Put the cards down...

Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
The problem with him telling kids to come up with stories for their magic is that most of them will be hard to swallow. In all honesty, if you were in high school or if somebody you knew. Came up to you and tried to present their magic with some story how they learned it in Vegas or whatever. Would it make the magic more believable? Or would you just snicker at them.

You just can't seem to get past the idea of telling stories. Whenever anyone brings up the idea of doing something original in a presentation, you default to that as if it's the only conceivable answer. Why?

Is the idea of thinking creatively that foreign to you people that this is the best we can come up with?
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Steerpike may be able to get away with it, because his clients don't know him personally and don't know that he mainly comes up with this stuff in his room while blasting Megadeath music.

Three things.

First of all, I form a friendship with my clients that is utterly alien to most magicians I've met. I hate to sound like a broken record, but I'm a populist among the magic crowd.

Second, it's spelled Megadeth. With only 1 a. Don't insult Dave Mustaine, he'll kill your whole family.

Third, I'm actually blasting Blind Guardian and Manowar while burning incense and sacrificing black hens on a pewter altar I bought at Spencer's Gifts.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
The reason I bring up stories is because no matter how you sugar coat it. When you are doing something other than saying what you are doing "I take this and put that there." you are telling a story. Giving the objects character and perhaps a personality. Now that doesn't mean people can't have the story involve their audience.

As for the card tricks thing. Bill Malone does do card tricks. Bottom Line. He may have jokes and humorous lines that go with them. But in the end. He does card tricks plain and simple. Now I don't know if he is retired or anything. But I do know that he made his entire living doing card tricks.

Also I know that Aaron Fisher gets a lot of gigs and he also does mainly card stuff as well.

The other thing about a story specially for people here, is that has to be some what beleivable in order for it work. Otherwise even if they try it present it differently. The people they perform for will just look at them like "Cute story, neat trick."
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
The reason I bring up stories is because no matter how you sugar coat it. When you are doing something other than saying what you are doing "I take this and put that there." you are telling a story. Giving the objects character and perhaps a personality. Now that doesn't mean people can't have the story involve their audience.

That's a gross over-simplification and you know it.

As for the card tricks thing. Bill Malone does do card tricks. Bottom Line.

Nobody is denying that. You're missing the point by continuing to hammer away at that inconsequential non sequitor. Get over yourself.
 
Oct 15, 2008
826
0
Tennessee
I'm genuinely confused by what you wrote, as in I don't understand the bulk of it, so if I'm off-base with what I'm saying here, my apologies in advance.

There IS a reason to do something else, and part of advancing in magic is figuring that out. Even someone dedicated to a particular field of magic needs some variety to what they do. You're confusing a magical prop for an actual field of performance.

And see, you might say, "But couldn't you say the same thing about mentalism, then? That's a type of effect, and it's also a field of performance!" But then look at Derren Brown. He reads minds, does card tricks, walks on glass, hammers spikes up his nose, hypnotizes people, predicts the future, and uses funky psychological stuff to create an eerie mind-control like effect. He doesn't just use a swami writer over and over in different ways.



You know how doing just mental magic makes you a mentalist? Or how walking around outside and doing tricks for strangers makes you a street magician? Or how, if you just did stuff with coins, that makes you a coin guy? Do you see the pattern?

I mean, what would you call it?



The good card effects are being choked to death in a sea of mediocrity. Also, you don't have to be "doing something wrong" to be getting tired of card tricks, because, frankly, that's all ANYONE talks about anymore, and that's all you see anyone doing. The market is 80% card magic, and it's all really sub-par. There's no real variety anymore. No one knows to take a random prop and do something weird and cool with it. Look at the 1-on-1's here - there's Cookie Cutter, which is a unique and wicked twist on a standard Russian Roulette routine, and then, choking it to death, are a thousand boring card tricks and unnecessary sleights.

When you ask what type of card tricks he's doing, new street magic stuff, or old classics, that's the point he's making. We're honest to god actually running out of ideas, but we're still trying to milk this for money because it's all teenagers know how to do.


Um what do you call dan and dave? Card magicians?

What i meant was, im not trying to impress ANY of yall. Especially the idiots who create threads like this.

thats what i meant.
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,410
6
Sydney, Australia
I'm rather surprised how many people just haven't understood the thread...

The point is not Bill Malone. Randy, you are not as good as Bill Malone. Neither are you, Tim.

Bill Malone has the skills to do cards, and do them well.

For everyone else, this is one way in which we can improve our magic.

And no, the ability to float names like Juan Tamariz does not make you a good magician. I'd like to see you name everything you know about Juan Tamariz or Darwin Ortiz, without looking him up.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
I could, but that wouldn't achieve anything.

I do see what you mean. The other point is that all these top guys good by simply performing card magic over the years. It's the ONLY way to get better.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Im just tired of people trying to tell other people what they are, or arent.
I mean just take car of yourself and stop trying to correct everyone

That's what all of the name-dropped magicians are about though. Amazing how people will take the exact same information from a guy selling it for 50 bucks but will dismiss it as abuse when they get it for free.

And no, the ability to float names like Juan Tamariz does not make you a good magician. I'd like to see you name everything you know about Juan Tamariz or Darwin Ortiz, without looking him up.

Reminds me a bit of Ambrose Bierce's "The Devil's Dictionary" and specifically the entry for erudition.

Erudition, noun
Dust shaken out of a book into an empty skull.
 
Nov 20, 2007
4,410
6
Sydney, Australia
Alright, that's fair enough.

Well, would you not agree that the ability to perform some simple mind reading stuff, when you have no cards, or other props on you, increases your versatility and overall improves your magic, in the greater sense of the word? The ability to perform something on demand, without anything else?

I also feel that this process, because you don't have props, helps creativity a lot. I certainly do feel that this ability makes magic somewhat interesting.

This, I feel, is simply the main point of this thread. In general, there are many benefits of being able to perform things other than cards. Which is not to devalue card magic, or those masters who perform solely card magic.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
I'm not going to try convince you of anything, because that would get us nowhere. I do other things that are from tagged that don't require a book as well. I also do some minor coin magic if I had to. Etc etc.
 
Nov 15, 2007
1,106
2
36
Raleigh, NC
When I'm messing around with cards and someone asks me to 'do a trick' I might do one or two and then ask if they'd like to see something more than a card trick.

I then go into either mind reading, metal bending (DG's Clip Trip if a paperclip is handy), or a simple coin vanish/transfer/bend(if prepared).

I also bend bottle caps 'with my mind', crazy man's handcuffs, or just have some fun with pk touches.


-Rik
 
May 3, 2008
864
3
33
Singapore
www.youtube.com
Or just be the guy that does card tricks all the time.

i honestly dont see anything wrong with that. Though prae's post does sum up what a capable magician should do.

Well, would you not agree that the ability to perform some simple mind reading stuff, when you have no cards, or other props on you, increases your versatility and overall improves your magic, in the greater sense of the word? The ability to perform something on demand, without anything else?

I also feel that this process, because you don't have props, helps creativity a lot. I certainly do feel that this ability makes magic somewhat interesting.

and finally

Third, I'm actually blasting Blind Guardian and Manowar while burning incense and sacrificing black hens on a pewter altar I bought at Spencer's Gifts.


gotta love steerpike.
 
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