Unfair treatment in E's forum

[AndyAce]

1) I would believe RJ over Ace... why? because RJ has a lot more to lose if he lies.

That is a bias opinion.

RJ, show people the poll thread. Show the whole thread without altering anything.

2) For crying out loud it's CIB NOT CTB... good grief

I did not do that? What has this got to do with the topic?

3) Your banned get over it, he ain't budgen'

No, I'm not just going to let them push me around like that. If I just keep quiet, there might be other people who suffer the same fate in the future. This poblem has to be solved.

4) At first I wasn't sure and we waited it out, now its just a pity party

It's more than a "pity party" It is a fight for justice and fairness.

5) RJ had to come over here... so there, contact him at t11 with a PM

He choose to post his comments here. So I assumed he wants to discuss this in the public.

Plus if Ellusionist did nothing wrong, there is NOTHING to hide. By discussing this elsewhere, or close the discussion, it would mean that they want to hide something from the public.

The public's imagination would run wild. Not advicable.

6) This is officially stupid

Thanks for your comment. But I don't think all those who post here are stupid.

7) How bout that new show phenomenon?

Totally off topic.

 

[Sean_Raf]

Reviewed by a neutral party? Hate to break it to you but Ellusionist is a privately held company that offers their internet forums as a free service to those who can follow the rules and restrictions of those forums. If you don't like the rules or the regulations, or the way they do things you are more than free to go elsewhere.


--Jim

Fair enough, but couldn't we have 2 people from E and 2 people from T11 and a moderator from each to just discuss what's happened?

The only people who truly know what's gone on here are the moderators, so I'm inclined to sway to their side of the fence. I'm not saying they're right and I'm not saying they're wrong however.

And as for this:

The other 68,000+ forum members seem to be capable of following the rules. It is no surprise you will find support on these forums....

Aren't you an 'Apex Member' over at E? Shouldn't you be a bit more mature and not start categorizing and assuming that all T11 users hate E now? If you didn't mean that in that way then I apologize but it just came across to me as though you were looking down upon these forums.

2 Separate Forums - 1 Community.

- Sean

 

[Goudinov]

Fair enough, but couldn't we have 2 people from E and 2 people from T11 and a moderator from each to just discuss what's happened?

Hi, I guess you didn't see my post on the previous page I hope it helps. Not that any of this is really anyone's business.

2 Separate Forums - 1 Community.

- Sean

Lord, that would be awesome! There are always going to be a few loud people trying their hardest to make sure that doesn't happen. We just have to be louder, don't we Sean?

 

[Sean_Raf]

Hi, I guess you didn't see my post on the previous page I hope it helps. Not that any of this is really anyone's business.

Hehe! No I didn't see your post, must've just missed it as I was typing mine I'll say no more on the matter. Like I said:

The only people who truly know what's gone on here are the moderators, so I'm inclined to sway to their side of the fence.

Other third parties will be biased, moderators are moderators for a reason and they usually have previous forum moderating experience.

Lord, that would be awesome! There are always going to be a few loud people trying their hardest to make sure that doesn't happen. We just have to be louder, don't we Sean?

Damn right!

- Sean

 

[AndyAce]

Ace wasn't banned because of his behavior in one thread, this has been going on since July. Nearly every thread that he became involved with (like this one) ended up becoming a huge argument, usually closed and a lot of deleted posts

I post in the same manner wherever I go. But why was I banned only in the E's forum?

The argument was not started by me. Don't show people threads that are altered.

I dare you to show them the untouch original thread. I dare you to do that.

The poll thread would be ideal. It is the thread that drives the nail in the coffin. Plus it is short, people can read the thread easier. The poll thread is just a min version of what happened in the 100page E's CTB thread.

Read my first post. That is what happened. Ellusionist, show them the poll thread. Don't try and twist the stories by hiding that thread.

Fair enough, but couldn't we have 2 people from E and 2 people from T11 and a moderator from each to just discuss what's happened?

I have another idea. Just show the whole thread here, and let the whole magic community review it.

Let everyone see the truth.

I'm not afraid of letting everyine see the thread.

If the Ellusionist really did nothing wrong, they should have no fear in showing people the poll thread too.

 

[jimbowmanjr]

Fair enough, but couldn't we have 2 people from E and 2 people from T11 and a moderator from each to just discuss what's happened?

The only people who truly know what's gone on here are the moderators, so I'm inclined to sway to their side of the fence. I'm not saying they're right and I'm not saying they're wrong however.

And as for this:

The other 68,000+ forum members seem to be capable of following the rules. It is no surprise you will find support on these forums....

Aren't you an 'Apex Member' over at E? Shouldn't you be a bit more mature and not start categorizing and assuming that all T11 users hate E now? If you didn't mean that in that way then I apologize but it just came across to me as though you were looking down upon these forums.

2 Separate Forums - 1 Community.

- Sean

Sean,

There are plenty of pot shots taken here at Ellusionist on a fairly regular basis, which in my opinion creates the tension. I think there are good and bad in all online forums but there is no need to go off topic and bother getting into details there.

I think you are missing my point in that this is not something that is open for debate or interpretation, or something that is going to change by bothering to drag it into these forums. The forums are run by Ellusionist and the decision was made by them to ban Ace. RJ is has given his reasons here on these forums so I am unsure what we are bothering to discuss here. If someone gets banned here do you think anyone is going to care on the Ellusionist forums or the Magic Cafe?

Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill.....

--Jim

 

[Ashrei]

This is completely unnecessary topic...

One, it's pretty much strictly E matter, and even if it somehow involved T11 in any way, this is not a way to go at it. Really... sending an angry letter to every magic communities is hardly the right way to solve anything...

Two, obviously, one of them has to be lying and since not enough people knows or can find out what really happened, it's not going to be resolved anytime soon (if ever). Hence, there really isn't a point in keeping this wild goose chase to continue...

So please... resolve it else where... (preferrable at Ellusionist itself) This really isn't necessary, especially to just-born magic community trying to acheive a big dreams.

 

[wpt1031]

Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill.....

--Jim

I hate that cliche!


(Sorry had to lighten the tension a bit)

 

[chainzero]

I read the thread in question before it was deleted. Basically the poll had two stupid options like, "Yes I will buy the two Ellusionist CIBs" vs. "No, I need to know the method before purchase."

In a ridiculously stupid poll like that, you have two options. Come off as a legit magician by supporting the creator or sound like an unethical jerk trying to figure out secrets. There is no middle road. As far as I could tell, AndyAce said he disagreed with the poll only having two options (only loyalists would be so blind). Basically he said, no I don't need to know the method, but it would be nice to know additional specifics on the effects. This is not unreasonable given the amount of CIBs out there.

Apparently at Ellusionist, this constitutes as fishing for the method. Anyways, the original thread creator came in throwing a fit saying, "Why can't you just stick to the poll?!" After that, stuff just escalated and hit the fan (from both sides).

How about you learn to create a poll with decent options? Just because I don't need to know the secret behind something doesn't mean I'll be automatically buying it. I don't disagree with the points that were brought up at all.

 

[Goudinov]

I dare you to show them the untouch original thread. I dare you to do that.

I don't really care, Ace. I dare you to just let this go and find a way to get by in life without worrying about what Ellusionist thinks.

I, personally, have more important things to do than to go undelete a bunch of posts. I'm sitting here with a broken collar bone and will be going into surgery tomorrow, then trying to figure out how to not be a burdon to my supportive wife and kids over the next few weeks while I heal.

This little drama of yours is not really a high priority for me. Maybe someone else at Ellusionist will take care of it to your satisfaction, but there's really little reason for us to try all that hard, because, well, we all have things to do, and you're really whiny.

That's my personal assessment and not necessarily the views of Ellusionist Staff or it's moderators (moderators, by the way, are not employeed by Ellusionist nor are we an extension of Ellusionist customer service, but we have to deal with stuff like this anyway).

I'm not coming back to this thread... my shoulder hurts.

 

[Sean_Raf]

Heh, sorry about that I wasn't sure whether I'd got the wrong end of the stick or not. You're quite right and in one sentence:

What's done is done and cannot (or indeed will not) be undone.

I don't think this should be discussed any further really, Goudinov's post on page 2 of this thread puts faith in me that proper action has been taken by the moderators.

Ace/Andy, I suggest if you want this problem resolved, to send a PM to RJ, and without calling him out and daring him to show the thread (and thereby implying that if he doesn't he's clearly got something to hide), perhaps the two of you could actually come to some sort of civil conversation. (What?! Civil conversation??!! ON THESE INTERNETS?! THIS IS MADNESS!)

If someone gets banned here do you think anyone is going to care on the Ellusionist forums or the Magic Cafe?
--Jim

I'm on the Ellusionist forums I just don't post as much as I do here. If I got banned from here I think I'd care

Sean_Raf: Lightening the mood for Sky News... And now, the weather.

- Sean

 

[AndyAce]

I read the thread in question before it was deleted. Basically the poll had two stupid options like, "Yes I will buy the two Ellusionist CIBs" vs. "No, I need to know the method before purchase."

In a ridiculously stupid poll like that, you have two options. Come off as a legit magician by supporting the creator or sound like an unethical jerk trying to figure out secrets. There is no middle road. As far as I could tell, AndyAce said he disagreed with the poll only having two options (only loyalists would be so blind). Basically he said, no I don't need to know the method, but it would be nice to know additional specifics on the effects. This is not unreasonable given the amount of CIBs out there.

Apparently at Ellusionist, this constitutes as fishing for the method. Anyways, the original thread creator came in throwing a fit saying, "Why can't you just stick to the poll?!" How about you learn to create a poll with decent options? Just because I don't need to know the secret behind something doesn't mean I'll be automatically buying it.

Exactly!

That came from a neutral party who read the thread!

Plus, I'm not the only one that voted no and explained why. But the other guy (Dai Hard) did not get bashed or banned.

 

[chainzero]

No, but you did respond to his bait and escalated the argument. I wouldn't say you're not at fault, but you weren't the only party involved.

 

[AndyAce]

This is completely unnecessary topic...

One, it's pretty much strictly E matter, and even if it somehow involved T11 in any way, this is not a way to go at it. Really... sending an angry letter to every magic communities is hardly the right way to solve anything...

Can you think of a better way to solve the issue? I sent emails but did not recieve any replies.

Should I just keep quiet and just let those bullies push me around? If I keep quiet, there might be more victims in the future.

Two, obviously, one of them has to be lying and since not enough people knows or can find out what really happened, it's not going to be resolved anytime soon (if ever). Hence, there really isn't a point in keeping this wild goose chase to continue...

Now the Ellusionist Mods said they won't show the thread.

I swear that if what I said is untrue, I will die a horrible death, or whatever punishment you can imagine.

I want them to show the thread, but they refused.

Who is lying here? You don't need a 200IQ to figure that out.

 

[wpt1031]

Andy why don't you just stop complaining and move on? You'll live a much better life if you do. You'll have alot less stress. Just focus on your magic and good things will probably come from it.

 

[AndyAce]

No, but you did respond to his bait and escalated the argument. I wouldn't say you're not at fault, but you weren't the only party involved.

True.

It is hard not to take the bait when someone came out of nowhere and call you a "crazy nut"

Plus, my response to that is only 3 words. "clean discussion please" or "clean discussion"

But they just keep coming back and attack me.

And those that attack me, those that started the fire did not get banned.

This is telling other people that it is OK to bash and insult people in the E's forum, as long as you support their product.

Where did those arrogant newbie magicians that called people names came from? Yup, you guess it.

 

[UBERboomer]

Get over it and don't come crying here.

 

[AndyAce]

Andy why don't you just stop complaining and move on? You'll live a much better life if you do. You'll have alot less stress. Just focus on your magic and good things will probably come from it.

Because I believe in Justice.

If I keep quiet and move on (which is the easy way out for me), other people might suffer the same fate in the future.

It is quite obvious who is in the wrong here.

Now the Ellusionist Mods said they won't show the thread.

I swear that if what I said is untrue, I will die a horrible death, or whatever punishment you can imagine.

I want them to show the thread, but they refused.

Who is lying here? You don't need a 200IQ to figure that out.

Justice will prevail.

 

[AndyAce]

Get over it and don't come crying here.

I'm not crying.

I won't just get over it.

Something is wrong and correction needs to be done.


Justice will prevail

 

[chainzero]

You're acting like this is the first incident of Ellusionist censoring. You can bring it up all you want, but they aren't going to change. You can't force someone to change what they believe is correct.

What do you gain from posting there (or on most message boards for that matter?) Most of the time there aren't any useful posts that will benefit you. I only read themagiccafe for reviews.