Controversy...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by AceGhatge, Sep 2, 2007.

  1. Many Magicians had their opinions of the black tigers and other custom made decks.. and the opinions were " they scream they are gaffed".

    I personally love all kinds of decks but use only standard red/blue bicycle decks.

    My question is,
    Since theory11 staff consists of big names and talented artists, what is their take on the custom made decks? Will they use them? (irrespective if for the sake of T11)

    Cheers!
     
  2. Wow, interesting topic, I look forward to seeing some responses .
     
  3. "I have a response, and this this is the respononse to the response to"- keeps on babbling,
    I have seen wayne witha lot of customs,especially masters. he did the video:eek:
     
  4. i dont think masters is a custom made deck... it looks and feels like standard bikes..just the quality difference.
    But that is not what im asking here, guardians are similar to black tigers in the back color..
     
  5. looks to me that most professionals use these "custom" decks for show only. but for performances and such i would think they would use normal looking materials. (so normal bikes)

    but as we have all seen, miller used ghost gaff cards live. and they got pretty decent reactions.

    so who knows. its all how the magician presents them in his act.
     
  6. Here's my personal experience:

    If spectators are waving off your effects as the work of a trick deck, it's your fault and not the deck's. I know people don't like hearing that. Too bad. The truth isn't always easy to take.

    I've been performing consistently with Ghosts for a year and only twice have I been accused of using trick cards. People forget that it's about framing. If using custom cards is natural for you, the spectators will be more inclined to accept that there's nothing out of the ordinary.
     
  7. On some points I tend to disagree but, I do sometimes get accussed of using trick cards and such. It happens quite often when I use Black tigers since people aren't use to seeing cards with black faces. Ghosts I dont have a problem with and the Masters as just perfect for performances I think. They look suttle yet have dazzling performance.

    -RA69
     
  8. Well T11 does have the guardian decks there's a start, but as for more who knows, T11 has just began there massive journey in the magic community. So whether they do or not will have to wait and see.

    Hayden.
     
  9. I'd disagree.
    When some spectators were really fooled by a trick using normal cards, didn't they accuse you of using trick cards? even though knowing bikes are normal looking cards?
     
  10. Exactly the reason why I bought a Red backed Gaff deck. No one would suspect it since people have been using bikes forever.

    -RA69
     
  11. Can't say I have, no. Unless you count the occassional times when they try to mimic my actions such as rubbing a card, thinking that was the real catalyst to the effect.
     
  12. In my experience, using custom decks generally has a positive impact on your spectators, provided that you're not performing a ton of gaff magic. If you're just using the cards for your solid sleight of hand routines and are openly and freely allowing the spectators to examine the deck between effects, they won't ever assume anything is wrong.

    For me, the logic goes like this: If you pull out a strange locked box with tubes and crap sticking out of it and then make a dove appear out of it, they might assume that there was something gimmicked about the box. The cards play differently, however, because your audience knows what cards are. They've seen different kinds of playing cards before and they immediately file your new deck into that same category in their mind. They don't do magic, so other than marking cards, they're not really going to have much of an idea as to how you could possibly gimmick a deck of cards.

    So far, that only suggests the lack of a major downside to using custom cards, but I made the statement earlier that custom decks can have a positive impact on your performance. Here is how I think that works.

    When you open your set and first pull out your custom deck, acknowledge the fact that you are using a custom deck. Say something like, "check these out - they're the new Bicycle Guardians," and then hand the deck out. This accomplishes a few things.

    1) It allows your spectators to examine the deck for a reason other than to check and make sure they are normal. (By saying, "make sure these are normal," you are implying that they could theoretically be gimmicked. This is bad. Obviously.) But, in the end, they still get the same psychological effect. They held the cards freely. You couldn't let them do that comfortably if you knew they were gimmicked in some way.

    2) It points out that the cards are made by Bicycle (assuming you're using Guardians and not Jerry's Nuggets or something) which only suggests further that the deck is normal.

    3) Speaking about the cards as if you value them subtly suggests that you are good at what you do because you use a deck of cards that is of higher quality than they usually would for their beer / poker nights. Professionals use professional equipment. If you're a recording engineer, for example, you use Pro Tools or something similar. Consumers use things like Garage Band. That same logic will apply in their mind, so you will get just a little bit of credit for being good before you even begin performing and that little bit of credit will likely influence their future perceptions of the effects you perform.

    Dana
     
  13. This deck or that deck?

    I always have had the opinion that a "different" deck would either serve the purpose of pulling off a an effect using a gaff (which I would actually recommend using a bicyle deck for), or it would be used by the performer so that performer would have an extra tool to be DIFFERENT. If you want to use a "different" deck to be "DIFFERENT", I would vote for using a different deck. Therefore, bike or not, make the choice that is right for you. If you're entertaining and blow them away, it really will not matter what you are using to accomplish the task at hand.
     
  14. like i haven't seen any of the t11 using this deck even in their performances or the t11 videos
     
  15. Well said Dana. I understand what you meant.. even on the protools part as im a recording artist too ;)
     
  16. It depends how you present it, in alot of cases people will suspect some sort of trickery as they haven't seen these types of cards before.

    Alot of magicians use them at conventions for show etc, but amongst magicians I think its alright:D

    Personally i wouldnt use a tiger or a ghost deck, but maybe one card from that deck which i will include in my normal deck, so i can do a colour change to add some spice to a routine:D

    Just my 50 cent:p

    Danny C
     
  17. The cards do not make the performance. If people are thinking about what cards you are using and not what you are doing, this may be a flaw in the focus of your performance, not the deck. I do agree that Bikes are accepted by everyone, but to me it is about style and being different. The Guardians look incredible and handle beautifully-- I've used them non-stop since I got my hands on one of them. But at the end of the day, it's just a personal preference: if you want to use cards with sailboats and pinkish purplish dragons and smiley faces on them.... go for it (coming soon, exclusively at theory11).

    Chris Kenner
     
  18. My favorite deck is the Sailboat Pinkish Purplish Dragon Smiley Face Deck by USPCC. I got a preview deck from Ellusionist, they were considering putting it on the market.
     
  19. i thought they were exclusively at theory11 :p
     
  20. I only use "Custom" decks as they are practically the same price as regular cards here in Aus. None of my specs think i'm using a trick deck, i just bring it out, dont even introduce them and go on with my routine, everyone knows what cards are. I don't say look how cool these cards are, or ask: how nice they feel or anything. Just treat them like normal cards and your specs will think the same.
     

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