May 2009 :: YouTube : Angel or Demon

Discussion in 'Cerca Trova' started by d+M, May 4, 2009.

  1. I personally find youtube to be a great resource, and a terrible detriment to the magic community. I have seen my share of terrible videos there, but I've also learned some great effects from some equally great teachers. For example I learned Dia Vernon's Twisted Aces from an amazing teacher on youtube. I've also seen my share of the classic "kid revealing magic" videos.

    If there were more good magicians on youtube doing good tricks, it wouldn't be so bad. I just finished a summer-long job at a theme park doing magic for people and I never once heard the old "i saw that on youtube" but there were plenty of people willing to look it up later (luckily I never say the name of my effects). I also saw many people who bought magic kits or books that seemed ready to take on the challenge. I think it's a beautiful thing when someone is willing to take the challenge and learn magic, but I also think it's a terrible thing when people are looking for secrets on youtube that they'll never use.

    My verdict is that youtube is both a good thing and a bad thing. I also think it depends on what videos you see.
     
  2. Angel or demon? MSU physicist explains why antimatter matters

    EAST LANSING, Mich. — Elusive in nature but the power behind many a science fiction plot, antimatter materializes again in the motion picture adaptation of Dan Brown’s novel “Angels and Demons,” opening in theaters Friday.
    Antimatter isn’t fiction. Nor is the place from where the Tom Hanks/Ron Howard movie’s conspirators steal the stuff, to settle an ancient grudge against the Vatican. One might forgive the casual viewer for believing it a danger to humanity.
    Not so, says Michigan State University physicist Raymond Brock. Brock is an experimental high-energy physicist who studies the properties of fundamental matter and energy. Noted for his captivating science lectures, Brock will treat the public to a discussion of antimatter following a showing of the movie May 20 in Lansing.
    http://www.uggbootsspeichern.com/
    "The line between reality and fiction in Dan Brown's books and films is blurry, yet the locations and concepts are sometimes close enough to real life to require his readers to work hard in order to isolate the factual," Brock said. "Antimatter and the European Organization for Nuclear Research, or CERN, are very real, but the collection and manipulation of antimatter, while a great story, falls on the fiction side of that line."
     
  3. Youtube is what started me in magic. I watched a video the blew me away. On the related videos was a tutorial. The guy doing the tutorial was horrible. But, he did explain the effect. That tutorial motivated me to go purchase some decks of cards and practice the effect. After I got the same reaction from a complete stranger as the day I watched that first video I was hooked. I know actively support magicians by buying their products.

    The truth is out there...if someone wants to know how an effect is accomplished they can search it out. But, imo, by searching it out...they are expending their time to learn something. There is a huge difference in someone doing leg work to gain knowledge, then sitting down in front of the TV and being spoon fed magic reveals.

    I completely agree with what was said earlier "guns don't kill people, people kill people...Youtube doesn't expose magic, kids expose magic."
     
  4. It's a bittersweet kind of thing.
    The negative side should not be blamed solely on youtube; it's the people on youtube revealing the tricks. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. Youtube doesn't expose magic, kids expose magic.
     
  5. One thing If i could suggest to A LOT of magicians out there in youtube land is.. posting a video is not a way to practice! thats what a mirror is for. There used to be rules in magic. You used to never show a trick twice. You used to never reveal the secret, and you used to NEVER do a trick until its mastered. Your videos are not performances. When I was a kid, i knew tricks how to do tricks too. Just knowing how theyre done doesnt make anyone a magician. Being able to perform a trick makes you a magician. Being able to perform it well can make you an artist.

    Please guys, dont post a trick it until you can fool the mirror. Until then..its not ready.

    for those of you doing just that. Kudos. Long live the rules.
     
  6. "land mines dont kill people, people who dont watch where theyre walking kill people"
     
  7. Land mines don't kill people, people who bury land mines do...


    I think I've said it at least once, but exposure, while it does seem to hurt the creator...it doesn't. I understand that buying from a creator does profit them and in essence make their livelihood, that's great, it's why I buy from magicians websites before wholesalers if possible-and from lectures instead of internet when applicable.

    With that said, someone who is going to scrounge for tutorials on youtube isn't going to go and spend money on magic anyway. They aren't going to all of a sudden buy magic just because they're told it's the right thing to do, and the creator isn't going to profit off of them anyway. If someone has tutorials, and learns a bit of magic, they very well could become a magician who respects the art and begins purchasing effects. That's a good thing, and what if they never would have started in magic if they couldn't learn a few tricks for free?

    Should we bash someone for wanting to learn magic but not be disappointed (as many magicians are) by buying a trick and then finding out the method is impractical. Should we be worried about kiddies 'ruining' magic by posting tutorials, or creators ruining magic by putting out illogical, self-centered, impractical one trick DVD's and then hyping them up?
     
  8. Many of the new magicians started of from Youtube. They searched for tutorials and learn some tricks. But after a while some of them just got bored of Youtube tutorial and think "Hey I want to perform something more powerful" and they started buy some books, DVDs, etc.

    In conclusion Youtube exposures/tutorial bad for magicians. But think Youtube also 'create' many of creative artist (I should say) that interested in the art form.

    Exposure in spectator's point of view, they know the secrets after a while maybe some of them may just forget the trick and the method OR maybe they will get interested in magic and become one of us.

    Anyway that my opinion on this topic
    Cheers,
     
  9. for me.. youtube is just this place where all things go wrong. some guy creates a move and then a gaziliion would try to figure it out and post a tutorial for it (this applies for some other things besides magic). and right after, some magic amateurs try to do it themselves, they'd post a tutorial for it, and then others see the tutorial and make their own, and this domino effect goes on until you have this messy collection of tutorials for this single good move that everyone else does badly.

    seriously, how often can you find a magic enthusiast who can perform a move done by a professional just by looking at the performance? the only good i get from youtube is the performance of the person himself/herself who made the move originally. every other video posted after that move is either someone who really bought the trick, or someone who just wants to show off with their lousy attempt to imitate the move. we'd never know for sure, so the best bet is really to see the real thing.

    youtube is good because it gives you the privilege to share your work, but youtube is very terrible, not because your work has a risk of being exposed, but because other people will most likely expose your work for you.
     
  10. Youtube is a wonderful resource for the aspiring magician. It's something I wish I had when I was younger. It's a true example of the power of the internet. Magic is an art form that can only thrive through the passing on of these secrets.

    Now when we bought tricks ourselves and see them exposed on youtube for free, yes we might get angry. If we produced the trick ourselves I'm sure we'd be even angrier. BUT magic is only lost when the audience knows the secret, and what are the chances that your audience saw THAT specific youtube video. I've found that many of the exposed tricks are by name, and when performing most people don't know the "name" of a trick to look up.

    When I was young magic was expensive (still is) but it was hard to feed my passion. Youtube is a great outlet to feed aspiring magicians and keep them away from other more detrimental activities.

    *It's also nice to see alternative handlings and mistakes other people create so that you can try/avoid those things.
    *Also if theres a gimmick involved, it's a nice way to see how the gimmick plays with the audience point of view and whether or not the gimmick is worth buying. (I used Youtube to decide whether SMOKE was worth buying or if I should make one. I decided it was.)
     
  11. flourishing saved my life!!!!!!!! Even if they do find a tutorial on you tube no normal person has the patience like a flourisher!!!
     
  12. I think youtube also brought magic to whole another level in such a way.
     
  13. In regards to exposure; If 100% of all people knew how a double lift works, then another method must be devised, pushing this art, stirring it from its slumbering rest into the roaring beast that it should be. Ok, so you can find a lot of tutorials on YouTube for these things but surely being able to find out this information is important? It could help spur on someone who may have never thought twice about learning magic. If someone understands how it works they should be impressed by you not a move anyway. I’m sure a lot of people here understand at the very least a few basic principles of magic, but aren't you impressed when you see someone use these ideas in a clever way or some different take on it? Did it matter that you knew how it worked? Did you enjoy it less? I am constantly astonished at things I didn't know you could do with moves I already knew, and equally astonished at other methods at achieving the same effect (Venus trap; who needs your silly old double lift?).

    What’s the difference between magicians and lay people anyway? We are no better than them and shouldn't withhold information from them, but instead allow them enough rope to seek out the path. If they have a genuine interest then they will follow it if they don't then they may figure out one or two sleights. If you’re worried that these people will see through your extremely clever charade, you need to practice more (I’d recommend Youtube, for its excellent tutorials…).

    It seems that the point here is more to do with the belief the spectator holds for your performance rather than the revelation of some modus operandi. Anyone who thinks magic is real in a very literal sense is as misguided as someone who believes mediums can communicate with their dead relatives, and anyone wanting to convince their audience of such is as cruel and twisted as any ‘psychic’. I perform tricks to entertain and baffle people, not to mislead them into false beliefs. Magic is not a religion; it is a state of mind where you can't make sense of what you have just experienced. I would feel like a bit of a sh*t if someone went away thinking that I can actually physically make one cards face change into another in a supernatural manner. This is promoting magic in the wrong vain and purely for your own ego as far as I can work out. Its entertainment, don't over complicate it. If someone asks me 'how did you do that?’ I would only ever answer with '...magic!' in a purely tongue in cheek fashion. I may even show them a very simple trick involving maths, depending on their level of interest and enthusiasm. If people are immediately cursing me for such a thing, get over it! Its just a trick! Its not real, and people should expect a method (why would they ask 'how did you do that?' otherwise?), other than the paranormal or supernatural, and you shouldn't try to convince them thats it is 100% genuine. Don’t you remember Uri Geller? Oh… you don’t.

    Concerns about exposure on tricks seem to be a bit silly. Unless, you created the trick and sell it as a living, the only other reason for concern is the fact that someone got something for free that you didn’t. Get over it.

    I’ve had laymen astound me with some bar trick, who will happily show me how it’s done after a few demonstrations. Is the difference then the label you apply to yourself when you make the decision to say, 'I am a magician. What I do is achieved through magic.'? Maybe, if we didn't have to lie so much to our spectators then we wouldn't feel so bad if they realised it wasn't magic. Because, the biggest disappointment is ours, as we haven’t convincingly lied to them.
    Maybe we shouldn’t take it so seriously. It’s only magic.
     
  14. My thoughts on YouTube are, and this may have been said before, that it is a two sided coin. On one side you have the good: it gets many magicians started, it helps magicians find tricks they want, and it allows magicians to share ideas from the safety of their home. On the other hand: TRICKS ARE REVEALED, but that just means that we have to stay on top of the acclaimed "trend curve." Basically: we have to stay ahead of those people on YouTube trying to reveal the secrets of magic. And if the layman you are preforming for knows what you are doing, do what you would do if you were trying to fool your fellow magicians, chances are, they don't know what you're doing. Another thing YouTube won't teach is the complex art of misdirection. In short, if you utilize that one vital tool, YOU CAN FOOL ANYBODY!!! It's that simple, plus all the people attempting to reveal magic on YouTube have TERRIBLE showmanship (that is just going to those that are trying to reveal magic, and I am not saying I have the best showmanship because frankly, I suck) and in watching the bad showmanship, the layman gets the idea that that is how the move must be done, so if people add their own flare to their magic, they can fool those people whom have attempted to beat you at your game. Take Dan and Dave Buck for example, they have a very flourishy style, and if you were to see one of their double lifts, it would be hard to identify it as a double lift because they put themselves into it.

    I'm sorry for the disorganized format,
    TJ
     
  15. I try to make up all of the tricks that I do, Im mostly a sleight of hand guy, mostly cards a bit of coin work and (believe it or not) A close up one billiard ball routine. So if anyone looks up on youtube or the internet how I do it, which noone does because deep down they dont want the magic to be spoiled because that is what people want, to question reality, Anyway, Even if they tried looking up on the tube how I do it, they would fail miserably. I think what magicians should be concerned with is our image as either Childrens Entertainment or Criss Angel/David Blaine emotionless clones, with no middle ground, at least to the public. But that is another topic entirely....
     
  16. I think presentation is the key here.
     
  17. May 2009 YouTube Angel or Demon

    The angel/demon piece is great Cant stop staring at it...

    I agree with a person above, the "hope" piece looks burned out as it is.
     
  18. #78 Rolando, Jul 22, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 22, 2011
    I think YouTube is great. It not only gives magicians the opportunity to advertise and promote themselves, but also makes it easier for them to view and share videos of other magicians. If you get past the ignorant people posting pointless videos, you can find many great (and rare) magic performances. Of course, there is a downside to YouTube, as there is to most things. And the downside is: Exposure. Oddly, exposure has never really bothered me. Exposure is bigger now than it ever was, mostly thanks to video-sharing sites. Exposure has been around since the mid 1800's, probably even before then, but it hasn't really hurt the art of magic. Emphasis on the word "art". That's what makes magic entertainment. Laymen can reveal all our greatest secrets and gimmicks, but out biggest secret (the true art behind the performance) is something that can't ever be revealed.
    What's the real reason that exposure doesn't bother me? Simple. Laymen don't think like magicians. For example, if I were to reveal to a laymen how to execute a d**ble l*ft, they would understand the workings of this treasured device used by magicians. However, if I were to perform the Ambitious card for that same person the next day, they would be amazed. Why? Because laymen don't think like magicians. Simply because they aren't educated in our field of work. And they don't apply methods to effects. Simple as that. That's my own opinion.
     
  19. My little sister wants to see the video of Criss Angel disguised as pregnant crissy and I can't find it on youtube, how do I find it?
     
  20. My Quick Opinion

    The amount of exposure on YouTube is way to high. There are people who do a ridiculous amounts of exposure videos. These people are usually more like HowCast, which teaches the tricks that nobody really does, at least on the professional level. Then there are people like Mismag822, who does a lot of videos and decent effects. I have seen a lot of his videos, and in most cases he does original tricks and has the permission of the artist, but there are other tricks that I have seen on expensive videos or talked about in books that is just out there for free. This makes me very upset, because I always feel as if someone is ripping someone off.

    The times when I think that exposure is fine is when it is on the age old tricks that magicians are almost willing to hand out the effects because everyone knows them. These are things like Red Hot Mama, where they are known, by name, by people who do not even do magic. My personal rule is that if someone is still profiting off of an original version of the trick then it is not alright to expose. If this is not true, this is totally ok in my mind.
     

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