Forcing a Cut

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by praetoritevong, Feb 20, 2009.

  1. Hey guys, I just had an idea tonight that I need some help with.

    What I'm looking for is this: a way to force the spectator to cut to a predetermined number of cards in the deck between 15 and 37. Doesn't matter how it's done, but it needs to be surefire, and I need to be able to know that they will cut that many cards hours before the performance starts.

    Any ideas, help, or sources anyone can give would be much appreciated.

  2. Hmmm, I haven't tried it, but I've heard the idea floating around before. Not sure if I'm allowed to post this, its not major exposure, its a physiological logical sort of thing to. Basically you have the card above where you want them to cut to bend slightly, like this ^ (looking at the card on its side, but obviously not that bent) and you have the deck on the table and casually ask them to cut, 90% of the time, if their not thinking about it and have no reason to suspect you they will cut at that spot, or so I remember/heard.

    There's an idea, something you could play with. Hope it sort of helps,

    Cheers, Tom

    EDIT: Oh yeah, you might want to look at Daniel Madison's CUT pdf if you can find it.

    Cheers, Tom
  3. I've just been discussing both those methods with a friend. With psychological things, I'm normally not one to insist on 100% success rate - unfortunately, I do plan to close a show with this so I'd like to hit it on this special occasion.

    Also, CUT works technically - but the spectator also needs to be able to handle, cut, spread and shuffle fully the entire deck afterwards. It's just that this particular cut needs to be foreseen.

    Thanks for your suggestions Tom, I appreciate it. :)
  4. I have two ideas right now, the first would be some sort of crimp, and the second, this should work well, is two cards glued together above the force card. If I come up with different ideas, I'll pm you.
  5. A break.

    It worked for me. If you keep a break below the amount of cards you want them to take and ask them to take some cards from the top, and at the same time kind of push them into his palm, it looks really innocent. The push should be slight, but is not essential.

    It has to be done really relaxed. Don't go like "Now in a moment, cut the deck in two. It can be anywhere. Remember, you can cut from 1 to 51 cards! It is VERY important where you cut.

    If they somehow cut too low, you palm the rest and put it on, in the motion of turning the top card over, like in Las vegas leaper.

    Try it!

    (Also, check "Prime Cut", it could be some help.)

  6. Oh that's an awesome idea Zapper, will definitely field test it. Might I ask what Prime Cut is? I'll google it now...
  7. If the deck must be tabled, I'd use a crimp or a thick card (check out Steve Bedwells material for other excellent applications for thick cards).

    If the deck can be handled, have them cut while you hold a break above the desired card. Even if they cut slightly less than the desired amount, with the break in place, you can pass the broken card to top.

    Just some half baked idea's.

  8. Haha, I actually tried this out today, good timing.
    I wanted to cheat at 500, so I false shuffled, and put the deck on the table to be cut. I placed it facing them horizontally, and shifted the half I wanted them to cut towards them about 0.3cm. And holy crap it worked perfectly. No idea how it juust did. Now I've done it about 5 times, it's worked everytime.
  9. dont know if its right for the effect but...

    I think its called a kick cut. I learned it years ago so I may have the name wrong so guys don't shoot me if I'm off basis here. The idea is that you place a couple granules of salt or sand on top of the stack that supposed to be cut to the top. That's what keeps the break. Now if you tap the deck slightly It'll break at that point every time (well like 90%) Alternatively if you are using a table you can jar it slightly or if in the hands hold it in your palm and have them smack your elbow. Originally you would kick the deck slightly. Just an idea but personally I would prefer a crimp. Success rate is a little less but if you are casual about it then the success rate goes up dramatically. Just a note on getting them to break where you want them to. Keep talking when you ask them to cut. Try giving other directions when the cut is taking place. Anything to distract them from cutting while still allowing them to cut. Hope this helps.
  10. I've used the grains of salt before and they work perfectly 99 percent of the time.
    I set the cards on the ground and give them a slight kick with the side of my shoe.
    They split on the grain almost every single time. Looks very innocent and fair. You only need like two or three grains of salt.
  11. Try using what is known as a Breather Card. Justin Miller teaches this in his X-Marks the Spot DVD.

  12. my way

    Its extremely wierd you bring this up. I just made up a way to do this with the four aces like last night haha! Anyway I tried this on like everyone in my family and it never failed me. So instead of the aces for you since you want them to cut to about 15-37 cards take say the hmm 20th card, holding it by the long sides. Still holding it there bend it, but not fully. Just so the card is curved now almost like a card boat sort of. lol. Once you've done that card into the middle. If you put the deck on the table with the short edges facing the spectators they will never see any break. Even long sides facing them because if they do than the card is bent to much. Than just say, "I want you to cut this deck once. And they'll cut to 20 cards down or how ever many cards down that card is in the deck. Hope that helped. It works great for me to find the 4 aces when ever i want in my routine! :)

  13. Right, so a crimped card?

    Also, Calvin, thanks for mentioning Breathers, thats actually my preferred type of crimp, I just use it so casually that I often forget to mention the type of crimp to use :)

    So yeah! Use a breather crimp!

  14. I PM'd you, Prae.

    As a side note, breather <3

    - Sean
  15. Infinity principle is where it's at - very effective as a crimp to locate a card, not sure how it'd work as a "cut to me" key card though!

  16. yah basically
  17. Wow... totally forgotten about that. <3 infinity more than the breather I think @_@

    - Sean
  18. If the exact number of cards doesn't matter as long as it's between 15 and 37, I would just say "Cut about half the deck, more or less". They will of course try to approximate as best they can. It never fails for me.
  19. I would use Die Vernons floter for me it works all the time
  20. Ya I agree that is an amazing device forgette what I said before that is what I meant to say

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