Are laymen really impressed?

[Guardian452]

When it comes to XCM?

i mean, a few shuffles or whatever i think is fine, but to me XCM, to a laymen is just juggling

wow, that looks really cool, this guy must have a lot of free time


magic seems as if something was given to the magician, not taught
XCM seems like it was taught or practiced


thoughts?

 

[AceOfSpades2662]

I agree people say to me wow you sit in your room practicin that all day?? And i don't I wish I had that kinda time though. But seriously My flourishing isn't for them if they don't appreciate it they may not understand it or not care. I do it for me its fun, An incredible art and I'm happy to be a part of it no matter what everyone else thinks.
Michael

 

[Justin.Morris]

heh. I would have to agree to an extent. It's okay to be a "juggler" of cards. But I think it can be a really elegant way of performing magic when you use XCM, like the Bucks teach.

So, magic without it is great, with it is also great, and XCM solo is also great.

(But if your trick stinks and you bore them with your XCM in between your "pick a card" and "tadda!", then that's no good.)

j

 

[sourboarder]

Flourishes

When it comes to flourishes and impressing the mass of the population I think it take quite a cut. A few come to mind, hot shot cut, it has a purpose, it's elegant, and cool to get added attention. Sick and twisted wings of the mockingbird by kev h. When i did this cut for my girlfriend she was astonished and she doesn't care either way about xcm. Also I only did like half of it cause the other half i don't know exactly what happens but I'm working on it. I feel that if it serves a purpose, or just breathe taking its a good idea to throw it in.

 

[UnknownEnemyZero]

Make a fan, ask the closet person to you if that fan is juggling.

The biggest miss conception is that XCM will detract from the act of magic. In reality if only adds to it. It shows your creditability as a performer and "master" of your art. It's hard to take a person who's fumbling with cards seriously at first. Look at Jay Sankey's Diehard Opener and he specifically uses a simple card selection control and hot shot cut to open up his routines. Establishes instant creditability. Sure those simple fancy cuts and shuffles don't get you much cause their not meant to wow the audience that much. Learn a one-hand riffle shuffle, learn how to do the no turnover down catch, and learn how to do a giant fan and believe me people love to see that stuff.

Not to mention there are several great attention getters: armspread no-turnover catch, long distance spinners, card boomerangs, long springs, overhead springs, REAL card juggling, etc. their all high amplitude moves that really occupy a lot of space and show great dexterity without you even saying a word.

Bottom line, the more you can perform the better. If you can do an overhead spring, a great ambitious card routine, do a 4 ace gambling expo, followed by juggling all 4 aces, then ending with some crazy impossible card transposition. There is no loss of creditability. HOWEVER this is given all of these are properly placed with a show and the presentation of each item.

 

[JackOSpadesNik]

your right with them thinking that it takes a lot of practice, but they still are iimpressed.

i was outside my classroom during passing period and was just flourishing while talking to someone and it soon made a small crowd. I had someone say, that must have taken a lot of practice, , but I still got WTH reactions.

I'm not that good either. Just know a couple cuts and displays.

I still prefer magic.

 

[BlueBackedBikes]

Absolutley. I don't know about you, but people just can;t take their eyes off of me when I'm doing multi-packet cuts (those are the kind of flourishes I do). They love it.

Still prefer magic, though.

 

[Guardian452]

unknown (he he, sounds funny to adresse you like that)

i understand what you mean, but im talking about doing "buck flourishes" not things like hotshot and a fan.

my question is, do magicians appreciate XCM more, if not A LOT more than laymen?
what will hold a crowd longer, all flourishes or tricks?
whats going to get a bigger crowd, Dan and Dave doing XCM, or Gazzo/ Michael Ammar doing a CNB routine?

if worked together than its beautiful, but XCM, to me is more of a "look what i can do that you cant" type of thing, im sure that there are different presentation techniques to make it not seem this way (as well as magic) but it seems as if XCM should only be incorporated into tricks with a reason like you described.

but to me just doing XCM is just juggling, at the end of watching someone do it, what can they connect with or take home?

 

[JackOSpadesNik]

unknown (he he, sounds funny to adresse you like that)

i understand what you mean, but im talking about doing "buck flourishes" not things like hotshot and a fan.

my question is, do magicians appreciate XCM more, if not A LOT more than laymen?
what will hold a crowd longer, all flourishes or tricks?
whats going to get a bigger crowd, Dan and Dave doing XCM, or Gazzo/ Michael Ammar doing a CNB routine?

if worked together than its beautiful, but XCM, to me is more of a "look what i can do that you cant" type of thing, im sure that there are different presentation techniques to make it not seem this way (as well as magic) but it seems as if XCM should only be incorporated into tricks with a reason like you described.

but to me just doing XCM is just juggling, at the end of watching someone do it, what can they connect with or take home?

Yes we do appreciate flourishes more because we know exactly how hard it is to pull of and practice. The know that it is hard, but most don't think about how long it took to learn,practice, get smooth, and how much money you spent on cards.

We do appreciate XCM and flourishing more, but we also appreciate everything else card related more (ex.magic, mentalism, juggling) because we know what it takes to pull it off. Sometimes the specs think you don't need any skill whatsoever to pull of a magic trick. I've had these types of people before and you just want to play Russian Roulette with their hand.

So we do appreciate flourishing more, but also everthing else.

 

[Guardian452]

i thought we did too when we were at the magic castle with my grandpa he said to me "i think you can take more magic than an average person"

 

[drorange]

i think the whole XCM thing is kinda dumb how they don't do any magic sure a spec might find it good but not as much as you do. The only people who you will entertain is other magicians at the end of the day if you show someone a flourish they will still ask to see a trick

 

[harapanong]

Oh please...

I am a magician, but don't say flourishes are "kinda dumb" and "just juggling" and "won't impress anyone" when you:

1. Haven't tried it yourself
2. Can't do it yourself
3. Can't get people to be impressed with your flourishes.

- harapan. magic!

 

[darosa.justin]

How can you say that it is dumb, a waste of time and whatever else you said.
Not meaning to be rude, but you probably have no clue of what flourishes really are.

If you dont know what you are talking about, please dont say anything.

Personally, I believe that flourishes are an amazing skill (to be able to do them well). They amaze me just as much as some tricks- it looks wonderful to watch.
So all you flourishers out there, dont stop!

[I am not a flourisher myself, though i do know what they are ]

 

[Justin.Morris]

Like I said before, XCM is entertaining in it's own right, with or without 'magic'. A magician does not need 'XCM' to look credible. I've never seen Burger whip out a XCM move...

I think magicians do appreciate it more because of reasons already stated.

That said, XCM can sometimes move too fast for someone to actually follow what is happening, and if you lose your spectator, you've lost your audience. It's no good to put a card in the deck, do a bunch of insane moves (that make the whole thing look fishy), and then say "tadda! I found your card!"

You may get grins and giggles from it, but if you lose your audience, then you might as well have stayed in your bedroom in front of your mirror.

As harapanong (abruptly) stated, you need to be impressing and entertaining people, not just showing off. If you just want to show off. Stay home. If you entertain, then go nuts!

And actually, XCM IS card juggling. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Look it up:

Juggling:
1. to keep (several objects, as balls, plates, tenpins, or knives) in continuous motion in the air simultaneously by tossing and catching.
2. to hold, catch, carry, or balance precariously; almost drop and then catch hold again: The center fielder juggled the ball but finally made the catch.
3. to alter or manipulate in order to deceive, as by subterfuge or trickery: to juggle the business accounts; to juggle the facts.
4. to manage or alternate the requirements of (two or more tasks, responsibilities, activities, etc.) so as to handle each adequately: to juggle the obligations of job and school.

j

 

[UnknownEnemyZero]

unknown (he he, sounds funny to adresse you like that)

i understand what you mean, but im talking about doing "buck flourishes" not things like hotshot and a fan.

my question is, do magicians appreciate XCM more, if not A LOT more than laymen?
what will hold a crowd longer, all flourishes or tricks?
whats going to get a bigger crowd, Dan and Dave doing XCM, or Gazzo/ Michael Ammar doing a CNB routine?

if worked together than its beautiful, but XCM, to me is more of a "look what i can do that you cant" type of thing, im sure that there are different presentation techniques to make it not seem this way (as well as magic) but it seems as if XCM should only be incorporated into tricks with a reason like you described.

but to me just doing XCM is just juggling, at the end of watching someone do it, what can they connect with or take home?

Of course magicians and people with skilled eyes will always notice more things than a laymen and react more to the little details of moves executed. I usually stay away from the buck style cause it focuses too much on impressing the community rather than impressing the laymen.

What can you take from it? The only thing you can take is just the appreciation and amazement of someone elses dexterity and hard work. The only way to get more people interested in pure manipulation is to go bigger and expand to more manipulation that is more visual and show more apparent difficulty. Some levels of XCM just do not do well to compete with other forms of magic, cause it's like apples to oranges, the mystery of an act VS the dexterity of someone.

Just like the tricks by themselves in magic won't make the magician. Same will go for the manipulation. Where's your presentation, what's your patter, what kind of person do you show yourself to be. I've already posted some ideas on these things like: Houdini's "Impossible" Double Armspread contraversy, the American Flag Fanning Deck story, Sam the Bellhop can incorporate a lot of flourishes into the routine, Real 3 Card Juggling gag, and Fatfingerz's Poker Night routine. People just can't think of this stuff cause no one else because theres only a few people in the world who've looked into it. Jerry Cestowski is probably the number one source for this kind of stuff cause he's a real world performer for XCM and does incorporate proper presetation but doesn't release all of his performing acts cause he doesn't want everyone doing his presentation and style of shows just like magicians who teach will always tell you to apply your own personality and storytelling to your OWN magic.

 

[Guardian452]

Of course magicians and people with skilled eyes will always notice more things than a laymen and react more to the little details of moves executed. I usually stay away from the buck style cause it focuses too much on impressing the community rather than impressing the laymen.

What can you take from it? The only thing you can take is just the appreciation and amazement of someone elses dexterity and hard work. The only way to get more people interested in pure manipulation is to go bigger and expand to more manipulation that is more visual and show more apparent difficulty. Some levels of XCM just do not do well to compete with other forms of magic, cause it's like apples to oranges, the mystery of an act VS the dexterity of someone.

Just like the tricks by themselves in magic won't make the magician. Same will go for the manipulation. Where's your presentation, what's your patter, what kind of person do you show yourself to be. I've already posted some ideas on these things like: Houdini's "Impossible" Double Armspread contraversy, the American Flag Fanning Deck story, Sam the Bellhop can incorporate a lot of flourishes into the routine, Real 3 Card Juggling gag, and Fatfingerz's Poker Night routine. People just can't think of this stuff cause no one else because theres only a few people in the world who've looked into it. Jerry Cestowski is probably the number one source for this kind of stuff cause he's a real world performer for XCM and does incorporate proper presetation but doesn't release all of his performing acts cause he doesn't want everyone doing his presentation and style of shows just like magicians who teach will always tell you to apply your own personality and storytelling to your OWN magic.

i think i just crapped myself.

great post unknown
i see what you mean and understand.
thansk for answering my question, i think of XCM higher than i did before

 

[UnknownEnemyZero]

Hahha.. "I think I just crapped myself" award? Kinda got a ring to it.

 

[drorange]

All i was saying is if you are good at XCM why not do tricks aswell

 

[Brendan]

Magic... well any one can do magic and astonish people.

Flourishes.... they are more towards skill and not any tom dick and harry can flourish well.

I do both..... being good at flourishes makes one think u are damn skilled or a good card handler.

An ordinary magician dont need superior skills to astonish people. They just need misdirection.

So yeah... id rather be admired for my skills than magic effects i can do. That's just my opinion.

 

[Guardian452]

Hahha.. "I think I just crapped myself" award? Kinda got a ring to it.

lol

i like it