Need Some Advice

Sep 2, 2007
14
0
Hi guys,

I'm at a point where I'd like to take my magic to the next level and begin some performances. I have some good tricks that I have worked on for a while and want to start putting it all together for a performance.

I'm just not sure where to start.... in building my performance. If you have any advice, software, how to write out a performance etc. I'd love to hear from you.

Scott
 
Sep 2, 2007
14
0
Mostly card magic, with the touch of mentalism.

Basically I want to begin developing different routines.... but just need some advice on how to begin planning a routine for an audience. (Stage performance, street performance etc.)

Please any advice would be greatly appreciated.

This may sound like a stupid question... but with lots of tricks how to tie them all together is an art in itself I believe.

Scott
 
Its a tough thing to do. Especially just starting out. Me personally I like having each effect end in the setup that I need for the next effect, or at least one small move away from being setup. Try being as seamless as possible. You said you do card magic with a little mentalism, I do the same thing. What helped me was to seperate them and figure out the presentation possibilities to tie the effects together and make them seem related. It is all about the presentation. This may mean that some effects go into the routine, and some have to be left out.

Also, be loose with the routine. Allow you and your spectators plenty of breathing room. No one, not you or your audience, can have fun when seeing a routine that "insists upon itself". If you press too hard to get a certain presentation across and get a certain timing down, then you will turn everyone off. Let the people experience and react naturally and react to them naturally and it will bring your magic into a much more real level to your spectators.
 

morpheis91

Elite Member
Sep 13, 2007
199
4
Philadelphia
www.myspace.com
Also one key thing to remember is that at the end of the day what counts is entertaining your spectators. Make things really fun and enjoyable learn some humor be charismatic and relax, relax, relax. You have practiced for a while and you know you can do the moves well don't worry too much about flashing. Also make eye contact and don't look at your hands too much.
 
Dec 14, 2007
817
2
Buy then read:

Nelms Magic and Showmanship
Durham Professional Secrets
Wonder The Books of Wonder

Also

Brook The Empty Stage
Mamet True and False
and any book on the films of Hitchcock

Brad Henderson
 
Honestly... I think the best way to learn how to perform is the hard way. You said you've rehearsed and have a good idea of what you want to do. Just go out and start performing. Do it for friends, family, pets, strangers, anyone and anything. Make mistakes and learn from them. Just go out and do magic. That's what you should do. If you make yourself look stupid, fine-- you can always improve. But at least you'll learn what works and what doesn't. Experimentation is the best way to gaining qualified experience. Sure you can read books and session with other performers, but what works for them may not work for you and vice versa. So... go out and do what you're asking how to do. Just perform. Just do it.

RS.
 
Hi guys,

I'm at a point where I'd like to take my magic to the next level and begin some performances. I have some good tricks that I have worked on for a while and want to start putting it all together for a performance.

I'm just not sure where to start.... in building my performance. If you have any advice, software, how to write out a performance etc. I'd love to hear from you.

Scott
Hey breh, we get caught up in routines so much....i don't like to use routines...when you routine your effects, you become gimmicky or staged....you do not want to be like a movie, meaning whats plan is what going to happen. That tends to make your performance lack orginality....

I'm not saying that you shouldn't be commericial, just don't say the same things, don't do the effects the exact same ways all the time....you then become an act....

But to help you out....i would do effect of other magicians, that allow me to be myself and not like them....and when you do your original effects, make sure that its your style...if you perform like blaine and have the manuerisms of dia vernon, thats not gonna cut it....

the way you act around family and friends should be the way you perform....remember that....try to do more original effects than others ....it allows you to be calm, and poised...and also yourself...i cannot stress that more....being you is all the counts...if being you is talkative...then so be it...if being you is geeky...so be it...

i'm not a flourisher at all..i mean not even the slightest...so i don't use fancy flourishes...

i only do what i do best...and thats it...
 
Dec 14, 2007
817
2
Hey breh, we get caught up in routines so much....i don't like to use routines...when you routine your effects, you become gimmicky or staged....you do not want to be like a movie, meaning whats plan is what going to happen. That tends to make your performance lack orginality....
.

This may, quite possibly, be some of the worst advice ever given on a magic forum.

Brad Henderson
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
Just because something is routine doesn't mean that it's planned out down to the T. Some guys have a few effects that they perform, but the order and everything they do pretty much depends on the flow of the show and the energy of the room or people they are performing for.

IE: if you have a routine, it simply means you have a few effects that you can build off of each other, just in case the spectators want to see more.
 
Just because something is routine doesn't mean that it's planned out down to the T. Some guys have a few effects that they perform, but the order and everything they do pretty much depends on the flow of the show and the energy of the room or people they are performing for.

IE: if you have a routine, it simply means you have a few effects that you can build off of each other, just in case the spectators want to see more.
a lot of times it is.....i'm just giving a warning of not to do it....thats all...
 
May 25, 2009
6
0
Advice

Its always hard to give advice of this nature. I can say the recent urge of yours to perform is going to be the best step in your learning process that will make you a better magician. Some times its best to go with your instinct and develop your own way. Its the best method to develop. What you should think about doing is developing patter for all of your choosen effects and then trying to find a middle ground between each of them and suprisingly enough it will come easier than you think.

You might seem nervious about looking stupid without a plan. But the first performance I did went very well and I didnt develp any staged patter as a whole before the show. If you wing it you will understand all the things you did right and also understand what it is you need to do different and just as well all the things you should never do again.

The best thing for you is to get your feet wet.
 
Jan 1, 2009
2,241
3
Back in Time
a lot of times it is.....i'm just giving a warning of not to do it....thats all...

A warning for what? That if you have a planned routine that people will be on to you or something? Most pro's have routines because it makes the show go by smoother, they don't have to worry about trying to remember everything and if you are smart enough, you can make the routine look spontaneous.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Hey breh, we get caught up in routines so much....i don't like to use routines...when you routine your effects, you become gimmicky or staged....you do not want to be like a movie, meaning whats plan is what going to happen. That tends to make your performance lack orginality....

Speaking as a filmmaker, did you just diss movies?

And since apparently scripting kills originality, I suppose that's also a dig on theater. And any song that isn't completely improvised.

Jesus...

Anyway, the only real way to hone material is to actually perform it. In the process, it will act as a crucible allowing you to burn away and shed what doesn't work, thus purifying what does. For this to work though you must be able to step out of your head after a performance and ask, "Okay, what was good there? What worked? What didn't work so well and what can I do about it?"
 
I can never truely think and be creative when I'm in a completely comfortable situation, such as my house.

Try going out to a mall somewhere and setting up your laptop or notepad and paper in the food court area, or a coffee shop if you don't want too much ambiant background chatter. Bookstores are also great (such as Barns and Nobles or Borders) because they are quiet, often have little caffees in them and double as an incredible source of referance material.

Once in your "spot" open your word processing program, or notepad and just let it flow. Write down anything, and everything. Draw arrows that connect thoughts together if they don't come out of your head in an ordered fashion. Start scripting, writing, and creating.

Once you have something workable, either film it for a closed audience (I'm not talking about youtube here folks) and review, edit, tweek, and improve, or talk to a bar, club, or theater house in your local area and see if they will let you do a night a week to display your show. Repeat the above process as desribed with the film.

Everything else steer said pretty much then applies. You will just learn by doing. There really isn't any other way.
 
Dec 14, 2007
817
2
And this is the danger of the internet:

Anyone can offer advice and there is no accountability. (I call this the Steerpike Syndrome - but that's just me.)

Someone, like Cedric, can say anything and walk away. Sadly, someone who might be more thoughtful about their work may choose to read it and assume it is advice worth taking.

I can appreciate the passion and enthusiasm from so many people new to the art, but if you want real advice as to what works in the real world, do you ask the traveler who has been to the mountain and back or the guy still in his parent's front yard?

Now, before we play the ad hominem cards, I am not suggesting that I have been to the mountain and back. But I do know who Mike Skinner was, what he thought about routining, and can evaluate those opinions against not only my personal experiences, but against the experiences of thousands of other magicians as recorded in the texts of our art.

The problem is, many magicians today (especially young ones) think that "their" experience is a valid one simply because they had it.

Many doctors operated on patients in the 1800's without washing their hands. When evidence was presented to suggest that hand washing was "best practice" they recoiled insisting that "they have been operating with their washed hands for years, why should they change."

Of course, now we know.

So, my advice (ironic, I know) is to be very careful from whom you accept advice.

How many years have they been performing in front of paid audiences?
How many shows have they done?
How many repeat clients have they had?
Are they magic dealers claiming to be "performers?"
Are they "creators" who make up magic solely to sell, or have others made a living off of their material in the real world?
What does the person offering the advice know about the history of ideas in our art?
Can they back up their "opinions" with references to succesful and established magicians and their philosophies?
If they revel in forging new paths, can they at least describe what the old one's were, who advocated them, why and what they hope to achieve by doing something different?
And how old are they and how old are the people they are working for?

I know, that last one is touchy. But let's face it, with time comes experience.

You are all aware I am sure of Penn's Flight Time theory. This is just an extension. Just from getting older and dealing with new issues does one's perspective begin to change. While I would never discredit a person solely because they are young, the fact is, that person has not had enough experience in order to offer advice based on anything other than passion and arrogance.

Brad Henderson
 
Dec 14, 2007
817
2
Nothing. You are just an excellent example of someone who gives a lot of advice/states dogmatic opinions without anything more than the assumption that their experiences/desires/outlooks are universal to back them up. Many do that here. You, however, stand out because of your post count.

Regardless, I would encourage people to consider the questions raised at the end of my previous post before choosing to give weight to ANYONE's opinion.
 
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