Comedy and Why You Suck At It

Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
I was inspired by this thread, which I killed by being in it: http://forums.theory11.com/showthread.php?t=16695

Comedy is ridiculously difficult to do correctly. Along with horror, it is exceptionally difficult to invoke the correct emotions, mostly because people have no idea how to construct a joke or dread. But we're talking about being funny here, so the horror references end there.

Let's start with the bare-bones basics. Jokes. This is the biggest over-simplification of humor anyone has ever devised. But there are a few things that it seems have escaped most people because no one bothered to tell us. A good joke has three parts. Set up, build up, and punchline. The set up is the characters and the situation. The build up is the events that occur between the characters. And the punchline is the conclusion where the humor actually sets in. The build up can last however long it's needed, but it needs to do just that: build up!

Think you can construct a joke now? Good. It's more complicated than that, but I'm too impatient to get into it right now.

Character is also important. You have to behave in a manner consistent with the persona that you project. Andrew "Dice" Clay wouldn't sound right using Bob Hope's material for example. This takes time to develop, but it makes the creation of new material much easier because you know exactly what is consistent with your style. The words come easily.

On top of that, consider your timing. Between jokes, gags, and one-liners you need to pause to give your audience time to react. You need to let tension build up in order to give the punchline the maximum impact. French magician Arsene Dupin is a master of comedic timing. When I saw him perform, he played the act mute, but his pacing and pauses were obviously perfectly scripted and timed months or even years in advance so that they appeared natural while getting the most out of every action. For more examples of great comedic timing, watch some Mae West films.

Now of course there's the age-old debate between improv comedy and scripted comedy. And most people are talking directly out of their asses on this subject. What kills me is the number of people who extol the virtues of improv despite the fact that they completely suck at it. They simply cannot construct a joke. And since they haven't done the work necessary to perfect character and timing, the whole thing comes out as a jumbled mess. It is a very rare person who has the ability to be naturally funny off the cuff and I only know one such person.

And the people who advocate scripting aren't much better. They always use those awful, cornball canned lines. Nails on a chalkboard. Interestingly, if a spectator beats you to that joke, it's funny. But when the performer says it, it causes my ears to start hemorrhaging. Again, they take an approach without actually doing any of the work involved.

The fact of the matter is that if you want to script, you have to work at it and rehearse and write some original material for the love of Christ! And if you want to improv, you're going to have to script first.

So unless you have gone through the trouble of actively writing down original material, developing a consistent character, and rehearsed to ensure consistent timing, vocal tone, and body language, you suck at comedy.

And let's face it, this is only a skimming of the surface. There's the sub-genres of comedy such as physical, black humor, the absurd... There's the variety of rhetorical devices such as alliteration, metaphor, hyperbole, comedic triads, and so on. And each one of them has times when they're appropriate and the rest of the time when they aren't. It takes years of practice to actually get good at this stuff. Comedy is just like magic: it is a skill set that requires dedication, focus, study, and training.

Not terribly funny maybe, but the truth isn't always so.
 

bd

Jun 26, 2008
584
2
San Francisco, California
Steerpike said:
Now of course there's the age-old debate between improv comedy and scripted comedy. And most people are talking directly out of their asses on this subject. What kills me is the number of people who extol the virtues of improv despite the fact that they completely suck at it. They simply cannot construct a joke. And since they haven't done the work necessary to perfect character and timing, the whole thing comes out as a jumbled mess. It is a very rare person who has the ability to be naturally funny off the cuff and I only know one such person.

This is so very depressingly true - not just of magicians, but of many, many people.

Steerpike, I love you.
 
Feb 27, 2008
2,342
1
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Grand prairie TX
Dark comedy is my favorite.
People never understood why I laughed so much during there will be blood.
I really enjoy reading your post steerpike.I hardly think of doing a joke in a performance,since scripted comedy is my weak spot. If whatever 'joke' i do say is solely based on the moment or something quick and just deserving of a small laugh.
 
Aug 18, 2008
680
3
I was inspired by this thread, which I killed by being in it: http://forums.theory11.com/showthread.php?t=16695

Now of course there's the age-old debate between improv comedy and scripted comedy. And most people are talking directly out of their asses on this subject. What kills me is the number of people who extol the virtues of improv despite the fact that they completely suck at it. They simply cannot construct a joke. And since they haven't done the work necessary to perfect character and timing, the whole thing comes out as a jumbled mess. It is a very rare person who has the ability to be naturally funny off the cuff and I only know one such person.

May I ask who that person is...if it is someone famous
 
Sep 30, 2008
310
0
34
Pittsburgh
You know I saw the name of this thread in the Last Post part of the forum home. As soon as I saw the title I thought "Hm... that's got to be a Steerpike thread"

Great post, as usual. I prefer not to get involved with this one though.

-Kevin
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Dark comedy is my favorite.
People never understood why I laughed so much during there will be blood.
I really enjoy reading your post steerpike.I hardly think of doing a joke in a performance,since scripted comedy is my weak spot. If whatever 'joke' i do say is solely based on the moment or something quick and just deserving of a small laugh.

Again, it's a skill set. You just need to work on it a bit.

Say What...?

(by Alexander Vornoff)

I do indeed go over this in more detail in my book. Kind of a pet cause of mine.

May I ask who that person is...if it is someone famous

An old roommate of mine.
 
I have only done improv for 1 year and kind of have a grasp on timing and delivering a funny line. Thanks for the recommendations of people I could study to learn more about comedy so far very helpful.
 
Jan 9, 2008
226
0
Sacramento
And if you want to improv, you're going to have to script first.

um... I feel like the definitions contradict... or maybe that's your point, if which, you have a dismally pessimistic view on your fellow beings' funny bones. I wouldn't say that I'm a comedian, but I think some people would say I'm a funny guy.

There's a huge difference in being likable and being a comedian. I prefer to be likable because a comedy magic show splits the act in half, ruining much of the magic. I have never seen a comedy magic act that I particularly enjoyed, (perhaps lack of background on the subject) but I think that interaction with the audience and volunteers/ spectators can produce a great environment. But scripted improv? you crazy?

kevin
 
Sep 30, 2008
310
0
34
Pittsburgh
um... I feel like the definitions contradict... or maybe that's your point, if which, you have a dismally pessimistic view on your fellow beings' funny bones. I wouldn't say that I'm a comedian, but I think some people would say I'm a funny guy.

There's a huge difference in being likable and being a comedian. I prefer to be likable because a comedy magic show splits the act in half, ruining much of the magic. I have never seen a comedy magic act that I particularly enjoyed, (perhaps lack of background on the subject) but I think that interaction with the audience and volunteers/ spectators can produce a great environment. But scripted improv? you crazy?

kevin

Try looking up Bill Malone. One of the best comic magicians out there

-Kevin
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
But scripted improv? you crazy?

On the contrary. To do real improv, you must first have thoroughly scripted and rehearsed... and developed a character. Improv is useless if you have no idea who the hell you are and why you're doing whatever it is you're doing. Otherwise you look like a schmuck trying to be funny, which means you aren't. Comedy has to appear natural and sublime. If people can tell you're trying, you're failing.

Furthermore, my acts are very thoroughly scripted and rehearsed. As a result, my brain can go on autopilot through the sleights and scripts and I can pay more attention to my audience in real time. I can then improvise a good joke when I need to because my concentration isn't dominated by just trying to keep my act strung together.

As for good comedy magicians, again I bring up Arsene Dupin. Everything he did was totally motivated. Some of the gags he actually understated and let the timing and situation carry the humor. It takes an incredibly deft touch of a virtuosic performer to pull that off.
 
Feb 27, 2008
2,342
1
33
Grand prairie TX
Yeah, it's true, comedy is hard! I love writing one liners. Most of them...well...suck, but some of them are really funny. I found this article a while ago about how to do stand-up comedy. I think it applies to comedy in general:

http://www.soyouwanna.com/site/syws/standup/standup2.html

One liners:

Phones:
A landline is just a cell phone that is afraid of the unknown.

Trick or Treat:
I like trick or treating, especially when it’s not Halloween.

Time Machine:
I built a time machine, but I can only get it to go into the future—very slowly.

Toilets:
I wonder if toilets get made fun of by other furniture.

Ice:
Ice is just water that grew up in a rough neighborhood.

I'm really good at writing one liners, especially if I make the margins really small. (joke)

Anyway, check out the article I atatched.

They sound like jokes demetri martin would come up with.
Pretty funny.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
This brings up another important topic to comedy. Audience.

I personally don't get what's funny about Demetri Martin. Maybe I just didn't like Juno and Napolean Dynamite enough to get his sense of humor. I don't know.

But I get the feeling I'm not his target audience. I'm the target audience for Metalocalypse because my sense of humor can be summed up in three words: blood is funny.
 
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