple security guards will come up tap you on the shoulder ask you to take your chips and back away from the game. They will then tell you you are welcome to play any game in the casino except for blackjack. If you get caught playing blackjack again then you will be banned from their casino(s). Your name and picture then goes into a database of card counters AT THAT CASINO. If you are really good or get caught multiple times then you'll make the Griffin Books in vegas and will be known in all Vegas Casinos.

If you are really interested in card counting pick up the books
Million Dollar Blackjack by Ken Uston
Blackbelt in blackjack by Arnold Snyder
Beat the Dealer by Edward Thorp (this book is the original and still the best on blackjack)


I use the Uston Advanced Point Count System. It is proboably the most accurate counting strategy but also most difficult to use. Lots of calculations going on in your head at one time. It is available in Million Dollar blackjack, but i would advise starting of with basic Plus Minus before moving on to the more advance counting strategies.

Hope this all helps
 
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