You are not an artist!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Steerpike, Jan 1, 2009.

  1. Well the great thing about this forum is...if you don't agree with a can hit that little x up in the top right corner. And at least take the time to spell some things right if you are going to make unhelpful comments.
  2. Ooh-hoo-hoo! Look who knows so much, huh?

    You were never arguing semantics. You were desperately clinging to a sense of entitlement over a title that your arguments have rendered meaningless.

    And learning means having to deal with unpleasant truths sometimes.

    What, did you actually think the best way to becoming a better artist was to just go to the Product Reviews section to find out how much more crap to buy? This place is too complacent and it's time more people started asking tougher questions of the community in general.
  3. When I said my quote I meant that as an artist, you need to be good enough so that you could make a dime. You don't have to at all. But you should be good enough that people are willing to pay, even if its a dime. Hell I would pay to watch Chris Kenner but I sure won't pay to watch some of you guys on T11. I don't even know you and yet just from your Youtube Videos, profiles, and the way you type-and your battle videos, I know i wouldn't pay to watch you, sorry.
  4. There is no logic involved. The argument is one of desperately clinging to a preconceived notion. People will crowbar the most insane un-logic from the anti-matter universe of Quaad into an argument if they think it might help them hang onto their selfish indulgences a little longer.
  5. Very true.

  6. so how is this helping anyone become better?
    please enlighten me

    it sure hasn't helped me, im not sayin im some great artist.
    but im workin on it becoming one.
  7. That depends entirely on what you take away from all of this.

    If you look past the shrieking howler monkeys calling for my blood and all the other personal attacks, you'll see some positive, constructive discussion going on here from some very bright minds.

    If nothing else, wouldn't you look at the smartest people in this thread and think to yourself, 'These are the people I should be associating with.'?
  8. Seems like someone is taking this too personally
  9. Its causing you to learn your place. You are probably not an artist. The fact of the matter is you need to prove you are an artist. Someone else does not have to prove that you aren't an artist. Prove yourself like Andrei. IF you really are capable of being so good at magic-then you are an artist.

    You aren't working on becoming a great artist unless you are already an artist. And so far, you are not a true artist-to my knowledge. I see no youtube channels that prove me wrong in your profile. I see no battle videos from you that put you on an artist's level. However, the way you post and type is much more mature than some people on here. MUCH more mature.

    These questions that target your "why" factor. These questions cause you to realize that you are not an artist-YET. They make you better because once you realize you aren't an artist, you realize what is an artist. If you go through life thinking you are an artist, you have less to look up to. Realizing you are not a professional yet is the first step in becoming better in your art. It also gives you a standard to what is an artist. Who is a true artist you may ask? Anyone on T11's artist page. They are who you need to work up to in order to classify yourself as an artist. From there you can work up to a great artist like Chris Kenner who has so much experience and creativity.
  10. i have no problem with you, if you saw one of my post as an attack im sorry.
    I just thought the thread was rude, im not offended.
    alot of people did like this thread, but personally i just thought you could have went about this discussion in a different manner.

    but thats me. im not going to argue on if people Ive never met or seen, are artists or not.

    Who are the smartest people?
  11. Art: the products of human creativity; the creation of beautiful or significant things; a superior skill that you can learn by study and practice and observation;

    I understand the point you are trying to make, I wish others would take the time to see it as well. Try this; Magic is an art, it takes creativity to make magic and leave people with something to remember. It is something that can be observed, and practiced, and can be beautiful or significant. But not all people do magic in this light, your not a painter (artist) because you painted one picture in your lifetime, just as in magic you aren't an artist because you know a few good tricks. Magic is the connection between the magician and the spectator. That relationship you establish with the audience and what impact you leave, that's were the art is, that's were the magic is. Is that more or less what you are getting at? Or are you getting at the undignified glory people like in the title?

  12. who am i trying to prove myself too?
    certainly none you you, i have no videos because i have no camera.
    If i do make a video its not to prove anything, its to ask you what i need to work on.
    i mean who gets to decide whos an artist?
  13. You realize you are an artist when you prove to yourself that you are on the same level as someone like Andrei Jikh, Daniel Madison, etc.

    By proving it to yourself, you can share your knowledge and experience with everyone around you as to help them on their route to becoming an artist. From there you work on making your own skill better.

    What do artists like those on the T11 page do? They provide the pathway for the next generation of artists to arise. At the same time they also raise the bar of their art.
  14. That wouldn't have been nearly as interesting though.

    I think that's for you and the others reading this thread to decide.

    Yes and no.

    My point is that you don't get to call yourself an artist just because you feel like it. You have to actually do something artistic.

    To all those interested, I recommend taking a look at Kenton Knepper's manuscript Mystery by Association. Agree or disagree with Kenton, it will give you a lot to think about.
  15. I don't wish to point out your character flaws Steerpike. If I did I apologize for that. I just think that the overall presentation of this argument is very negative. Why not just encourage the wannabe magicians/artists to make their own way? That's what the true artists do. They encourage the wannabe nubes or whatever we call them these days because they realize that one day the artist will be gone. Out of the spectrum. And someone will need to follow up. Maybe it's one of these people on these forums right now? We all start as wannabe's. The artists are the ones that we all look up to. And if we all look up to someone then are any of us artists? Or are we all? Some of us beginners and some of us masters. Truth is, I don't have any clue to what the answer is to this question. But why be mean about it? Thanks for deigning my existence or whatever you do Steerpike. Or should I just call you God?

    In that case I guess I'm an atheist.

  16. Steerpike: Before I address the whole issue of who should or should not be considered an artist, what do you consider the definition of artist to be? It seems like a lot of people are disagreeing with what it means to be an artist, and therein lies the problem. In science/social science papers, it's always paramount to define any terms that you plan to discuss (ie. in a paper about anger, you must define what it is you mean by "anger"--what specific actions must be observed, etc), to make sure everyone's on the same page. And it's obvious that everyone isn't on the same page here with the term "artist", so it'd probably be a good idea to define that first.

    I realize that is a tough thing to ask, as even in what most consider to be the "art world" there isn't a consensus on what art is or what it means to be an "artist". But, at least we'll have a working definition for how we're using the term here in this thread.
  17. Alright, first of all, good to see you're still alive and kicking.

    Second. You can't define art. I can't define art. Wikipedia can't define art. Art scholars can't even define art. So let's agree that we won't be discussing what art is here.

    Now that we have that out of the way, I'll go ahead and define art.

    I suppose I agree with you for the most part. There are three legs of art that hold it up, like legs of a stool (as in a backless chair, not poo). There's the artist, who creates the art. Most practitioners of magic have this part down. The fact that the magic is happening pretty much ensures that there's someone creating it. Next, there's the art itself. The magic. Again, without it, we'd not be getting anywhere. Finally, and this is the part that is most commonly overlooked, is the audience. As an artist there is a point at which one must part with his or her art--that is, give it up to your audience to interpret as they will. That's where most people fail.

    To be an artist, there has to be that offering of the art to an audience--to someone or someones who will receive it. That's where most hobbyist fail. They keep it to themselves. If a tree falls in a forest and nobody is around to hear it, why should anyone care?

    Hope all is well, and happy new year.
  18. That opens up new vistas of debate, doesn't it?

    I consider myself an artist, but only a minor one. I have a long road ahead of me before I can consider myself great at it. And I'm certainly not on the same level as people like Jeff McBride, H.P. Lovecraft, Akira Kurosawa, or the three masterminds behind The Trans-Siberian Orchestra.

    Where does that leave me, I wonder?
  19. then y are you talking about my youtube page, or lack of?
    that shouldnt matter if im proving it to myself?

    i understand what your saying, my point is i dont think any 1 person can say weather or not someone is a artist.
  20. i agree, i thinnk when a painter starts painting he is an artist.
    maybe not a great one, but while he is practicing to become a great painter.
    he is still an artist while doing so.

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