Repeating effects

[DannyT]

Last night I'm hanging out at a party and people wanted to see me perform. I perform of course, but every time I do tricks like changing the color of a back of a playing card or card to mouth (bucks), they always tend to bring someone over from another small crowd for them to see the trick.

Spec: "Do the one where the card ends up in your mouth."
Me thinking: Oh thank you, Thank You. Because I'm going to show that one now since you just gave away the ending.

How do I get myself out of these situations?
I hate repeating tricks and I try to move on with different ones, but after performing different effects, I still get hammered with, "Oh show her that one".

I don't know if it's the way I'm sequencing my routines or what. Maybe I should save certain tricks for the end, but that's the trick. You never know when your just done performing at a friends party.

Any advice would be great, especially for the tricks that I can't repeat even if I wanted to. Also I tried searching for so many titles about repeating effects, but couldn't find any. So my bad in advance.

 

[visualartist]

To them,they are shown as singular tricks. Since they are not presented as spur of the moment miracles,laymen get the idea that what one does can be repeated.

 

[joshrobarts]

well, for starters, your not a performing monkey, you dont have to do as they say and by establishing yourself as a legitimate performer you will slowly gain control over an audience. This comes with experience and time. But some basic tips are to mention that you will do it next time, giving them something to look forward to for a future time when you are ready or wish to perform this. Also, you can accentuate that if this person that has seen the trick before is there, you feel compelled to perform something new so they wont be bored. This shifts the focus and blame for a trick being not performed to an alternate source and makes you seem less like the bad guy who wont share his special gift. Also, if this is a group that you perform for more than once or regularly you can slowly curb their attitude towards you as a performer. I have a group that i perform for at the college, over time i have lowered the risk of this exact thing happened by doing one thing. When someone asks for a repeat, i simply reply that i wont or cant, i am going to do one final trick and then either leave or take a break. I usually have a closer saved up for this occasion, a powerful trick to go out on. I then perform the trick and either leave, or go get a drink or chill out. This gives everyone time to be amazed and talk about the finale etc. But it also gives them the subtle hint that you may leave if they ask for repeats. Next time should they ask you to repeat something do the same, and especially if they ask you to repeat the finale then mention how you always go out on it and if you perform it you will have to end the show there. Mostly its about audience control and establishing yourself as the one in charge and the performer, they are there to see you, they dont get to control you. Good luck

 

[penguincdude]

Well as you know, Card To Mouth is a pretty simple trick and there are TONS of ways to get into it. So if they ask you say maybe later and then after a few tricks perform Card To Mouth again but differently.

 

[SKSleighofHand]

I agreed with jrobarts05 and his statement because you need to control the audience and if you don't, they are taking advantage of you. Start off with a simple trick that hits very hard and laymen will get very impressed with the idea. Repeating the tricks is one of the sneaky ways that laymen can figure it out rather than based on your performance.

 

[uhhh_kyle]

I always have multiple ways of performing a trick, so if I get a request, I just nod my head to acknowledge them. Go into a different trick, then, when the time is right, do the requested trick, with a slight twist.

 

[RDChopper]

To them,they are shown as singular tricks. Since they are not presented as spur of the moment miracles,laymen get the idea that what one does can be repeated.

You are not going to get a better answer, I was just going to post something similar when I read that ^^, there is a difference between presenting your stuff as a trick, or as a effect.

 

[James Smith]

I had a thread about this, but it was more about spectators wanting to see the first effect they saw and no other ones:

http://forums.theory11.com/showthread.php?t=18248

I didn't get discussed much on here, but there was a lot of debate on the E forums:

http://forums.ellusionist.com/showthread.php?t=84517

 

[gambit13]

Think ahead

I sorta agree with the crowd control however i dont completely agree...We are here to entertain and noone can ever stop someone from saying oh do that one trick again. Its going to happen eventually. Second you cant just be like oh later because then they could be distracted from the magic that is going on at the moment because they cant wait to see the trick that was already performed. I am always in this situation and i dont take a rude nor a polite approach. What seems to work for me is deciding what tricks are appropriate (sorry if i spelled it wrong) for the time. I mean i dont sit and plan a routine everyday but as someone ask me to perform i conseder these kind of thing. Just upon them requesting what to see try to get a quick thought of something you can do multiply times without being caught because you have studied every move from that trick and understand how it works. Such tricks as the biddle trick or an eardnase change. They are very simply tricks yet with the right presentation can be performed multiple times and hit very hard. Well i hope this helped =)

 

[visualartist]

You are not going to get a better answer, I was just going to post something similar when I read that ^^, there is a difference between presenting your stuff as a trick, or as a effect.

Exactly,when I wrote that I was thinking you were gonna beat me to it for some reason.hah. Wierd.

To the OP,what were,if you can remember,your exact words when starting the trick and during?

 

[RDChopper]

Exactly,when I wrote that I was thinking you were gonna beat me to it for some reason.hah. Wierd.

To the OP,what were,if you can remember,your exact words when starting the trick and during?

There is another thing to notice here, the tricks he mentioned use cards, ( I use them all the time) and it's cool, but depending on how you are presenting the effects, the memories will be different for spectators.

Now, You guys know me, I love cards, but if there is one thing that I dont like that much about cards its that, if the spectators see a trick of you with cards, first thing that will come to mind (after the reaction and the "Oh my god, how did he do that") will be: "it must be Sleight of hand, it always is".

Think about it, that's why one of our main goals is to think how can we make the effects more magical, witouth making them think that it was sleight of hand.

Good sleights exist for this reason, to make your effects more impossible looking, but that's only 30% of the work, the other 70% relies on your ability as a performer and as a lier.

So, if they had even the slim suspicion that its sleight of hand, they will of course ask you to perform the trick for them again, after all, its just sleight of hand isnt it?

 

[visualartist]

A very good point,I honestly love card techniques and cheating.Heck, I even gamble.I just detest the way most magicians present them and do effects with them.
Its always "hey let me show you something..pick a card" ugh. There is no Drama,nothing to interest them other than a small spectacle. And of course,like RDC said,sleight of hand is the first thing to pop in their head so they KNOW you can do it again,which is why they ask.
Performers never give them enough reason to doubt.

 

[DannyT]

Thanks for the replies guys, some were helpful.
It could be that my presentation was lacking on card to mouth, so it wasn't really treated as an effect. I didn't dress it up as much as I should have.

Penguincdude - that didn't work for me because when I tried to move on to different tricks, they keep asking about card to mouth as soon as I'm done with it. Maybe my "moving on" tricks aren't strong enough to keep their attention.

Jrobarts05 - What *good* books would you recommend me checking out for gaining control over an audience? I thought I knew, but maybe not as much as I should know.

Visualartist & RDChopper - What turns a trick into an effect is the presentation behind it. Here's my question: Does every trick need to be treated as effects? Some specs get bored with presentation, and it happens to me every so often.
They go from, "Let me see a trick" to staring at someone else at the party doing something after picking a card (that's way before I even say anything).
I usually just say, "Hey, shows over here" and go on, but not going into full presentation and just doing the trick itself. How do you guys keep focus on the effect?
Thanks for all the replies guys.

 

[visualartist]

The answer for me,is a big Duh.Without presentation or anything to interest them.
You say some specs get bored with presentation,dont you think it means THAT certain presentation was boring?
Im not telling you to drown them in a script. A bunch of subtleties add spectator interests in effects.
And again,whats with just doing endless card tricks? That may work when your doing card tricks for a friend for a minor distraction,but that is not going to get you paid or keep a crowd interested at a party.

 

[DannyT]

A bunch of subtleties add spectator interests in effects.

Explain this to me.

 

[visualartist]

Explain this to me.

ok,a runthrough.
The card that most magicians play when performing magic with cards is the "arent I clever" card. Just a hey let me show you a trick manner with nothing to commit the spectator to actually watch you and very little to no connection with that spectator.

"close-up magic consists of walking up to a group of people and entertaining them for 5 minutes,and it doesnt consist with you walking up to them with a pack of cards and showing them how clever you are".
-Fay Presto

That was the type of card effect you did.
Thats pretty much all the card to mouth is,really. And since no,i assume,words were used to interest them like "do you play cards much...?", "do you know that concept of perception?" or whatever.Most card effects in general are about how clever the magician is.They are all different ways to find a selected card. And the magician most of the time is just going through the motions of the trick.
And by subtleties I mean how you hold the cards,how much you look at the eyes of a spectator,not rushing through the darn effect like I see so many people do.That in itself makes them think,"well this guy just goes through tons of tricks,he can do it again".
You actually answered your own question earlier about them shown as effects not tricks.If you present them as tricks,they will ask you to do it again.Especially if they see you as a boy who's clever with cards.

 

[OneCardWonder]

In my experience most of the time when performing, if someone says something like, "Oh......(Insert name here) would love to see that one" what they really mean is, "if I see that again I'll be able to figure it out, so I want to see it again."

It happens to everyone on occasion. (Even the likes of David Blaine isn't immune. Too many videos to mention have people asking him to perform again, but the most obvious being his performance with Philippe Petite, and the guy at the end of the video saying, "Let me do what he just did.") The fact is, people know there is sleight of hand or a trick to magic. They assume that repetition of something baffling will result in them knowing the outcome of the trick, what you're going to do so they can defeat your misdirection and spot the method. Not everyone is like this, but you'll come across some people that are like that. You either find a way of not doing the trick again, or replicate the -effect- using a different method, which will baffle them anew. Either way the desire to see it again indicates they didn't see it the first time.

Sure you can delude yourself into thinking that most people can be convinced that magic is real, but its nonsense. I've seen some of the best performing magicians out there live, and sure, I've been out and out fooled by some, but I've never thought they were genuinely magical, and I can guarantee you that I've figured out some methods through watching a show more than once. More people in an audience think that way than you give them credit for.

It's your aim to create a moment of strong magic, strong astonishment, and the desire to see an effect again is a symptom of stumping someone. If you can generate an effect with multiple methods, you can be watched twice, performing the same effect, but with a totally different method, and some real strong alterations to how you present it and people will be convinced that they just have absolutely no clue how you've done it. It's why an ambitious card routine is so strong. In essence the effect is exactly the same over and over. A card comes to the top again and again and again, but the method is diverse for each repetition and allows ample room for presentation. So the audience in burning your hands at the points that they think would have caught you last time are misdirecting themselves for you, as you're now doing the same effect with a different method for the next part of the routine. Thus they miss the method and are stumped anew, and by the end they believe they've seen magic.

Basically, doing the same effect twice can lead to some powerful classics in magic. Altering the method for effects can result in repetitions, so if you do find yourself asked that a lot.....though I can't imagine it happens to you more than anyone else here, then remember the ambitious card routine analogy. Remember you can repeat an effect several times throughout a routine, and remember that it can, if done well lead to a more powerful experience for the spectator, which is what its all about.

And its not something particular to card magic either. You can be asked to repeat an effect with any prop in magic, and you should have a way of handling that situation also.