Disrespect
- Thread starter DannyT
- Start date
Religion... the opiate of the masses
As a "bigtime Christian," I agree with you completely. You just reminded me of my least favorite of the ten commandments. "Thou shalt not pass." Unless of course you can answer three questions...
Next time this happens look at them and say, "I'm confused, I'm telling a story with a prop. Where is my "sin," telling the story, or using the prop?" This is how Christ used to deal with their kind (the Pharisees) in the Bible.
I just designed a stage illusion for one of the pastors at the church I attend. He places a ladder under a video screen that has a tree projected onto it. He climbs the ladder, reaches up to the video "tree" and plucks fruit off of it. He then comes down the ladder, bites into his piece of fruit, and throws the other out into the congregation.
Gahndi has a quote about Christians being so unChristlike. I wish I could remember it so you could use that too.
As a "bigtime Christian," I agree with you completely. You just reminded me of my least favorite of the ten commandments. "Thou shalt not pass." Unless of course you can answer three questions...
Next time this happens look at them and say, "I'm confused, I'm telling a story with a prop. Where is my "sin," telling the story, or using the prop?" This is how Christ used to deal with their kind (the Pharisees) in the Bible.
I just designed a stage illusion for one of the pastors at the church I attend. He places a ladder under a video screen that has a tree projected onto it. He climbs the ladder, reaches up to the video "tree" and plucks fruit off of it. He then comes down the ladder, bites into his piece of fruit, and throws the other out into the congregation.
Gahndi has a quote about Christians being so unChristlike. I wish I could remember it so you could use that too.
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Off topic
No. The pastor is offering a sermon in a series called "Thrive." It's about not just surviving in the world, but... "thriving." He's planning on using the illusion over the Labor day weekend. You can see it for yourself at live.jfc.org If you watch, it's my first stage illusion. Let me know what you think.
/Off topic
dude, don't worry about it. First, those are just empty words. Second, what do women know? That's right, NOTHING!
Respect is earned, not given freely.
Respect your magic. Show respect for what you do, and it will (usually) be repaid in kind.
If you perform tricks and stunts, you can expect disrespect, even if it's not polite - you have given no importance or meaning to what you perform. Perhaps you have not shown mastery. Perhaps you have failed to be as strong of a character as you think you are - and consequently have failed to break the stereotype of a magician. If you ever make fun of a spectator... You have failed to respect your magic - instead, you use it as a tool to prove your social worth - no wonder people don't respect you, or magic. If you use it to lash out - if you perform challenge or puzzle orientated magic - ditto.
If you wonder why someone can make fun of your magic and withdraw to their serious collection of Hello Kitty memorabilia... It's because they give importance to the latter, but none to the former. Why should they? You have failed to show the importance of magic.
If your best friend worked for 2 years to bring a stage production to life... Would you disrespect them so casually?
What about if they showed you a book they'd been writing for the past six months?
Compare this to someone showing you a trick.
If people see your magic as something they can disrespect... Maybe the problem isn't with them.
Respect your magic. Show respect for what you do, and it will (usually) be repaid in kind.
If you perform tricks and stunts, you can expect disrespect, even if it's not polite - you have given no importance or meaning to what you perform. Perhaps you have not shown mastery. Perhaps you have failed to be as strong of a character as you think you are - and consequently have failed to break the stereotype of a magician. If you ever make fun of a spectator... You have failed to respect your magic - instead, you use it as a tool to prove your social worth - no wonder people don't respect you, or magic. If you use it to lash out - if you perform challenge or puzzle orientated magic - ditto.
If you wonder why someone can make fun of your magic and withdraw to their serious collection of Hello Kitty memorabilia... It's because they give importance to the latter, but none to the former. Why should they? You have failed to show the importance of magic.
If your best friend worked for 2 years to bring a stage production to life... Would you disrespect them so casually?
What about if they showed you a book they'd been writing for the past six months?
Compare this to someone showing you a trick.
If people see your magic as something they can disrespect... Maybe the problem isn't with them.
I second the idea of handing the spectator the deck when they say how a moves done. It gets good laughs from everyone around and usually puts a stop to them trying to call you out.
As for the first pot, I've never had much disrespect at school. People seem to really enjoy magic. Once, some kid tried to grab the cards out of my hands and creased the corner of one of them. (They were S&M too) Almost the whole class that was watching got crappy with him and basically were on my side. Haven't had anything pulled out of my hands since. Other than that, I've had people guessing at the sleights. But surprisingly enough for teenagers, they come up to me afterwards and ask so no one else hears. Like someone before me said, it really depends on how you carry and project yourself and your magic.
One thing though, and honestly I can't believe no one else has said this yet. Those of you who are chastising and ignoring the "popular" kids, you're being just as bad as they are for ignoring people out of their group. It's the same exact thing, just in reverse. Try performing for them sometime, you'll be surprised. I'm good friends with girls like that and I can tell you they are some of the best spectators. Very good reactions, they don't heckle, and they're very obedient audience members. They want to see the magic, not catch you out.
As for the first pot, I've never had much disrespect at school. People seem to really enjoy magic. Once, some kid tried to grab the cards out of my hands and creased the corner of one of them. (They were S&M too) Almost the whole class that was watching got crappy with him and basically were on my side. Haven't had anything pulled out of my hands since. Other than that, I've had people guessing at the sleights. But surprisingly enough for teenagers, they come up to me afterwards and ask so no one else hears. Like someone before me said, it really depends on how you carry and project yourself and your magic.
One thing though, and honestly I can't believe no one else has said this yet. Those of you who are chastising and ignoring the "popular" kids, you're being just as bad as they are for ignoring people out of their group. It's the same exact thing, just in reverse. Try performing for them sometime, you'll be surprised. I'm good friends with girls like that and I can tell you they are some of the best spectators. Very good reactions, they don't heckle, and they're very obedient audience members. They want to see the magic, not catch you out.
I think it also depends on your general life besides magic. For example there is this guy that is kinda anoying sometimes when he performs and all what he does is do magic. All the time. Literally.
People actually don't know his name and most of them call him "magio" just to remember him, but a lot of them make fun of him. Why? because of his obsessive behaviour of doing magic EVERY SINGLE TIME.
People disses magic because they are like "ohhh that's his way of calling out attention".
Sorry if I ofend anyone here, but a lot of magicians can't entertein or can feel comfortable with people if they are not doing magic. These kind of people are the ones that get disrespected for using magic as a clutch for their social akwardness.
And of course there are the type that Nikki described
. People that are just jealous and what not. And that feel good about themselves when they talk dirty about another person.
And of course there are the type that TC commented. The ones that jsut say those things because they are trying to get to you in a way or another.
People actually don't know his name and most of them call him "magio" just to remember him, but a lot of them make fun of him. Why? because of his obsessive behaviour of doing magic EVERY SINGLE TIME.
People disses magic because they are like "ohhh that's his way of calling out attention".
Sorry if I ofend anyone here, but a lot of magicians can't entertein or can feel comfortable with people if they are not doing magic. These kind of people are the ones that get disrespected for using magic as a clutch for their social akwardness.
And of course there are the type that Nikki described
. People that are just jealous and what not. And that feel good about themselves when they talk dirty about another person.And of course there are the type that TC commented. The ones that jsut say those things because they are trying to get to you in a way or another.
[R.C];321994 said:
i agree with your statement about the popular girls being great spectators. One time I did a trick for a popular girl, I did a quick color change into her card and she screamed and started to cry a little. I mean, mostly, the stuck up snotty girls do like magic too, cause they ask all the time, but they still think they are better than you, they just have no explanation why or how they are, which is exactly why they aren't better than you. So you just cant let them get to you, I guess
Chopper makes a valid point and is correct about the guy who "always" has to perform and "always" has a deck on him. That will definitely get you made fun. Even my wife and brother make fun of me sometimes when I am practicing a bit too much. At some point in time you need to show that you can go places, hang out and NOT perform. Be human and enjoy other things outside the magic world.
A few other people made comments about the particular age group and high schoolers still finding out who they are and what paths of life they want to head down. I was always the good looking jock, smart, and could fire away one liners at people like nobody's business. I liked to make fun of people back then and make the girls all laugh. Back then I hadn't even started magic so I can't relate to you high school magicians who are dealing with the guys that I once was.
I didn't do magic at all until college and even then I kept it to myself and didn't do much for fear of my fraternity brothers making fun of me.
I think now as an adult, people see me performing professionally and see how good I have become and nobody is laughing at all. Sure I still get the occasional slam by some of my guy buddies but I know it is just in good fun and they think it is cool because the minute I am at one of their houses...they want me to show off some effects.
I understand Danny how you must have felt. I probably would have been upset as well. I think it would have been a great idea to shadow him and learn from him as well.
I think it would be great for someone like Josh Jay who became who he is now by starting out way back in high school to post his thoughts on dealing with disrespect while trying to learn the craft at an early age.
A few other people made comments about the particular age group and high schoolers still finding out who they are and what paths of life they want to head down. I was always the good looking jock, smart, and could fire away one liners at people like nobody's business. I liked to make fun of people back then and make the girls all laugh. Back then I hadn't even started magic so I can't relate to you high school magicians who are dealing with the guys that I once was.
I didn't do magic at all until college and even then I kept it to myself and didn't do much for fear of my fraternity brothers making fun of me.
I think now as an adult, people see me performing professionally and see how good I have become and nobody is laughing at all. Sure I still get the occasional slam by some of my guy buddies but I know it is just in good fun and they think it is cool because the minute I am at one of their houses...they want me to show off some effects.
I understand Danny how you must have felt. I probably would have been upset as well. I think it would have been a great idea to shadow him and learn from him as well.
I think it would be great for someone like Josh Jay who became who he is now by starting out way back in high school to post his thoughts on dealing with disrespect while trying to learn the craft at an early age.
[R.C];321994 said:
I disagree with just handing them the deck and saying "Go ahead try it.". Just because they can't do the move or a certain sleight doesn't mean they won't shut up. The best thing to do in that situation is to simply say "Nope." in a calm and confident voice and then proceed to move on.
As far as people who get disrespected by people for performing magic. It really depends. If you are just performing tricks to freak out your friends all the time. Then it gives off the feeling that you have nothing better to do and that you are a loser. I know this sounds like a dick thing to say, but it's true. if you are always carrying around your gimmicks, or cards, it just looks silly to most non magicians. It's one thing you are hired to perform at a party. But if you are walking around with all that stuff on you. You look like a complete tool.
Everybody keeps posting with the right idea, but these replies are a bit out of place. I'm not talking about giving tips on performing in HS and how you need to respect the art to get respect back. You guys are drawing your own conclusions for a reply.
Have you ever met someone who thought they were better than you for your career choice.
I appreciate all the good advice given, but I mainly posted this thread to hear similar horror stories and how you handled the situation.
I know of 2 artists that shared stories with me that had my jaw dropped and I was wondering if any of the members here had any similar thing happen to them where they were completely disrespected and didn't even know how to handle it.
Thanks.
And Rick, I wish I shadowed him too, but sadly I let her get the best of me.
Have you ever met someone who thought they were better than you for your career choice.
I appreciate all the good advice given, but I mainly posted this thread to hear similar horror stories and how you handled the situation.
I know of 2 artists that shared stories with me that had my jaw dropped and I was wondering if any of the members here had any similar thing happen to them where they were completely disrespected and didn't even know how to handle it.
Thanks.
And Rick, I wish I shadowed him too, but sadly I let her get the best of me.
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Well I didn't go through the entire thread, and read every post, so this probably has been said before...
I'm still in school (8th grade), and when people hear I do magic, they think I'm stupid and/or a nerd... That maybe could also be because I admit, I am what many people could call a nerd, but that doesn't matter... People don't even see my magic, and immediately think that I'm weird... But ok, I'm different... So?
I think this happens because of the over-exposure of magic... People think that if they do one trick, they can call themselves a magician... And they do... And now, the average Joe thinks that I am just like those other guys they have seen, and that I only know one simple trick everyone knows...
On the other hand, sometimes people are quite enthusiastic when they hear I'm a magician... It differs from people to people... And usually from the person's personality, you can figure out if they would like it or not...
Now, I don't really publicize too much in my school that I do magic... You would rarely find me calling myself a magician... I have a good story though about my magic experiences in school... It's rather funny what people will think in their imaginative brains...
I love doing Spin by Matt Sconce in school every now and then... People bring regular bottles all the time, and pens are a common object in schools... I just take someone's bottle, or bring my own, and freak people out.... This one girl, after seeing it, started screaming and freaking out, during break... Since then, she has constantly been wanting to see it, and telling everyone else to watch... She thinks I'm a leprechaun... And she wants me to take her to my pot of gold... LOL
Anyways... yeah...
Rupayan
I'm still in school (8th grade), and when people hear I do magic, they think I'm stupid and/or a nerd... That maybe could also be because I admit, I am what many people could call a nerd, but that doesn't matter... People don't even see my magic, and immediately think that I'm weird... But ok, I'm different... So?
I think this happens because of the over-exposure of magic... People think that if they do one trick, they can call themselves a magician... And they do... And now, the average Joe thinks that I am just like those other guys they have seen, and that I only know one simple trick everyone knows...
On the other hand, sometimes people are quite enthusiastic when they hear I'm a magician... It differs from people to people... And usually from the person's personality, you can figure out if they would like it or not...
Now, I don't really publicize too much in my school that I do magic... You would rarely find me calling myself a magician... I have a good story though about my magic experiences in school... It's rather funny what people will think in their imaginative brains...
I love doing Spin by Matt Sconce in school every now and then... People bring regular bottles all the time, and pens are a common object in schools... I just take someone's bottle, or bring my own, and freak people out.... This one girl, after seeing it, started screaming and freaking out, during break... Since then, she has constantly been wanting to see it, and telling everyone else to watch... She thinks I'm a leprechaun... And she wants me to take her to my pot of gold... LOL
Anyways... yeah...
Rupayan
Well I didn't go through the entire thread, and read every post, so this probably has been said before...
I'm still in school (8th grade), and when people hear I do magic, they think I'm stupid and/or a nerd... That maybe could also be because I admit, I am what many people could call a nerd, but that doesn't matter... People don't even see my magic, and immediately think that I'm weird... But ok, I'm different... So?
I think this happens because of the over-exposure of magic... People think that if they do one trick, they can call themselves a magician... And they do... And now, the average Joe thinks that I am just like those other guys they have seen, and that I only know one simple trick everyone knows...
On the other hand, sometimes people are quite enthusiastic when they hear I'm a magician... It differs from people to people... And usually from the person's personality, you can figure out if they would like it or not...
Now, I don't really publicize too much in my school that I do magic... You would rarely find me calling myself a magician... I have a good story though about my magic experiences in school... It's rather funny what people will think in their imaginative brains...
I love doing Spin by Matt Sconce in school every now and then... People bring regular bottles all the time, and pens are a common object in schools... I just take someone's bottle, or bring my own, and freak people out.... This one girl, after seeing it, started screaming and freaking out, during break... Since then, she has constantly been wanting to see it, and telling everyone else to watch... She thinks I'm a leprechaun... And she wants me to take her to my pot of gold... LOL
Anyways... yeah...
Rupayan
I hate how in this world, one person is unique and everyone doesnt like that person for whatever reason. This is a big reason why I quit football. Three years ago, when I quit football to have more time for magic, I also had the thought in my mind, that I didnt want to be this clone. Almost all football players I know are all the same, cocky, big, ignorant, and condescending. I didnt wanna be that, I wanted to be me. And if I get ridiculed for that, then, well...oh well, im still gonna be myself and do what I love.
Ive been made fun of constantly by a couple people that im friends with. Magic is not a normal hobby or passion and that is why it is unique but also a very easy target. Ive been in the middle of a trick and one of the girls i know just came over, grabbed the deck and threw it on the ground. There were laughs from her friends and i just turned away, picked up my cards, and to show it didnt even bother me i continued the trick and finished with even a bigger reaction because there is no way i was supposed to find the cards after they were mixed by the deck being thrown. When she came by me later i just said to her "really? you have nothing better to do than to make someone else look bad? you obviously dont feel very good about yourself if you need to make other people feel bad to make yourself feel good." and she was just speechless. The point is dont let it bother you. You are better than anyone that is going to make fun of you because people that make fun of others for being unique are usually very boring and are not gonna get anywhere in life.
Uh… … … … I'm a girl.
ANYWAYS… I have run into a few uber Christians at school. For some raison they are all 8th graders and their voices are like Justin Biebers. Anyway, my friend isn't very supportive at all, every once in a YEAR she says "oh that's cool" and then noting, she raids my fridge and steals my internet. I am also a serious novel writer she is even more unsupportive of that. A lot of people at my school already don't like me for being different and dressing a bit like a guy while I am a girl (I live in Malibu so that explains that). So when I do magic I get a lot of heckling. I don't care though because as much as there are hecklers in my group of spectators thankfully there are a few more spectators that are going nuts over the effects. I don't like to embarrass hecklers I like others to. I think it is the only way they grow, well… the quickest. Right, the second when someone heckles I stop, even if I am midway of a trick, I step back and sit down or stay aloof. I just shut down and since I do it right when they heckle. The spectators who like the magic get mad at the heckler or the person who gives disrespect. They teach him the lesson instead of me. The good spectators generally come over and ask for me to do magic again. I explain to them that I don't do magic for attention but when I do a trick everyone smiles or laughs and has fun. That is why I do magic and I tell them that so they know. That way they are 100% on my side. The word even gets around and they tell others who talk bad about me and I get more people on my side so they can have more fun and I can have fun performing and making them happy.
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Ok, some cold water here...
Most all of the Variety Arts such as magic, juggling, balancing acts, etc. are looked down on. Just watch the sit-coms on Tv and see how many times they paint magicians as geeks & losers. Same goes for puppeteers/ventriloquists, jugglers, various circus performer types, etc. UNLESS you are exceptionally good and too, 'recognized' and even at that "fame" is a fleeting bird and positive acceptance of you as a variety performer is only on-going for as long as you can perpetuate your novelty.
David Copperfield cornered the market for two decades but then David Blaine came along and stole his thunder followed quickly by Criss Angel... the two new up and coming personalities that gave magic the same sort of jolt David did in the mid and late 70s. Yet, today we have magicians that demean David, calling him "that old guy that does corny material" (as I heard on one popular forum). But even the laity has seemingly forgotten the guy that was king of the hill for a generation.
How many of you here, look at how magic has been traditionally done for over a century, a laugh? How many of you mock it because it wasn't as edgy and slick as the material you are enthralled by in today's world?
Maybe not all of you, but there is still a large number of young people with this very point of view; individuals that have bought into the delusion that magic can and should be done anywhere and to anyone. I'm referring to the trend of Guerrilla street "magic" and pseudo-hypnosis and how such performers display an utter lack of respect when it comes to the people they "jump out at" and more or less force into witnessing your stuff... which probably isn't very good to begin with... has been done on Tv already... and has nothing to do with what those poor victims of yours had in mind when it came to their plans that afternoon.
Sorry, but even buskers of old gave people their personal space and because of this RESPECT they were given a bit of it back. The same with magic; be respectful of others, respect the craft itself and most importantly, respect yourself enough to take pride in your appearance, demeanor and means of expression.
There is a reason why magicians popular with the public, are seen as honorable, educated and dignified individuals and true "Gentlemen" and "Ladies". But then anyone with such decorum will be given respect by those they interact with.
One Last Note... magicians are typically seen as a "filler act" when it comes to what producers "need" in fleshing out a program. It is exceptionally rare that the magician is viewed as a "star" even though promoters will make mention of our participation in an event, in order to gain the child solicitation element; the nagging of children to their parents about going to see the magician... it works!
Most all of the Variety Arts such as magic, juggling, balancing acts, etc. are looked down on. Just watch the sit-coms on Tv and see how many times they paint magicians as geeks & losers. Same goes for puppeteers/ventriloquists, jugglers, various circus performer types, etc. UNLESS you are exceptionally good and too, 'recognized' and even at that "fame" is a fleeting bird and positive acceptance of you as a variety performer is only on-going for as long as you can perpetuate your novelty.
David Copperfield cornered the market for two decades but then David Blaine came along and stole his thunder followed quickly by Criss Angel... the two new up and coming personalities that gave magic the same sort of jolt David did in the mid and late 70s. Yet, today we have magicians that demean David, calling him "that old guy that does corny material" (as I heard on one popular forum). But even the laity has seemingly forgotten the guy that was king of the hill for a generation.
How many of you here, look at how magic has been traditionally done for over a century, a laugh? How many of you mock it because it wasn't as edgy and slick as the material you are enthralled by in today's world?
Maybe not all of you, but there is still a large number of young people with this very point of view; individuals that have bought into the delusion that magic can and should be done anywhere and to anyone. I'm referring to the trend of Guerrilla street "magic" and pseudo-hypnosis and how such performers display an utter lack of respect when it comes to the people they "jump out at" and more or less force into witnessing your stuff... which probably isn't very good to begin with... has been done on Tv already... and has nothing to do with what those poor victims of yours had in mind when it came to their plans that afternoon.
Sorry, but even buskers of old gave people their personal space and because of this RESPECT they were given a bit of it back. The same with magic; be respectful of others, respect the craft itself and most importantly, respect yourself enough to take pride in your appearance, demeanor and means of expression.
There is a reason why magicians popular with the public, are seen as honorable, educated and dignified individuals and true "Gentlemen" and "Ladies". But then anyone with such decorum will be given respect by those they interact with.
One Last Note... magicians are typically seen as a "filler act" when it comes to what producers "need" in fleshing out a program. It is exceptionally rare that the magician is viewed as a "star" even though promoters will make mention of our participation in an event, in order to gain the child solicitation element; the nagging of children to their parents about going to see the magician... it works!
Well, your choice, just depends on whether you want everyone to confirm that everyone has made mistakes, or whether you want to actually do anything about it.
There's nothing to do about it now, as I said it happened three years ago.
I'd like to hear similar stories not to confirm that everyone has made mistakes, but to hear what they did about the situation themselves that way history doesn't repeat itself.
We can all learn from everyone's mistakes.
I've never had someone attempt to do this because I was a magician, but I have been ridiculed (back in the day) and I have some insight (probably helpful, since I'm out of high school and in the real world now).
I thought about it and I only have on piece of advice, one that my best friends dad said one day:
"If people are hating on you, you're probably doing something right..."
Nikki said it best when she mentioned most people who attempt to belittle people are only playing on their own insecurities, if they see something they envy they immediately make fun of it to feel better about themselves.
And I'll end on this note:
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."
-Eleanor Roosevelt
I thought about it and I only have on piece of advice, one that my best friends dad said one day:
"If people are hating on you, you're probably doing something right..."
Nikki said it best when she mentioned most people who attempt to belittle people are only playing on their own insecurities, if they see something they envy they immediately make fun of it to feel better about themselves.
And I'll end on this note:
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."
-Eleanor Roosevelt