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Discussion in 'Magic Forum' started by Morgan B, Apr 25, 2008.
You're missing the forest for the trees.
and you're focusing too hard on the moon and missing all of its heavenly glory.
Now say something of actual value or use to me.
Frankly, I grow weary of listening to your fractured attempts at discussion. You've changed your argument too many times for me to bother counting, you seem to make very little attempt at understanding anybody, and just dive for the reply as soon as you (mistakenly) feel you've gotten the gist of someone's post. And you seem to suggest that every insipid argument you've come up with is the grand Unified Theory of Coin Magic.
You're missing the forest for the trees. You've been doing this ever since I first encountered you and nothing has changed. I'm done banging my head against the wall.
No, I believe that is you who is the one who acts that way. What we have here is a difference in opinion. No arguing or bickering is going to change that.
I agree with Steerpike - you are missing the point a bit - and even if you weren't - you don't answer the questions you are asked. There is no indication in your replies that you read and understand what we are saying.
I just wrote this to Tumbleweed in a PM - but thought you may find it useful.
Vernon said, "Your audience knowing you did something, is as bad as knowing exactly what you did" - in other words, the illusion is broken. I find this very true in coin magic - why do people react - unexpected happenings - why doesn't coin magic leave a lasting impression for the most part - logical thinking (thank god by some and not all), fishy moves that appear unnatural, and no connected plot to take their mind away from method.
So - although you will get a reaction from coin magic, you don't get what Paul Harris calls "white light astonishment", because the only way to really deceive anyone with coins is with confusion (again, not all coin effects, but most) and we all know confusion is not magic.
Which is what the story or scripting is for. It's there to enhance it and give what you do a reason for being. You are right that Coin magic should look like pure magic, if they can come to some reasoning of how you did it, then it's not magical. What you want to do is lead them across the bridge and blow up the exists and leave them with nowhere to go. One of the things with coin magic as well is a lot of guys tend to hurry through everything they do. Which looks stupid and confusing. Imagine you are calmly walking down the street, thinking you are following along and then a brick wall appears out of nowhere. You'll have no idea how it appeared and no reason why. Because you were taking your time. Now try that while running down the street. You'll miss it because you were going too fast. So it's no longer a magical moment but a "Well I didn't that coming." moment.
The problem with it tho is that yeah, a lot coin stuff doesn't have that magical look. Tho I'm sure if Max Malini was able to take something simple as producing a coin from his beard or whatever and make that look magical, then so could a lot of other people.
What is your point Randy? You are all over the place with what you are saying? You are talking theory - but I don't think you understand what you are saying, or you would realize you are finding different ways to say what I have already stated.
You aren't progressing this thread - so we agree that coin magic needs a plot/script, the methods look fishy and the magic should happen for a reason...what are you doing about it?
looking for effects that seem move less and also happen WITH the person.
Why look, when you can construct your own?
All you can do is look for more crap to buy?
Never said I was going to buy more crap.
To rephrase, I do not believe that the acquisition of excess material will provide adequate countermeasures to the larger conflict and will certainly fail bring cessation to the subtle undercurrents of the continuing inadequacy of coin-based chicanery.
I've got plenty of material to go through. As I said. I was going to LOOK for material, not purchase or buy stuff. Sure there are things I WANT to get, but that is neither here nor there.
One of the major problems with coin magic simply that most guys perform AT their audience.
The very fact that you're even looking for material means you're on the wrong track.
Yeah well I'm not that creative of a guy.
That is apparent by the consistent regurgitation of my own words and the lacking ability to form a thought that is coherent. Perhaps you should copy and past something from Steerpike's past posts if we are to communicate further.
Seriously, if you are looking for the complete package of coin magic...and it is taking this long - you have proved my point.
That type of attitude will get you nowhere.
This is what I am hoping now Randy - sorry - but I would rather just move on from this, as it has been pages with lack of progression. I appreciate your time. If you ever take the time to find something, that it took pages to RE-COMMUNICATE with you on, I would love to see it. If you ever find something that alleviates these issues, love to hear it.
For now - I would rather just close the door on this topic...as it reads like 26 pages of reiteration.
Well yeah we already agreed on what the problems were and how to fix them. Most of the posts were my fault (tho you try to post common sense at 1 am after a long day at college when you're eyes can barely read anything.).
We've already mentioned how proper audience interaction can enhance coin magic (due to people more vividly remembering something that happened to them, than AT them.) Also because if it happens to them, they have no way of explaining how it happened. The same goes for proper scripting, etc etc.
Randy - I am happy to hear you are reading and thinking about it - the next step - looking at your routines, and others - and picking them apart. Only the strong survive - do you have the gumption to put down some effects....
A magician is judged by what he doesn't do - and why...not just what he does.
Seriously, keep in touch - but I think...for now...unless someone can bring up something new - we need to take some time apart to see what we can do in solving these issues.
Spread the word on the first post in this thread - see if others can find solutions.