Present a trick without presentation?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Philipp S.(4), Jan 14, 2014.

  1. Hey,
    short but simple question:
    If you don't have a real presentation for a trick, I'm not talking about a ****ty, everyday presentation, would you even present it or would you rather only present those tricks you have a presentation for? (Hope this sentence makes sense (; )
    Cheers and C Ya
  2. Why would I perform something that has no presentation to it? What would be the point?

    I never perform for a 'real' audience unless what I'm performing has been rehearsed and perfected as much as I can get it. Of course, that's an ongoing process, I know. Every time I perform I tweak and change and try to improve what I'm doing. But I would not dream of starting from nothing and using real performances to do that work. That's just insulting to your audience.

    If you don't care enough about your performance to make it good, why should someone care enough to watch it?
  3. Apollo Robbins and Shoot Ogawa have DVD's that are pretty much magic without a presentation.
  4. A very good point. But what if you dont have a good presentation for something? With good I mean these 2 perfomances which really touched me:

    I don't even have 1 presentation for all of my tricks that even reaches the level of these presentation.
    So what would you say: Do presentations have to be so good and so "not-normal"? By not-normal I mean not something from our everyday lives.
    Here are some tricks I have problems with:
    StandUp Monte
    Multiple Card Revelation Routine (Here I tell them that every card they chose have their fingerprint and when I rub my pointer finger over their clothes I can find every single card of them, not really special to me)
    Extreme Burn 2.0 (I have a presentation about a king who has no money and asks his magician to make paper to money so that he can spend everything. I also inserted some funny lines into this presentation. But still not special to me.)
    Impromptu Copper&Siilver
    Manhattan Opener (Here I say that I am looking for someone who wants to learn magic and so they help me with magic gestures. That is really funny. One old lady wanted to spit on the deck cuz she misunderstood something, that was pretty hilarious. :D )

    These are the tricks I enjoy the most.

    I followed Eugene Burgers instructions and wrote down those tricks I enjoy the most and it were these 7 tricks.
    But I still have no idea for a presentation for most of them.

    So if you dont have an idea of performing this trick and you dont find some good presentations, e.g. on youtube, what would you do?
  5. Your presentations have to fit you and your charter. Many of my effects are stories that use magic as the illustration of the story. I'm a story teller who doesn't even seem to know that the magic is happening, it just happens. BTW youtube would really be the last place I look for presentations. You have to make the effect your own.
  6. yes and no. When I'm working on a effect in conjunction to practicing the moves ect I am thinking about a presentation. Usually by the time I have the moves down I will have a rough presentational idea, and I do mean rough. When I'm at that stage I will start performing it in casual situations, when I have friends round or am with mates at a bar ect. It is during these performances that I start to really tighten the presentation. I believe that misdirection timing ect all go hand in hand with presentation and you can't really start practicing that until you start performing for real people (its easy to misdirect yourself practicing in the mirror, but will that timing work on real audiences?). So the 'presentation' I start out with will change sometimes into something completely different to what I started out with.
  7. Magic without words is not magic without presentation. I've seen Shoot Ogawa in person and everything about how he performs is his presentation. Same with Apollo Robbins. Their body language, facial expressions, and bearing are their presentations in this case.

    I don't perform it.

    I have tricks I've been sitting on for ages which I have never once performed because I haven't personalized them. We don't need tons of tricks. For a long time, the only things I performed were reading a card out of someone's mind, and a coin bend. Those were two tricks I had put a lot of effort into, and therefore the only tricks I would do. Nothing else got the reactions I wanted, so I didn't do them.

    Pick one trick and make it yours. Don't try to shoehorn a story onto a card trick just to do something other than tell people what you've just done. Which, by the way, I think is a large part of your problem. You just listed a bunch of card tricks. Card tricks are really hard to give a good presentation to because they are inherently meaningless.

    I agree with everything he said.

    I don't know your skill level, but I can absolutely script misdirection into the first performance without having to try it before hand. Perhaps I have just focused in a different direction. I know what misdirects people and further - a good presentation is misdirection in itself.

    Now, that's not to say my presentations are set in stone. I completely agree with you in that the performance must evolve and improve over time. As you study more methods and performance theory, you can create a better performance. Taking bits and pieces from different presentations, coming up with your own thing, this is how you create miracles. But I think it's far better to start with something that you've already put the work of creating a good presentation into, than to just get the mechanics down and wing it from there.
  8. I don't know your skill level, but I can absolutely script misdirection into the first performance without having to try it before hand. Perhaps I have just focused in a different direction.

    Sorry, but ROTFLMAO. .. .

    I know you didn't mean it as it reads CT but you have to admit, that's funny.

    Creating a "Presentation" is a different process for all of us. When I did traditional magic music would help me "see" how to flow effects or a series of techniques, together into one cohesive thing. As a Mentalist I have to hold to things that support my claim and not stray outside them or else I hurt the greater illusion -- the Who & what I am and wish to project publicly.

    Find a story that you enjoy and look at how to tie that tale to the effects you presently know. The more you practice this the easier you'll find it, to create plausible and entertaining routines.

    Study other performers whose styles you appreciate and start off modeling them. . . I don't mean mimicking them or being a clone, but rather learn their mannerisms and deliberateness when performing and strive to do bits as you think they would.

    Best of luck!
  9. I think it depends on what you are trying to achieve with your routines. Do you want to look skillful? or do you want ( a little Jeff Mcbride here) give people a gift in the way a magic trick can only achieve?

    Either way ( as craig mentions ) watching other magicians perform could give you an insight into what you want out of magic and what you want to give to the spectator, I suggest looking at the two sides of the coin and see what you are comfortable with.

    The best example to me about how the trick and the presentation complement each other is Zamiel's Rose by Derren brown

    On the other hand, do you want to see a performance with CERO presentation whatsoever other than presenting yourself as really skillful? look up some of the material of Brian Tudor :p

    EDIT: To answer the question, if the mood is set and people actually have time for a good performance, yeah , I use my patter a lot. What if they jut want something quick just to satisfy their curiosity? I pull off a quick trick witouth patter just to gain their curiosity and their need to see more :). Otherwise I only do practiced patter performances.

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